Grafmatic : Pros and Cons?

[Drew Bedo]

I am trying to simplify my 4x5 traveling kit in bulk and weight. I use a Wista made Zone VI with Lisco double dark slide film holders.I am thinking of replacing the film holders with several Grafmatic magazines.

What are the Pros and Cons regarding overall bulk, weight, ease of use in shooting/reloading, quality of film flatness, light leaks and so on.

All remarks are welcome.

[Bill Burk]

A single Grafmatic weighs the same as four film holders. Accidentally opening the light slide will immediately fog the edge of all the film but will only ruin a couple sheets.

If you bring two, and accidentally re-use one... you double expose all the film on the trip.

[dave_whatever]

In terms of bulk a grafmatic takes up about half the volume of the 3 double-sided filmholders it replaces. Weight is probably similar to 3 holders.

Ease of use is fine, assuming all the septums and straight and unmolested - in which case they are very reliable. I've got 3 and have had no problems with leaks or flatness. However since you've got to put a bit of force through the unit when you rack the drawer in and out when advancing the film it pays to secure the back with graflok sliders in addition to just sliding it under the ground glass, if you camera allows it (my Chamonix does). This prevents you from accidentally pulling the whole thing away from the camera when advancing the film, and hence fogging the film. If you haven't got graflok sliders on your camera or they don't work when the ground glass is still attached then just be sure to hold it firmly in place when advancing the film.

Loading wise I find them a bit fiddly at first but once you get used to them they're no more difficult or time consuming than normal holders, on balance.

One downside is if you shoot 4 or5 shots on a grafmatic leaving 1 or 2 unexposed sheets to use on another day/session then that becomes disproportionately heavy and bulky compared to the single film holder that it effectively becomes. It does work very nicely though if you always shoot in multiples of 6 shots! Also works conveniently if you develop in bunches of 6 like in a Jobo 2500 tank.

Also works best if you're giving all sheets in the grafmatic the same development. Less convenient if you like to push/pull odd individual sheets, as you need to make a note somewhere and then be careful to identify that sheet when unloading.

[DrTang]

gotta shoot all six shots to process any of them is the only downside for me


I use them in 'the studio' with my TWR.. makes things go much faster and easier.. also..It's hard to double expose if you first check to see if it is on X

anyway.. I know that if I start a new one..I better have 5 more shots to take to finish it out for the session.

[Pete Roody]

I like them with an SLR camera like the Super D because you don't have to fiddle with holders and dark slides. Always ready to shoot.

[Drew Bedo]

All good stuff here; thanks everyone.

On "anothrr site" there was a remark referring to potential light leaks and "non standard" back focus distance. Haven't read any remarks on those items, so I suspect they are sourious issues.

[AuditorOne]

I use mine a lot and have experienced the following problems.

1. Light leaks when I get too ambitious about advancing film. Pulling the drawer too vigorously will dislodge the back from the camera. To prevent this, pull the ground glass holder from the camera and use the slides to lock the graphmatic in place.

2. Inconvenient to use your ground glass for focusing. Really intended to be used with the rangefinder or the SLR.

3. Easier to use in landscape than in portrait.

4. The septums that hold each sheet of film are a bit fragile and can bend easily. Once bent they must be replaced. (Unless you are really, really, really, really good at straightening bent sheet metal.)

5. I need to use all 6 films before I process. (I can pull unused sheets in a dark bag or darkroom if I really need to develop ahead of time.)

6. I often use more film with a graphmatic than I would with the standard film holders. (This is often good since I have more perspectives to choose from.)

7. I rarely use my standard film holders any longer. They sit around feeling unloved and gathering dust. (Not totally true as I use them with the Cambo.)

8. As with anything there is a learning curve. Practice using the graphmatic before you go out to use it.

9. I use my Crown like a big snapshot camera now that I have graphmatics. (Not sure this is really all that bad but thought I would list it anyways.)

[Kevin Crisp]

I use them often. I am very careful about using good septums, but the downside for me is occasional malfunctions and jambs. Not often, but it happens, then you have to deal with it. And as many as 6 exposures could be at stake. So I usually make sure I have a changing bag with me.

I think they index with focus (on a Canham and two Crown Graphics) perfectly. And you'd think dust would be a problem with all that loading and sliding and clacking going on but it isn't.

They are a snap to load once you get the hang of it and make sure that tab is in the right position when you start.

[Bob Salomon]

Back in the 80s Graflex was sold to a company in Florida and they were producing the Grafmatic holders and selling them to Linhof in Germany. Linhof had lots of problems with the holders, primarily scratching. Whenever they had a bad holder they would return it to Florida for replacement or credit. This became very burdomsome for both companies so eventually the Florida company decided not to sell to Linhof directly any more. So, since we were the American distributor for Linhof we then started buying them for Linhof and we would ship them to Linhof in bulk. However Linhof was still finding unacceptable defects and when the defect rate exceeded 70% we decided that the Grafmatics being produced then we're totally unacceptable and we ended up returning all of the ones that we had purchased for Linhof for credit and that was the end of Linhof selling Grafmatic holders
So be careful with there use. Especially for important jobs.

[AuditorOne]

What was causing the scratching Bob?

[Bob Salomon]

What was causing the scratching Bob?

Linhof never told us. Just that they were scratching. Since we were not involved in their marketing or sales in the USA we never looked into it further.

[StoneNYC]

Snip... However since you've got to put a bit of force through the unit when you rack the drawer in and out when advancing the film it pays to secure the back with graflok sliders in addition to just sliding it under the ground glass, if you camera allows it (my Chamonix does). This prevents you from accidentally pulling the whole thing away from the camera when advancing the film, and hence fogging the film...snip

OMG is that what those are for?? I always thought they were only for using those roll film adapters that require you to remove the GG to attach... I never realized the sliders would work on holders WHILE the GG was in place.

Thanks!

[Jim Noel]

gotta shoot all six shots to process any of them is the only downside for me


I use them in 'the studio' with my TWR.. makes things go much faster and easier.. also..It's hard to double expose if you first check to see if it is on X

anyway.. I know that if I start a new one..I better have 5 more shots to take to finish it out for the session.

Exposing all sheets prior to developing those which have been exposed is not necessary. In the darkroom open the Grafmatic, remove the exposed sheets, replace the now empty sheaths and close the holder.

[EdSawyer]

I find them great, I have 6 of them, and other than the initial cleaning they all need, removing the number wheel, and a lubrication job, there's really no downsides. I wish they were cheaper and were still being made but other than that, they are great.

[StoneNYC]

I find them great, I have 6 of them, and other than the initial cleaning they all need, removing the number wheel, and a lubrication job, there's really no downsides. I wish they were cheaper and were still being made but other than that, they are great.

And here I am REPLACING the number wheels from the holders people had removed them, somehow I was able to track down two spare wheels someone had and dissembled mine and installed the wheels.... Stop taking them out! :)

[Sirius Glass]

And here I am REPLACING the number wheels from the holders people had removed them, somehow I was able to track down two spare wheels someone had and dissembled mine and installed the wheels.... Stop taking them out! :)

I use the number wheels too and I will not buy a Grafmatic without one.
I find the Grafmatics take some getting used to but a whole lot few problems than with the two film sheet holders.

[Henry Ambrose]

If you are shooting a lot of film at one set-up Grafmatics are wonderful. Especially if you want to shoot fast as in a group portrait. Also great for walking around handheld work with your Speed Graphic. If your photography calls for one or two shots per set-up then regular film holders may be more convenient. Its a lot easier to keep up with which film was shot how and when using regular holders. When that does not matter I much prefer Grafmatics.

[Tim Meisburger]

Well, just for a different perspective, I had one and never loved it. It was fiddly, and not really lighter than normal holders, and the six shot thing was restricting rather than liberating. I have a Crown Graphic, but never seemed to get into the LF rangefinder thing (I have a working XA), and my other (main) camera at the time was my first Ikeda Anba, and the Grafmatic was hard to mount, and working it on that very light 4x5 felt like it was stressing the entire camera body. In the end I sold it, and seem quite happy with regular holders. If Grafmatics were significantly lighter or significantly more compact I might feel differently, but they are not.

[StoneNYC]

I've physically weighted them, a single grafmatic is lighter than 3 fidelity holders.

I would venture to guess that maybe 3 Chamonix 4x5 holders might be slightly lighter than the graphmatics, but I don't own any that small so I can't say for sure.

It's more the space savings that's really the benefit.

OP, good luck! Give one a try! :)

I might sell one of mine, I can't get the wheel in it, someone broke the spoke that holds it when they ripped it out improperly instead of just dissembling it and lifting it out...

Do I really need 4 of them? That's 24 sheets! In a day that's a lot to shoot!

[David A. Goldfarb]

I have lots of them in 4x5" and 2x3" and I like them, mainly because they are a compact way of carrying a lot of film. I like the number wheels, which make it easier to line up film with notes after processing.

Kinematics hold 10 sheets, so they are even more compact, but they can be fiddly and are less solid than Grafmatics, but I still use them with caution, because it's 20 sheets in two holders.

You can take out sheets for processing before you use up the whole pack, but if I know I'll only need 1-4 sheets, I'll use regular filmholders.

I haven't had too many double exposure issues, and I suspect the likelihood isn't particularly greater than with regular holders, where you might inadvertantly put the darkslide back wrong side out, and make the same error by different means.

[Mark Sampson]

I found, that with a lightweight camera/tripod, the effort required to advance the film would move the camera. Better suited for handheld use. Maybe with a heavy monorail on a big tripod that wouldn't be a problem, but I sold my Grafmatics and won't go back to them. Too bad film pack has been gone for so long!

[Corran]

I was given a Grafmatic free a few months ago that was NIB, never used. I ended up liking it a lot more than I thought. It is certainly awesome for when I'm shooting my Linhof handheld. I ended up buying 3 more for much less than you see them offered, all in pretty good condition. They work for me for landscape work so I can pack less.

I hold the back of my Chamonix tight when I advance the sheet. I haven't had any light-leak issues. On the Linhof it's rock-solid and I can rocket through exposures.

[DrTang]

Kinematics huh? 10 sheets?

perfect..I can process 10 sheets at once in a 3006 if I tape two sheets together on the backside

so those might make more sense to me

[StoneNYC]

Kinematics huh? 10 sheets?

perfect..I can process 10 sheets at once in a 3006 if I tape two sheets together on the backside

so those might make more sense to me

Or just use a 3010

[agregov]

Anyone have advice on how to clean and lube Grafmatic holders?

[StoneNYC]

Anyone have advice on how to clean and lube Grafmatic holders?

Don't...

Really, I'm sure some would but besides cleaning from dust/grime, I wouldn't lube them. That's asking for trouble. My opinion anyway.

[Kodachrome25]

Kinematics huh? 10 sheets?

perfect..I can process 10 sheets at once in a 3006 if I tape two sheets together on the backside

so those might make more sense to me

I had two of those, they took a good bit more force to advance than properly working grafmatics, so I sold them. And for that reason, I don't use the Grafmatics hardly at all, it just moves the camera around too much for my liking and stirs up more dust than a cleaning lady.

I keep them around thinking of portrait shoots, but in all honestly I never use 4x5 for that either, much prefer my Hasselblads.

If someone came out with some incredible composite super easy to operate solution, man...I would love that for the high country, but Grafmatics as they are, I just never really took to them.

[Paul Ewins]

Anyone have advice on how to clean and lube Grafmatic holders?

A small amount of bicycle chain lubricant (not oil) on the sides of the tray where it slides along the exterior shell. I had "Ice Wax" recommended to me and it does the job. Spray a small amount on (it comes out of the can as a foam) then wipe it off so that it leaves just a small film. Nothing at all inside. Nothing on the septum or anywhere where it might come in contact with film.

[cikaziva]

i had several of them in different times of my life and i never liked them. two main reasons:
1) shooting with faster lenses i find them not perfectly i focus. i tried to shim my Ground Glass to one hlder but then another holder is off. no tow are alike. when you flip septum's, then everything changes again. normally at aperutre 16 you want see the difference but shooting 2.5 and 4 its really problematic. then the main question is.
2) if i dont use them for Hand haled work, why do i need them in a first place. only reason to shoot them in a feald is to bring a lot of film in a small packing space. but for there i need 4 of them. and they get heavy! si what i gain in bulk i pay in weight. using just one or two Grafmatics never made scene to me (aside from SLR and Handheld)

finally i find them messy, dirty and hard to keep clean. somehow they are dust traps. perhaps i am too anal abut my regular workflow! usually my holders are Toyo that i keep in ziplocks, i clean them with antistatic brush, use 3010 tank and gravty works washer... normally i don't see a scratch on my negs. with a Grafmatic there is always some thing, scratch, light leak, dust... so i got rid of thrm all and i stooped picking them up any more

[Drew Bedo]

Thank You all. This thread is a solid resource of experiential information on Grafmatics and will help me.

The Grafmatic design is rooted in the manufacturing tradition of the Depression and WW-II era. I would hope that someone with modern CAD/CAM and 3-D printing expertise will one day bring us a light weight Grafmatic inspired film magazine for this 21st Century.

[richardman]

I used one may be for 12-18 sheets with the Chamonix Saber. However, I feel that I am either making mistakes or on the verge of making them enough times as it is, and I don't want to introduce something that adds to the stress and uncertainty. I can imagine that it would be really nice on an SLR though.

[Drew Bedo]

I just had a thought:

Grafmatics are mostly metal . . .how well do they protect film from X-Rays in transit?

[cuypers1807]

Mine are all slowly starting to have problems. I have a few that must be tilted up to shuffle. I use them in my Razzle but would not recommend them for regular 4x5 cameras.

[David A. Goldfarb]

Thank You all. This thread is a solid resource of experiential information on Grafmatics and will help me.

The Grafmatic design is rooted in the manufacturing tradition of the Depression and WW-II era. I would hope that someone with modern CAD/CAM and 3-D printing expertise will one day bring us a light weight Grafmatic inspired film magazine for this 21st Century.

That would be the Fuji Quickchange system. It was not sold as a reloadable system--the idea being that you bought a holder and a preloaded cartridge of I think 6 or 8 sheets--but it was in fact not difficult to reload, as I understand it. It was expensive to purchase without reloading, but wasn't very profitable for Fuji, if users were buying it to reload likely with other manufacturers' film, so it only lasted a few years before it was discontinued.

[StoneNYC]

I just had a thought:

Grafmatics are mostly metal . . .how well do they protect film from X-Rays in transit?

I wouldn't leave them loaded when flying on a plane, I think the strange metal would only mean multiple scans by some overzealous TSA agent if that's what you mean?

But I mean, I've left them loaded with 400 speed film and traveled about and no damage was done, unless you meant IR light? In which I can testify with EFKE IR 820 they were completely light right.

Or I'm no understanding what you're asking.

[luis a de santos]

I have accumulated a total of 60 of these things.I had more but I have kept only the pristine ones .I simply kept the septums for replacement and threw the rest away.
I found that if you are careful with them they will last for ever.
With minor problems like some ocasional double exposure(my fault not the grafmatic) or pulling the slide too hard allowing some light leak, they are wonderful.

I mark them with a red dot, a blue dot and a black dot and use them for transparency, negative color and BW.

I have not calculated wight ratios with regular film holders but to me there is a no brainer to use them.Simple, efficient and fast.

I can not remember a time when I left a film unexposed.I use all the septums for each particular shoot.I feel that if you have to think about
shooting less film you are better off shooting digital.

I am also curios about what Linhof called scratching.Was it film scratching,equipment scratching ?

I could not live without them and I will encorage anybody shooting 4x5 to use them.

Best

Luis

[Corran]

60?! Wow.

[StoneNYC]

I have accumulated a total of 60 of these things.I had more but I have kept only the pristine ones .I simply kept the septums for replacement and threw the rest away.
I found that if you are careful with them they will last for ever.
With minor problems like some ocasional double exposure(my fault not the grafmatic) or pulling the slide too hard allowing some light leak, they are wonderful.

I mark them with a red dot, a blue dot and a black dot and use them for transparency, negative color and BW.

I have not calculated wight ratios with regular film holders but to me there is a no brainer to use them.Simple, efficient and fast.

I can not remember a time when I left a film unexposed.I use all the septums for each particular shoot.I feel that if you have to think about
shooting less film you are better off shooting digital.

I am also curios about what Linhof called scratching.Was it film scratching,equipment scratching ?

I could not live without them and I will encorage anybody shooting 4x5 to use them.

Best

Luis

You threw the bodies away!!!!! Cmon man that's ... Well, at least give them away for spare parts to someone else, don't trash them.

And 60? Do you go through 60 of them in a day? That's insane? What's your process? What do you shoot? Etc.

[pasiasty]

Don't...

Really, I'm sure some would but besides cleaning from dust/grime, I wouldn't lube them. That's asking for trouble. My opinion anyway.

Exactly, they are designed to work dry, such us most of diaphragms an shutters are. I use a cloth soaked with thinner or (someone will kill me now) with WD40. Especially when using the latter, wiping down until no traces of the liquid remains is crucial.

[Sirius Glass]

Grafmatics work well for hand held photography and that is what they were designed for. If one is going to do ground glass focusing then a Grafmatic might not be the best film transport.

I also process all my 4"x5" film in the Jobo Expert 3010 Drum.

[EdSawyer]

For cleaning, there's 6 or 8 screws that come out - all very easy. Then the whole body slides out of the shell. That allows cleaning the light trap and other internal parts, and retensioning the springs if needed (rare). For lubrication, I sometimes use some 3-in-1 oil on the internal sliding surfaces between the cartridge and the shell. Icewax is another decent choice. Graphite would probably be best but it tends to be dusty and migrates. WD40 is not a lubricant really, so I'd avoid that. One could also likely use a paraffin-based wax or something similar but again I'd be worried about migration of that.

[agregov]

Thanks for the tips on cleaning. For now I think I'll focus on using a simple damp cloth and remove the screws to get to the innards to wipe everything down. I've had several jams where for whatever reason the septums didn't advance/retreat correctly. The holder would basically get stuck in the "out" position. Really awkward to deal with in the field and trying to save previously exposed images.

Aside for 2-3 jams, I've liked using Grafmatics a lot over the past 10 months. I initially started using them with a Chamonix Saber but since moved to using them with an Arca field. I usually travel with both cameras allowing handheld and multi-lens, tripod mounted 4x5 shooting. Having film magazines for b&w and color film moving between two camera systems has been really great. If there's one pet peeve I've had with Grafmatics is you don't get a clean full border around the 4x5 neg. It's a bit of a dirty border. Also, the imprint of the image counter on the neg sometimes gets in the way of some images with tight framing. But for the most part, it hasn't been a big issue. The only other issue for me were scratches on the neg. I mostly got rid of scratches by being very cautious loading and unloading the septums in a changing tent.

One last note, with a class some years ago we visited Bruce Barnbaum's studio in WA state and he very enthusiastically uses Grafmatics. He picks up extras whenever he can to keep a good working set. Given the age of these things, it probably takes awhile to accumulate a good working batch.

[mdarnton]

I'm tempted just to make an offer to buy ones that don't work for pennies on the dollar, however. . . . . my experience so far is that when they jam with the box out cycling film to the back, the problem is weak springs. You can see the offenders, two long leaf springs on each side under the edge on the long side when the box is out. Make them push harder and that fixes cycling problems.

I use Renaissance wax as a lubricant on film holder and Grafmatics. It goes on extremely thin and makes parts slippery. Great for the slides in film holders.

[EdSawyer]

I use mine with a Chamonix Saber also - it's a great combination, easily the lightest/most compact 4x5 around, I think (when folded up). THe only other maintenance thing to be aware of is sometimes the felt light trap needs to be re-glued. It's easy once it's apart.

Good tip re: the Renaissance wax.

You can easily remove the counter wheel, I did on all of mine, as it was annoying and added nothing in terms of function for me. It's a reversible mod, so no downside really.

It's not too hard to find decent ones for sale, just plan on disassembling and cleaning any you get and as long as septums are straight, the rest is pretty easy to overhaul. Going rate seems to be $50-100 for a good one.

[David A. Goldfarb]

I don't know if someone's mentioned it, but there was at one time a test of various filmholders in either Popular Photography or Modern Photography that showed that Grafmatics had better film flatness than standard filmholders, so that's an argument in their favor, even given the option of traditional filmholders.

[David Lindquist]

I don't know if someone's mentioned it, but there was at one time a test of various filmholders in either Popular Photography or Modern Photography that showed that Grafmatics had better film flatness than standard filmholders, so that's an argument in their favor, even given the option of traditional filmholders.

Do you think it might have been in View Camera magazine? That's my vague recollection (with an emphasis on vague).
David

[David A. Goldfarb]

Do you think it might have been in View Camera magazine? That's my vague recollection (with an emphasis on vague).
David

VC may have repeated the information, but that kind of bench testing was more characteristic of the earlier publications, well before VC began publication.

[EdSawyer]

It was in Camera and Darkroom, arguably the best photo magazine of it's day (Modern Photo was probably the best in it's day, but they didn't overlap much, if at all...)

Grafmatics were the best as far as film flatness.

It's covered here: http://www.largeformatphotography.info/holders.html

[Mark Sampson]

I believe that article was published in 'View Camera' in 1995 or so. I recall reading it there, and never looked at 'Camera and Darkroom' much at all. I expect the leaf springs in the Grafmatic help hold the septum in exactly the right spot. I can't say that my Grafmatic negs were noticeably any sharper than my negs made in regular holders, though.

[VictoriaPerelet]

Pros:
1. Working with people - one holder per pose. Takes about 1sec per exposure. I usually preload about 6-8 grafmatics before session. When last one is used - time for break.
2. One grafmatic - one Jobo reel, 6sheets. I use 4x5 reels and various jobo tanks/extensions.
3. They have Number imprints!

Cons:
1. They jam
2. No EXIF exposure data or GPS imprints:)


http://victoriasphoto.com/models/DebDeVine/big/color-1.jpg

I never hand hold camera. Use Foba stand in studio.