Lead pipes and processing film/paper

[Kirk Gittings]

I've owned the house I am in since 1978. It was built in the early 40s. From a previous owner I found out that previously he had replaced lead pipes with the galvanized. One of the DIY things I did when I first bought it was replace the galvanized pipes with copper with lead solder many of those (ones that supply drinking water) I have now been replaced too with the new lead free solder. Fairly recently I had the supply line from the street replaced. Because of a huge tree that grew over the supply line (removed for the pipe replacement) it was all twisted and bent. It was lead and was probably the original supply line. So just curious..........I'm not really asking about safety concerns, my wife is a food safety expert and we are pretty well versed in such.......

What affect, if any, might trace amounts of lead have had on film and paper processing?

[Peter De Smidt]

We have a lead line into our house. We've been told that since only cold water runs through that very little lead goes into the water. In addition, depending on the water in your area, the inside of the pipes get coated with a mineral deposit very quickly. So unless there's something unusual going on, the amount of lead in you water should be extremely small. I doubt that it has any noticeable effect on your film processing.

[Richard Wasserman]

Our previous house had a lead supply line which were very common in our area—homes built between 1875-1920s. Our town added something to the water that bonded with the lead pipes to prevent any problems.

[diversey]

We need measure the lead level in your house water and mimic it in our house because your films developed in your house are nicer.


I've owned the house I am in since 1978. It was built in the early 40s. From a previous owner I found out that previously he had replaced lead pipes with the galvanized. One of the DIY things I did when I first bought it was replace the galvanized pipes with copper with lead solder many of those (ones that supply drinking water) I have now been replaced too with the new lead free solder. Fairly recently I had the supply line from the street replaced. Because of a huge tree that grew over the supply line (removed for the pipe replacement) it was all twisted and bent. It was lead and was probably the original supply line. So just curious..........I'm not really asking about safety concerns, my wife is a food safety expert and we are pretty well versed in such.......

What affect, if any, might trace amounts of lead have had on film and paper processing?

[Eric Woodbury]

Do you have chlorinated water or another disinfectant or nothing?

http://www.npr.org/2011/01/07/132743638/disinfectant-to-clean-water-has-problems-of-its-own

[Kirk Gittings]

We need measure the lead level in your house water and mimic it in our house because your films developed in your house are nicer.

:)

[Kirk Gittings]

Do you have chlorinated water or another disinfectant or nothing?

http://www.npr.org/2011/01/07/132743638/disinfectant-to-clean-water-has-problems-of-its-own

Chlorinated.

[Kirk Gittings]

So unless there's something unusual going on, the amount of lead in you water should be extremely small. I doubt that it has any noticeable effect on your film processing.

I never noticed anything to be honest except my failing memory :)

[John Jarosz]

You are getting excellent results with your negs and prints now. Why would you want to change?

[Kirk Gittings]

As I said I'm just curious. For example I didn't know if lead might create a situation that would compromise archival processing. I had never heard of such but someone might know something I don't.

[vinny]

I have a friend that has done quite a bit of research on lead in water lines and the replacement of main lines from the city water supply. Long story short, you would have been better off not touching the main line. The typical procedure introduces all sorts of lead which was previousely covered in sediment. Not good for drinking but you knew that.

[Kirk Gittings]

Thanks Vinny. I didn't have much choice but replace it. The tree roots from the huge cottonwood over it had deformed it significantly and it was leaking. I had been having water bills double my neighbors for a couple of years even though our yard was xeric and they had lawns. We knew there was a leak somewhere and narrowed it down to being the supply line under the tree.

[Pete Watkins]

I was always told in my days running swimming pools that if you were in a hard water area a deposit of lime scale was built up in the pipes and this protected the water flowing through the pipes from any harmful effects from the lead. I've seen evidence that shows that this is correct. Unless your water supply is acidic I really wouldn't worry.
Pete.

[Steve Goldstein]

Kirk,

You should post this question on APUG. Ron Mowrey, a former Kodak emulsions guy and very knowledgeable chemist, is a frequent contributor there. He would know the answer if anyone does. His APUG name is "Photo Engineer".

[Jmarmck]

I have the same questions but from the extreme quantities of lime (CaCo3). I have some contraption that ionized the water coming into the house which is suppose to reduce the lime from caking on surfaces. I also have filters on the drinking water. Nothing seems to make a difference.

I do know that Chlorine as a treatment in water high in organic mater can form trihalomethanes also a carcinogenic. It can be further processed with Aluminum. Bottom line is that there are many things in the water delivered to your house. Concerns with about archival processing should not be limited to lead.

[Peter De Smidt]

Marty, do you have a water softener? We have a lot of lime in our water. When we first bought a dish washer, it clogged up in about 6 months. The repair guy said, "This will happen again soon if you don't put in a softener." I also had some problems with toning lith prints at the time. I put in a softener, a Water Boss, and haven't had a problem since, either with the dish washer or toning prints, and it's been many years.

Be careful with filters. I damaged some film once after I put in a whole house filter. Small carbon particles from the filter fused with the film during processing.

[Kirk Gittings]

Be careful with filters. I damaged some film once after I put in a whole house filter. Small carbon particles from the filter fused with the film during processing.

That is very interesting and might explain another issue I have been having.

[Jac@stafford.net]

That is very interesting and might explain another issue I have been having.

Yes, very interesting! I might rethink the softener issue here.

My sympathies with the water bill, Kirk. I lived in Roswell and my water bill was greater than my monthly gasoline bill. Cottonwood trees are just evil water suckers, too. We have them here by the Mississippi River and they grow huge and fast; every other year a monster will fall on a house.

Back to the issue. Lead and particulates.

[Kirk Gittings]

So I have two stage inline water filter. The first has charcoal and the second is a tightly wrapped string something. Charcoal particles shouledn't get past the second one should they? I use this setup but it only gets on the film for the wash (and mixing the fixer)-every other step is distilled water.
http://www.h2odistributors.com/h2o-rus-200.asp

[Kirk Gittings]

Yes, very interesting! I might rethink the softener issue here.

My sympathies with the water bill, Kirk. I lived in Roswell and my water bill was greater than my monthly gasoline bill. Cottonwood trees are just evil water suckers, too. We have them here by the Mississippi River and they grow huge and fast; every other year a monster will fall on a house.

Back to the issue. Lead and particulates.

I had no idea Roswell water was so expensive. When was this?

[TXFZ1]

I had no idea Roswell water was so expensive. When was this?

My guess would be mid 1947. ;)

David