How to Use Horseman 6x9 RFH on Toyo45AII without Scratching Ground Glass?

[Andre Noble]

hello I bought a horseman roll film holder for my Toyo 4x5 Camera. it does not have the two side rails that the Toyo roll film holder has that keeps the ground glass surface off the back of the roll film holder. I have seen references to people being able to use to horseman roll film holder on the Toyo Camera. If so how is this possible?

[Old-N-Feeble]

I would sell that RFH and buy one for 4x5 Graflok.

[Chuck Pere]

You use a Horseman holder made for the 4x5. Remove the ground glass and use the sliders to hold the holder in place. Your holder must be for the 2x3 Horseman camera.

[Dan Fromm]

You use a Horseman holder made for the 4x5. Remove the ground glass and use the sliders to hold the holder in place. Your holder must be for the 2x3 Horseman camera.

Typo?

6x9 holders for 2x3 cameras don't fit 4x5 cameras. 6x9 holders for 4x5 cameras fit some 4x5 cameras.

[Old-N-Feeble]

Chuck didn't mean the OP needs a RFH for 2x3.:) He meant to convey the RFH that the OP currently has is apparently for 2x3 cameras but he needs one for 4x5 Graflok backs.

[Dan Fromm]

OnF, the OP may well have the right size of Horseman 6x9 roll holder. They were made in sizes to fit 2x3 and 4x5 Graflok backs. Chuck gave the right advice if the OP's camera has a removable focusing panel, then stepped on himself.

The Toyo roll holder mentioned by the OP is an insertion type that has what Toyo calls guide plates at each side. These hold the GG a little behind the holder's body to prevent scratching.

The Horseman roll holder mentioned by the OP is an imitation Linhof Super Rollex and is a clip-on type, not an insertion type, roll holder. Hence the OP's difficulties.

[Old-N-Feeble]

OnF, the OP may well have the right size of Horseman 6x9 roll holder. They were made in sizes to fit 2x3 and 4x5 Graflok backs. Chuck gave the right advice if the OP's camera has a removable focusing panel, then stepped on himself.

The Toyo roll holder mentioned by the OP is an insertion type that has what Toyo calls guide plates at each side. These hold the GG a little behind the holder's body to prevent scratching.

The Horseman roll holder mentioned by the OP is an imitation Linhof Super Rollex and is a clip-on type, not an insertion type, roll holder. Hence the OP's difficulties.

Thanks, Dan. It appears that the OP has a Horseman RFH for 6x9 cameras but perhaps I assume too much.

[ic-racer]

Pleese post Pictures or part numbers of the seeming incompatible components.

[Chuck Pere]

You are right Dan. I'm not thinking straight. A 2x3 Horseman RFH would just fall into the camera if you tried to slide it in. He's just trying to slide in a 4x5 RFH and that would be a tight fit if it fit at all. The Toyo 45A ground glass does come out similar to a Graphic. The use problem is having to remove the ground glass every time you want to use the RFH as opposed to the type that slide under the glass.

[Andre Noble]

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I tried slipping this holder underneath the Ground glass of my 4x5 Toyo . This horseman RFH does not have side rails like the equivalent Toyo RFH. (The side rails of the Toyo keep the Toyo ground class from contacting the back of the film back and prevent tearing up the frosted surface of the gg.. This horseman back has no side rails and I scratched my gg like a dummy.. But I hear of people using it somehow with the Toyo 4x5s.

[Old-N-Feeble]

That's a Graflok style roll film holder for 4x5 cameras. It should work perfectly with your Toyo camera. You remove the focus panel from the camera and lock the film holder in place with the slide locks.

EDIT: Wait a minute... is yours a Graflok style back or an older bail back?

[Andre Noble]

Hi O n F, I've had thistToyo for 17 years and I just figured out how to remove the ground glass frame without removing the graflok frame. All is well. Thanks for your help.

[Old-N-Feeble]

Glad to know it worked out. Good luck.

[jbenedict]

I cracked a GG of a 45A by putting a Horseman roll back in without removing the GG panel. An expensive mistake.
I have seen the Horseman back with rails to keep from contacting the GG but not very many of them.
Removing the GG panel is a little fiddly and it has to be put somewhere secure so it isn't dropped but that's how it works.

The Horseman works great on RF focussing cameras.