Tripod leg pivot

[QT Luong]

I am having problems with a recent Gitzo tripod (GT2531 if that matters). The bolts that hold the leg pivots (where the leg hinges with the main spider) become loose, to the point where the legs wobble freely when I pick up the tripod. After I tighten them, they become loose within a few times of swinging them to open/close the tripod. This is my sixth Gitzo tripod. While some of the others developed problems with leg joints, I never had issues with leg pivots.
Here is the parts diagram of the tripod. The bolts I am referring to are D1297.FJ
http://mediacdn.shopatron.com/media/mfg/2747/media_document/live_1/GT2531_20080104.pdf?1271723989

I noticed that when I swing the legs, the bolts do *not* move with the legs. I looked at all the functional tripods that I own, and in each and every of them, when you swing the leg, the bolt rotates together with the leg. Check it with yours to see what I mean.

My questions: How can the bolt rotate together with the legs ? I don't understand how this works, since they are screwed into the spider but not linked to the leg by any other means than friction. Understanding that, how do I fix my bolts ?

Tuan.

[Tin Can]

My only thought is corrosion of bolt and/or spider. Perhaps disassemble and lube.

I don't have that tripod, so I am generalizing, but the schematic looked straight forward.

Good luck!

[Louis Pacilla]

Hey QT

You may want to try removing the bolts and adding a a bit of blue Locktite to the threads & then reinsert the bolts/nut washers & spacers & see if that keeps the bolts from working free. but will allow you to break the bond w/ enough force. Just in case you would need to remove the leg for repairs. Just make sure you don't use the red Locktite as I believe it's a bit more permanent once it dries.

[Jac@stafford.net]

What Louis said. Be certain all the washers are there and do not over-tighten! A fastener over-torqued is already half broken.
Best of luck.
.

[AtlantaTerry]

One of the bolts my Gitzo tripod does the same thing. But not the other two bolts. I carry a small wrench in my car to tighten it. I have made it a habit to check to see if it needs tightening when I remove the tripod from the car.

[Jerry Bodine]

QT: I also do not have this specific tripod, but I'm pretty certain I understand how it's supposed to work. The D1297.FJ spacer (tube) passes thru D0801.06. You should ensure there is no corrosion binding the two together (may require cleanup/lube so the tube turns freely in D0801.06). Said binding would cause loosening of the bolts during leg swings. Blue Loctite on the bolt threads cannot hurt and may help. The way it works is that the tightening of the bolts creates friction that binds the tube to the clevis fitting (the two lugs on the common base) as well as to the washers and bolts. Then they all rotate together. But if the tube is held to D0801.06 by corrosion, it cannot rotate freely and something has to give.

Apparently, the pair of D06.13 Allen wrenches are the tools used simultaneously to tighten the joint. Is the tightening torque specified in the pdf somewhere. The tube's length and washer thicknesses adjacent to the tube ends are no doubt precisely set to prevent excessive bending in the "lugs" of the clevis (spider) from the bolt tightening.

[Jerry Bodine]

QT: I've had some further thoughts on this situation, regarding the use of the blue Loctite. It would be easy enough to ASSEMBLE the joint using the Loctite, but if DISASSEMBLY is ever needed there'd be some problems. Here's why:
In order to disassemble it's necessary to remove both screws from the "tube." Using the two Allen wrenches simultaneously, only one of the two screws is likely to loosen first and is easily removed, but then there'd be no way to prevent the tube from rotating when trying to loosen the other bolt and further disassembly would not be easy. The only technique I can think of to resolve such a dilemma would be to re-install the removed bolt, then swing the leg out (with the swing stop engaged) and apply just enough "swing force" on the leg to create the friction needed to hold the tube from rotating in D0801.06 while trying to unscrew the second bolt from the tube. So my earlier suggestion of lubrication after cleaning the corrosion would NOT be a good idea, as the lube would be an impediment to creating this needed friction. Also, it's worth mentioning that I'm not sure if it'd be necessary to remove the old Loctite from the bolt/tube threads for reassembly, or how best to do that.

[QT Luong]

Thanks for the ideas. Randy & Jerry nailed it. Turns out the tube was totally stuck with the spider whereas it was supposed to rotate (which makes the bolts rotate). We needed to use a arbor press to unstuck it. After cleaning out all parts and reassembly, two legs work just fine. The third leg is still loose. After cranking the bolts to the max, there is still not enough pressure, probably because in the process of removing crud, we removed some paint. The solution will be to add a small spacer.

[Jerry Bodine]

Thanks for the ideas. Randy & Jerry nailed it. Turns out the tube was totally stuck with the spider whereas it was supposed to rotate (which makes the bolts rotate). We needed to use a arbor press to unstuck it. After cleaning out all parts and reassembly, two legs work just fine. The third leg is still loose. After cranking the bolts to the max, there is still not enough pressure, probably because in the process of removing crud, we removed some paint. The solution will be to add a small spacer.

Good news! Keep us all updated with your final success. There are a lot of Gitzos out there that apparently may have similar issues. I assume that the additional small spacer you mention is nothing more than a very thin washer installed at the end of the "tube" to take the place of the amount of paint that was removed. The total length of the tube + any washers at the end of the tube should fit quite snugly between the lugs on the leg, in order to minimize bending of the lugs when torquing the bolts. Such lug-type fittings are often made of cast alloys that tend to be brittle and intolerant of such bending.

[QT Luong]

There are a lot of Gitzos out there that apparently may have similar issues.

When I tried to look up online with respect to this problem, I didn't see as many complaints about Gitzo as about RRS. In fact RRS even posted http://blog.reallyrightstuff.com/fixing-wiggly-tripod-legs/ but then subsequently deleted it, maybe because it brought attention to the problem and folks started making fun of a $1000 tripod requiring Loctite. However, that post is available on the Internet Archive, and that's basically what I did (minus using the arbor press) to fix my tripod.

[AtlantaTerry]

When I tried to look up online with respect to this problem, I didn't see as many complaints about Gitzo as about RRS. In fact RRS even posted http://blog.reallyrightstuff.com/fixing-wiggly-tripod-legs/ but then subsequently deleted it, maybe because it brought attention to the problem and folks started making fun of a $1000 tripod requiring Loctite. However, that post is available on the Internet Archive, and that's basically what I did (minus using the arbor press) to fix my tripod.

"Sorry, but you are looking for something that isn't here."

[AlexB]

Thanks for the ideas. Randy & Jerry nailed it. Turns out the tube was totally stuck with the spider whereas it was supposed to rotate (which makes the bolts rotate). We needed to use a arbor press to unstuck it. After cleaning out all parts and reassembly, two legs work just fine. The third leg is still loose. After cranking the bolts to the max, there is still not enough pressure, probably because in the process of removing crud, we removed some paint. The solution will be to add a small spacer.

I have the exact same problem with a Gitzo 2542L that I just bough used. Cleaning the tripod, there seems to be a bit of corrosion from salty water, but nothing too damaging. The only problem is this one tube that is stuck in the spider. I have just putted some WD-40 on the "tube" in the hope that it would trickle in between the tube and the spider and do its magic. But if this does not work, I really don't know how I am going to unstuck the tube without damaging the spider. If you guys have some ideas, I am interested!

[Tin Can]

Get a small amount of Kroil. Apply so gravity helps, meaning upside down. Put in a warm corner and wait a couple days.

Repeat if necessary.

http://www.kanolabs.com/

[AlexB]

Get a small amount of Kroil. Apply so gravity helps, meaning upside down. Put in a warm corner and wait a couple days.

Repeat if necessary.

http://www.kanolabs.com/

Thanks for the suggestion, I will definitely try this if the WD-40 does not work.

"Put in a warm corner" is just a way to speak or it is really helpful to put it somewhere warm?

If this does not work, I guess I'll have to order the two pieces...

[Tin Can]

Thanks for the suggestion, I will definitely try this if the WD-40 does not work.

"Put in a warm corner" is just a way to speak or it is really helpful to put it somewhere warm?

If this does not work, I guess I'll have to order the two pieces...

A warm corner helps the item stand up and is far better than a snowbank.

YMMV

[MrFujicaman]

AlexB..if Kroil won't get it loose, it's hopeless!

[AlexB]

I managed to unstuck it! Here is how I did it for those who may be unlucky enough to be in the same situation.

I have first tried WD-40, letting it there for a couple of hours. It didn't do anything.

Then Randy made the comment about Kroil, so I looked to find this near my place (Canada), and the closest I came to was PL-100, which is a "super penetrating lubricant" (which is supposed to be similar to Kroil because of that "penetrating" thing... ). I applied some, placed the spider so that the lubricant could sink in, and let the whole thing there for a few hours.

I think it helped, but ultimately the real problem is that it is very hard to have any grip or get any leverage on the small tube. At some point, some force is required and you need to find a way to apply some real force to either push or pull out the thing out of there. I tried multiple things that did not work. and then, alleluia!

I took the Gitzo screw and screwed it in the tube, but not completely. I left just enough space to be able to grab the screw using the back of a hammer. While being careful about where on the spider I was creating leverage with the hammer, I pulled the tube out with the spider in one hand and the hammer in the other, pretty much just like you can use a hammer to take nails out of stuff. So, I guess the lubricant helped, but what ultimately did it is that "technique".Again, I was just very careful about where on the spider I was creating leverage with the hammer.

Hopefully this will help someone in the same situation.

I cleaned the whole thing, and now everything works just fine.