Proper Agitation for Dip and Dunk hangers

[Amfooty]

Good afternoon all,

What is the best method for agitating with hangers in a tank? I have some 8x10 that I want to develop, and I have 8x10 hangers and a 2L tank. The past few trys have been with x-ray film which worked, but there were still some issues--namely the shape of the hanger showing up on the negative.

I'm going to be developing Foma 400@400 in Sprint Systems 1:9 (D76), so the time is going to be around 11min instead of the 6 with the x-ray.

Thanks for the help!

[Ian Gordon Bilson]

Kodaks recommendation has always worked for me.
Lift hanger clear of solution. Tilt to left,allow to drain (a couple of seconds). Immerse holder. Lift and drain,tilted to right.
Immerse. A lift slightly and drop to avoid airbells, if you are so inclined. Hanger stays vertical throughout.

[Duolab123]

Kodaks recommendation has always worked for me.
Lift hanger clear of solution. Tilt to left,allow to drain (a couple of seconds). Immerse holder. Lift and drain,tilted to right.
Immerse. A lift slightly and drop to avoid airbells, if you are so inclined. Hanger stays vertical throughout.

This is how I've done it for years, HC-110 Dil B replenished. Also XTOL replenished. Mostly 4x5 and 5x7 but works the same. 1 minute intervals

[Amfooty]

Tilt to left,allow to drain (a couple of seconds). Immerse holder. Lift and drain,tilted to right.
Immerse. A lift slightly and drop to avoid airbells, if you are so inclined. Hanger stays vertical throughout.

Agitate like that every minute, with 1 full minute initially?

[Duolab123]

Agitate like that every minute, with 1 full minute initially?

I always just agitated for the first 30 seconds, first 60 seconds would be OK too. When you get to the Fix the more you agitate the faster it goes.

[Randy]

Amfooty, good luck. I have yet to get what I consider an acceptable negative using 2ltr tanks, hangers for 8X10 X-ray film. I have done very, very slow and infrequent agitation, moderate, faster and more frequent (which gave me the best results) yet still can not get even negs with normal density at the edges. I have given up on processing with hangers, given up on multiple sheets in tray's due to scratching. My next attempt will be single sheets in trays agitating with a hake brush, then striping the back side.

[BetterSense]

I tried hangers but I sometimes got uneven development. Sometimes is too much, so I switched back to trays. If I am careful, I can avoid scratches in trays. Even when I was careful, sometimes I got uneven development with hangers. An astrophotographer once told me that brush development was the only way to ensure totally even development. I have heard good things about nitrogen burst as well.

[dsphotog]

Is it possible that the "imprint" of the hanger on your x-ray film isn't an agitation issue, but fogging from a not-so-safe safelight?
I've had that happen.
Just to eliminate the possibility, maybe try developing in dark.

[Andrew O'Neill]

For me, gentle agitation was key, and not pulling the hanging completely out of solution. If you're still getting surge marks, use trays. A lot of chemistry is required for tanks.

[Amfooty]

I'm going to be using normal film now, so it's going to be in the complete dark. Definitely going to try gentler agitation.

[Ian Gordon Bilson]

Agitate like that every minute, with 1 full minute initially?

Well,yes.
You need to get that thirsty,dry emulsion well acquainted with the developer. This,with any film I have used,benefits from a good 45+ seconds for the initial wet step. Up,Down,Up Down.Knock off airbells.
Agitation is applied for the rest of the development, from taste to experience, every 30sec (Kodak),to 60s (Ilford), stand develop 60minutes..

[Duolab123]

Well,yes.
You need to get that thirsty,dry emulsion well acquainted with the developer. This,with any film I have used,benefits from a good 45+ seconds for the initial wet step. Up,Down,Up Down.Knock off airbells.
Agitation is applied for the rest of the development, from taste to experience, every 30sec (Kodak),to 60s (Ilford), stand develop 60minutes..

This is Gospel, all this is in an old Kodak Darkroom Dataguide. Just to be clear the hangers I'm talking about are regular sheet film hangers Like Kodak 4a, (Carr) or equivalent. I'm not talking about x-ray hangers, or weighted film clips. Hangers and rubber tanks are so cheap make sure you get real hangers.

I've never had any issues, run six sheets of 4 x 5 at a time, with good hangers, in a 1/2 gallon Kodak (Ace) Hard rubber tank, you'll never have an issue, I use an empty tank to hold the loaded hangers, 1 for developer, 1 for stop, 1 for Kodak rapid fix w/hardener, 1 for hypo clearing agent and 1 for wash (5 min after Hypo clear).

Film has been developed this way for a 100 years, before all the gizmos. The only guys with gaseous burst set ups were big time or stationed on a Battleship in WWII:D

[Luis-F-S]

Good afternoon all,

What is the best method for agitating with hangers in a tank? I have some 8x10 that I want to develop, and I have 8x10 hangers and a 2L tank. The past few trys have been with x-ray film which worked, but there were still some issues--namely the shape of the hanger showing up on the negative.

If it's a stainless tank hopefully it's a 4 liter tank and you have at least 4 of them (presoak, developer, stop bath & fixer). I have 6 one gal tanks in my water jacket setup so I have water between the stop and fixer plus an extra water at the end to hold. Don't allow to drain when you lift, that causes streaks! From my notes from Oliver Gagliani's workshop; presoak film for 3 min, drain, then into the developer with constant agitation for the first 60 sec. There are 3 hanger motions: raise to the left and replace, raise straight up and replace, raise to the right & replace. Each motion should take 2 sec; 1 sec up then 1 sec to replace. Then agitate for 10 sec each minute after the first. Then 30 sec in stop bath and 3 minutes in fixer with constant agitation. Use one shot developer and throw it away, don't replentish; reuse the fixer. I get even development without any issues. L

141184

[Tin Can]

I like my 1970's system. Straight out of Calumet Catalog.

Or save money and buy from http://www.alistairinglis.com/.

What I like, I can turn on lights in-between solutions and not watch any clocks. The bubbles are relaxing.

The fix tank is always full. I check potency after each use and count films done.

I also clean water stop, developer tanks, then refill them with water. Ready and waiting.

When I want to develop I simply dump 40 ml of Rodinal in and stir. One shot.

It does 4-8x10, 8-5x7, 16-4x5 very quickly. Very nicely.

I have no regret I built this system.

Follow this link to DIY Gas Burst.


http://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showthread.php?125056-GAS-BURST-Agitation-System-DIY&p=1273507&viewfull=1#post1273507

[Duolab123]

If it's a stainless tank hopefully it's a 4 liter tank and you have at least 4 of them (presoak, developer, stop bath & fixer). I have 6 one gal tanks in my water jacket setup so I have water between the stop and fixer plus an extra water at the end to hold. Don't allow to drain when you lift, that causes streaks! From my notes from Oliver Gagliani's workshop; presoak film for 3 min, drain, then into the developer with constant agitation for the first 60 sec. There are 3 hanger motions: raise to the left and replace, raise straight up and replace, raise to the right & replace. Each motion should take 2 sec; 1 sec up then 1 sec to replace. Then agitate for 10 sec each minute after the first. Then 30 sec in stop bath and 3 minutes in fixer with constant agitation. Use one shot developer and throw it away, don't replentish; reuse the fixer. I get even development without any issues. L

141184

VERY NICE, FREESTYLE IS BRINGING BACK 7 BATH E-6, FujiHunt, Due the end of the year! Your agitation technique is exactly as I remember the old Kodak books. Left, straight up, Right. If you are using multiple hangers, lift them all at once. I've got 3 1/2 gallon tanks with racks that hold 10 or 12 8x10 hangers, you can develop 48 sheets of 4 x5 on 4-ways, I've got a NEW in box Kodak Gaseous burst timer and valve, NEVER had enough film to use the stuff. It's fun to accumulate though. I like those 1 gallon tanks!!

[Duolab123]

I like my 1970's system. Straight out of Calumet Catalog.

Or save money and buy from http://www.alistairinglis.com/.

What I like, I can turn on lights in-between solutions and not watch any clocks. The bubbles are relaxing.

The fix tank is always full. I check potency after each use and count films done.

I also clean water stop, developer tanks, then refill them with water. Ready and waiting.

When I want to develop I simply dump 40 ml of Rodinal in and stir. One shot.

It does 4-8x10, 8-5x7, 16-4x5 very quickly. Very nicely.

I have no regret I built this system.

Follow this link to DIY Gas Burst.


http://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showthread.php?125056-GAS-BURST-Agitation-System-DIY&p=1273507&viewfull=1#post1273507

"The Force is Strong in This One" Just about the best set-up as I could think of.;)

[Amfooty]

If it's a stainless tank hopefully it's a 4 liter tank and you have at least 4 of them (presoak, developer, stop bath & fixer). I have 6 one gal tanks in my water jacket setup so I have water between the stop and fixer plus an extra water at the end to hold. Don't allow to drain when you lift, that causes streaks! From my notes from Oliver Gagliani's workshop; presoak film for 3 min, drain, then into the developer with constant agitation for the first 60 sec. There are 3 hanger motions: raise to the left and replace, raise straight up and replace, raise to the right & replace. Each motion should take 2 sec; 1 sec up then 1 sec to replace. Then agitate for 10 sec each minute after the first. Then 30 sec in stop bath and 3 minutes in fixer with constant agitation. Use one shot developer and throw it away, don't replentish; reuse the fixer. I get even development without any issues. L

141184

I gave it a shot today and the negatives turned out well! Thanks for the help!

[Bob Mann]

Let me add a plug for using IR goggles - I use the Viper - lets you see what you are doing. Well worth their cost.

[vinny]

VERY NICE, FREESTYLE IS BRINGING BACK 7 BATH E-6, FujiHunt, Due the end of the year! Your agitation technique is exactly as I remember the old Kodak books. Left, straight up, Right. If you are using multiple hangers, lift them all at once. I've got 3 1/2 gallon tanks with racks that hold 10 or 12 8x10 hangers, you can develop 48 sheets of 4 x5 on 4-ways, I've got a NEW in box Kodak Gaseous burst timer and valve, NEVER had enough film to use the stuff. It's fun to accumulate though. I like those 1 gallon tanks!!

Freestyle began to sell it but must not have ordered enough (seems to happen quite often there). Getting fuji to export stuff ain't easy.
Luis, he's using a 2L tank. It might be one of mine which holds two hangers, I dunno.

[bob carnie]

I have the same unit exept the tanks are a bit bigger ... I grew up with this system and have no hesitation to go back ... perfect for very large
film projects where you need to see a lot of film processed in a given time.

There is the possibiliy of surge marks on edges if you do not do good technique.


If it's a stainless tank hopefully it's a 4 liter tank and you have at least 4 of them (presoak, developer, stop bath & fixer). I have 6 one gal tanks in my water jacket setup so I have water between the stop and fixer plus an extra water at the end to hold. Don't allow to drain when you lift, that causes streaks! From my notes from Oliver Gagliani's workshop; presoak film for 3 min, drain, then into the developer with constant agitation for the first 60 sec. There are 3 hanger motions: raise to the left and replace, raise straight up and replace, raise to the right & replace. Each motion should take 2 sec; 1 sec up then 1 sec to replace. Then agitate for 10 sec each minute after the first. Then 30 sec in stop bath and 3 minutes in fixer with constant agitation. Use one shot developer and throw it away, don't replentish; reuse the fixer. I get even development without any issues. L

141184

[Jim Fitzgerald]

Let me add a plug for using IR goggles - I use the Viper - lets you see what you are doing. Well worth their cost.

Bob, I'm thinking I'll do just that.

[Duolab123]

Let me add a plug for using IR goggles - I use the Viper - lets you see what you are doing. Well worth their cost.

I will be checking this out my $60 Spy Net goggles work OK, but my glasses keep fogging up. I have a battery powered emergency back up aquarium pump coming, going to try to put air through them while I wear. Adds to the overall Delta Force look;)

I love them takes all the worry out of loading reels and holders.