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uphereinmytree
15-Jan-2016, 15:59
I started using a horseman universal zoom finder i picked up cheap. It seems to be be very inaccurate. Maybe someone who uses one of these could enlighten me. It has a 4x5 mask and when dialing in a focal length in the 4x5 scale, it's just wrong. I had a 200mm imagon lens mounted and needed to set the viewfinder at 135mm to get the same frame.

maybe it's been misassembled? With the mask removed, and when dialed to 90mm, the inside element is racked completely forward as far as it could go. I haven't given it an in depth workout, but with a 250mm lens mounted, correct frameing is found at 180mm on the dial. Thanks for any insights

uphereinmytree
21-Mar-2016, 10:52
I came across a second 4x5 horseman zoom finder to add to my test study. This new one is also inaccurate. with a 210 mounted on a non-horseman camera, correct framing in the viewfinder is found at 150mm on the finder dial.

My first thought was user error, but i've tried every way to use the finder and can't find my own error. for example, finder placed on lens plane vs. film plane etc.

maybe I'm crazy, but I can't imagine attaching this to a horseman camera and having proper results.

anyone using this finder for handheld pre-viewing??

Shootar401
21-Mar-2016, 11:36
I have two Linhof finder (the new model) and both are accurate.

Are you sure it's a 4x5 mask? I can't see Horseman being that badly built that it's off by that much.

Jac@stafford.net
21-Mar-2016, 12:19
I came across a second 4x5 horseman zoom finder to add to my test study. This new one is also inaccurate.

Just to be sure, this not actually a Gaoersi brand, is it?

uphereinmytree
21-Mar-2016, 14:05
It is a horseman brand and it does have the 4x5 mask. It is the second one I've tried with similar affect. I did just read in another forum thread where 2 people had mentioned the same thing. http://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/archive/index.php/t-3053.html

Seems ridiculous to me considering the price of these things new and I keep thinking I am doing something wrong.

Maybe I'll try a linhof finder. I'm not basic enough to use a cardboard cutout.

Jac@stafford.net
21-Mar-2016, 14:24
For all I can tell you are doing all the right things. At that point of frustration, it might be a good idea to chuck the Horseman.

I have a couple of the early style Linhof optical finders and they are very good, and often affordable. I never used the new style.
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Tin Can
21-Mar-2016, 14:46
I have one. I will check it soon. I have never used it.

Bill_1856
21-Mar-2016, 14:47
My "earlier" Linhof finder isn't too accurate, either, especially on the wide-angle end, and I've been told that the "late" models aren't too good on the long end (over 210mm).
My preferred finders are the Pacemaker/Super Graphic and match the masks to the GG image (I have all the many sizes of masks).

Tin Can
21-Mar-2016, 15:19
I just checked mine against a 90mm on 4x5 GG screen and they are close enough for me. Very close.

Mine was not cheap. It was a gift and that LFPF member has always given me nearly perfect everything.

Thank you benefactor!

Jac@stafford.net
21-Mar-2016, 17:04
Just to refer good past technology, a good wire frame composer actually works quite well.
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Tin Can
21-Mar-2016, 17:12
I prefer the wire as it allows one to see the action as it enters the frame, thus the old name of 'Sports Finder'!

It's also not expensive fragile glass.



Just to refer good past technology, a good wire frame composer actually works quite well.
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Jac@stafford.net
21-Mar-2016, 17:42
I prefer the wire as it allows one to see the action as it enters the frame, thus the old name of 'Sports Finder'!

Yes, and another clever thing was the Hasselblad sports finder that projected the focus spot as we looked through the wire frame finder. Another was an air-to-air 4x5 with FP shutter that used periscope focusing. Can provide details if needed.
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Tin Can
21-Mar-2016, 17:55
Jac, you know I always want more details. Please!


Yes, and another clever thing was the Hasselblad sports finder that projected the focus spot as we looked through the wire frame finder. Another was an air-to-air 4x5 with FP shutter that used periscope focusing. Can provide details if needed.
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Jac@stafford.net
21-Mar-2016, 18:53
Jac, you know I always want more details. Please!

My pleasure! Here is a page that shows the Hasselblad finder. Note how the eyepiece is directed onto the focusing screen, and one can still see the sport view frames. http://www.clubhasselblad.com/hasselblad-prism-sports-viewfinder

The air-to-air 4x5 was a Peckham Wray. http://www.digoliardi.net/peckham-wray-1.jpg Focusing was through the little prism-sight on the top which only showed a bit of the center of the image. Framing was by the obvious frame just to the right. When you pressed the expose button the little internal mirror flipped up and the focal plane shutter fired. Not split-second stuff.

I can supply more pictures of the Peckham, but seriously it has been jailed in its original leather case to the outdoor porch to air out since I got it long ago because it is toxic! No kidding. When I got I noticed its unfamiliar smell which I could also taste. I left it by my bed when I went to sleep and I was so sick the next day. It might be coincidence, but considering it came from a diabolical British military base (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Porton_Down) that killed recruits in its experiments, I don't trust it one bit.

When our weather improves, I can take it outside in the breeze, take it apart and make good photos.

Thanks for your interest, Randy Moe.

ic-racer
21-Mar-2016, 19:00
No discussion of sportsfinders is complete without mention of the Rolleimeter; Rangefinder adapter...
148656

...and the built-in sportsfinder with the peekhole in which you could view the ground glass to focus (similar to the Hassleblad mentioned above).
However, due to two mirrors in the light path, the image, is not only reversed left-to-right, it is upside down also (the normal view on this forum).
148657

Tin Can
21-Mar-2016, 19:07
All very interesting. I got a couple Linhof wire finders. One has 3 folding objectives. The other 2. They fit anything with a cold shoe and were cheap as nails. I did buy them. I use them on a variety of formats and lenses. They even adjust for parallax distance.

Jac@stafford.net
21-Mar-2016, 19:27
All very interesting. I got a couple Linhof wire finders. One has 3 folding objectives. The other 2. They fit anything with a cold shoe and were cheap as nails. I did buy them. I use them on a variety of formats and lenses. They even adjust for parallax distance.

Yep, i have them as well. I like the red glass bead dot. Good old ignored technology - that works!

uphereinmytree
23-Mar-2016, 05:44
So the horseman zoom finder is easy to disassemble. I adjusted the gearing so that 210 on the dial corresponds to a 210mm lens. Now it's correct at that point , but still inaccurate throughout most of it's range. It's Easy to reset to factory build if needed. I hope the engineer that designed this finder lost his job.


Can anyone confirm that the newer linhof zoom finder is more accurate through it's range?

Corran
23-Mar-2016, 13:01
I've used the new Linhof finder a lot on my Linhof as well as on other cameras and it's really accurate. Surprisingly accurate - I usually frame a bit loose expecting inaccuracy but generally it's dead-on, unless I forget to properly set the parallax correction distance.

yeolde
24-Jan-2022, 05:30
My finder shows blurred edges of the 6x9 mask while seeing thru. Can anyone confirm?