Certotrop 9x12cm

[f/stopblues]

Hello!

I have this Certotrop 9x12cm camera I picked up because, frankly, it's pretty. :) I haven't done much with it so far but I do have a couple questions. I haven't been able to find a whole lot of info so far.

- Are there any sources for film in this size? I've found a Foma offering but it's on backorder at the moment. Is cutting down 4x5 the best choice?
- Can anyone explain this ground glass situation? Do I just focus on the ground glass then replace the back with a film holder?
- I have some sort of pack film holder (still has really old Tri-X in it). Is there any way to use it without the original film packs?

Thanks for the info!
Chris

[Steven Tribe]

9x12cm is still a standard internet order item from a couple of German organisations. They also have the other standard metric sizes available (13x18 and 18x24cm).

Your proposed use of the GG insert is correct! Film pack holders can always be used a wet plate holders or as back-up GG.

[Jac@stafford.net]

Your proposed use of the GG insert is correct! Film pack holders can always be used a wet plate holders or as back-up GG.

Steve, were there not film holder sleeves that went into the original plate holders?

[leighmarrin]

Hi, Chris: I have the same camera as you, but mine is marked "BeeBee". It was imported into the US by Burleigh Brooks. Which lens/shutter combo do you have? Mine is a 135mm F4.5 Tessar in a Compur shutter. For more info see: http://camera-wiki.org/wiki/Certotrop

In the US, Freestyle, B&H and DigitalTruth.com have recently listed 9x12cm film. The current B&H web page says Foma 100 9x12 film is available as a "special order", with a 2 to 4 week delivery time.

I've read that it's possible to use a pack holder as a single-load sheet film holder by filling up the space in the back of it, but have not tried it.

There are many different variants of 9x12cm film/plate holders, but happily yours takes the most common type. Holders that fit the Zeiss Maximar, Kodak Nagel/Recomar, and Voigtlander Avus will also fit your Certotrop.

Most 9x12cm holders are for glass plates, and need an extra film sheath to correctly position sheet film. However, Kodak-branded holders will fit both plates and sheet film without needing an extra sheath. Watch eBay or try Pacific Rim for 9x12cm holders. (Although there were a few double-sided 9x12cm holders made for this style of camera, the vast majority are single-sided.)

In the US 9x12cm metal sheet film hangers for open tank development are not common. However, the easily-found Jobo 2521 tank and 2509 reel will develop six sheets of 4x5, 9x12cm or 6x9cm sheet film. Jobo intends it for rotary processing, but myself and others have used it for inversion with good results, using 10 minutes or longer developing times.

[IanG]

Steve, were there not film holder sleeves that went into the original plate holders?

There were and they aren't too hard to find. I bought a pack of9x12 Kodak film inserts NIB last year.

Ian

[Jac@stafford.net]

There were and they aren't too hard to find. I bought a pack of9x12 Kodak film inserts NIB last year.

I suspect you find them easily because of your location. I found mine by accident

[IanG]

I suspect you find them easily because of your location. I found mine by accident

Actually mine were made in the US :D by Eastman Kodak, as were the similar NIB Quarter plate film inserts I bought from the same person. Kodak sold a lot in the US for use with their Nagel Recommars as well as other 9x12 cameras. They are listed in a 1941 (war time) Kodak Ltd Professional Catalogue I have.

Ian

[plaubel]

Love this old 9x12cm ladies..
I took an original film/plateholder and glued an old rollfilm holder onto, after cutting a 6x9cm whole into the plateholder

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[plaubel]

I don't like the original filmholders and the fiddling with them and the GG.
So I replaced the "filmholder-holders" by a 9x12cm back from a monorail camera in one case, and I builded a kind of international wooden back, 4x5inch, in another case ( no pics at thistime, sorry).
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For me, the Ortho 25 film from Maco is a good idea for this 9x12 cameras and their old lenses.

[IanG]

I have 6 or 7 9x12 cameras, by chance they all use the same plate holders, I don't have a problem using single dark-slide holders and film inserts, Altough I do need to restore more of my holders :D

In addition I've just swapped 4 5x4 DDS film holders for some modern 9x12's which I'll use with my Postcard sized compact Graflex when I restore the sutter

Ian

[IanG]

I didn't see the OP's deleted post about value.

These cameras vary a lot in the price they fetch, I can buy them in excellent condition for quite low prices and on a very regular basis, less than $70, that's about the maximum I've paid for all my 9x12 cameras and most have excellent lenses and shutters.

Yes I've bought at the low end of the price range, some people will pay more but some pay far too much as they are uneducated. I'll make sure each camera I have has a set of plate holders and film inserts so that if they are ever sold they are usable and where necessary restored.

Ian

[f/stopblues]

My apologies for the price inquiry! Thanks everyone for all the info.. this has been very helpful. I really like the dimensions of this format and it folds up *so* much smaller than my Speed Graphic, which is a godsend for backpacking (LF and backpacking don't play well together)

If there is film already loaded in my plate holders would it be safe to assume the film sheath is included? What does it look like?

Has anyone here tried to adapt another lens to this? I'm quite fond of projection lenses, but this bayonet mount is pretty unique.

Thanks for the tip on the Maco film, too. I hadn't discovered that one yet.

[f/stopblues]

After some poking and prodding, it turns out the film sheath is pretty self evident (see photo). :)

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[Jac@stafford.net]

After some poking and prodding, it turns out the film sheath is pretty self evident (see photo). :)

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Self evident, I guess! Just as Ian wrote, too. This is an encouraging thread.

[Steven Tribe]

It is pretty self-evident that if the set contains a film pack back, then the plate holders will also have sheaths mounted!

Folding 9x12s ( and 10x15 and 13x18) are great fun and cost little apart from the Voigtlander Bergheil/Alpin and KW models. Using other lenses is possible, especialy the later models which have a front standard that had to carry an F4.5 rather than F6.8.

We must be eternally grateful that Kodak Eastmann printed so much info on these sheaths so that Ebay listings are correct!

[IanG]

Those are the holders I'm using.


My apologies for the price inquiry! Thanks everyone for all the info.. this has been very helpful. I really like the dimensions of this format and it folds up *so* much smaller than my Speed Graphic, which is a godsend for backpacking (LF and backpacking don't play well together)


That Certotrop is quite large by 9x12 standards :D

Here's a 9x12 Patent Etui alongside a Rodenstock (Welta) camera about the same size as your Certo

http://lostlabours.co.uk/photography/cameras/images/etui03_sm.jpg

and alongside a Crown Graphic and Ikonta 520

http://lostlabours.co.uk/photography/cameras/images/etui06.jpg.

You'll find 9x12 is an interesting addictive format, the downside is lack of tilt compared to a Pacemaker Speed or Crown Graphic but the portability. It's worth looking out for a Rollex or Rada 120 back, make sure it's not a 620 though, I find them for less than $20 quite frequently, again watch the dge fit.

Ian