lightweight 4x5

[Herb Cunningham]

I would like to solicit opinions from those who do a large part of their photography in the field with 4x5 or 5x7. I realize a lot of opinions have been aired in previous forums on this topic but after studying the forums for a week, I still feel the need for some advice.

I have been a serious amateur for over 50 years, a pro many years ago, and lately quite serious about being a much better photographer, so I can sell a few "fine art" prints which will allow me to write off the less profitable areas of the work. I do not rely on photography for a living.

Cameras owned: speed graphic, Linhof tech IV, Shen Hao, Wisner Tech Field, Ebony SV45TE, and several medium format and 35mm. I tried out a Wisner pocket expedition 5x7 but sent it back.

I now have a Wisner Tech field 4x5, which is ok but heavy and has really too many features for landscape work that I do. I will probably keep it, for decoration if nothing else-it is beautiful.

I know all of Kerry's postings almost by heart, and MIGHT try the ARCA F line but am put off by the weight. The Toho is attractive, but no graflok style back, which keeps one from using Horseman roll film holders.

What I would really respond to is a camera that I can carry in a shoulder bag with a couple of Graflock six shot holders, a light meter and an extra lens. for really long hikes I have a big f64 pack. The graflok back is appealing for the rollfilm holder aspect. The Crown Graphic I have will almost fit the bill, but really limited in movements and bellows extension. Lens use is from 90mm to at least 300, hopefully 450mm.

Price is not a deciding factor, but obviously one need to have some common sense. if available on the used market, so much the better.

I would really appreciate your help.

[Ralph Barker]

You might take a look at the Toyo 45AX field camera, a metal folder that has a Graflok back. I've been quite happy with mine in the field.

[Kevin Crisp]

Herb: How about a Canham DLC? Very hard to find used and I wouldn't necessarily recommend it as a first view camera, but for someone with your experience, it would be fine. Really nice bellows, relatively light weight, well made, sturdy enough, graflok back, good focussing screen, very nicely made and reasonably priced lens boards.

[Michael Kadillak]

I would agree with Kevin's recommendation and would extend it to include Canham's metal 5x7 with a 4x5 back that would be easy to carry into the field, would accept the graflok back with the 4x5 reducing back and would also accept the 6x17 Canham roll film back. After using the Linhof, you will find the light weight Canham a bit spongy in the rear of the camera as clearly it is not as rigid as the Tech IV, but it produces razor sharp photographs time and time again. It is simply a trade off to make the camera lighter weight and find a distinct market nich which you clarified in your post as desirable. The 5x7 will easily handle a 450mm lens.

Cheers!

[David A. Goldfarb]

It doesn't get much lighter than the Gowland PocketView--


http://www.petergowland.com/camera (http://www.petergowland.com/camera)

He may have one with a longer bellows, but my front-moves PocketView will let me use a 360mm tele or a lens as short as 65mm on a flat board.

I'm usually using the 4x5" PocketView (I also have an 8x10") as a companion to another camera. For bird photography, for instance, I might be carrying an F-1N with a 600/4.5 lens, and I'll bring the Gowland in the pocket of my ScopePak with a 135mm convertible lens, maybe a 90mm Angulon, and a Grafmatic or two. In that situation, I'll usually just use the F-1N as a meter, but if I want an ultralight meter, I use a Gossen Digisix. Alternately I might travel with a folding medium format rangefinder camera for handheld use, and bring the Gowland along for landscapes and architecture where I can use a tripod.

The Toho Shimo could function in the same way.

[Ellis Vener]

I'll second the recommendation of the Canham DLC (4x5) or MQC (5x7) -- the latter can be used with two reducing backs --one for 4x5 and the other is the Canham 6x17cm rollfilm holder.

[Brian Ellis]

You've described a Tachihara. Weighs four pounds, all the movements you need for the kind of work you do. I used to do exactly what you say you want to do - carry it around in a shoulder bag (mine was made for a 35mm camera) with a couple holders, two small lenses, BTZS dark cloth that folds up into a small size, and a light meter. There's a review of the Tachihara on my web site www.ellisgalleries.com if you're interested.

[Kevin Crisp]

The Tachihara is a nice little camera, and very light weight. Nice ground glass too. Going from memory it will barely focus a 300mm lens at infinity, unless I'm mistaken.

[Mark Fisher]

I love my Tachihara for all the reasons above, but I'm pretty sure it does not have the Graflok back you are looking for. I'm surprised that the Ebony or the Shen Hao you own (owned?) don't fit fit what you are looking for.

[Steve Hamley]

Ebony RW45. Exactly what you described, and if you liked the SV45TE except for the weight and extra movements, you should also like the RW45. Beats the Tachihara and Shen Hao for range of lenses, cheaper than the Canham, and very rigid. Weight: 3-3/4 lbs according to the Ebony website. At about $1500, one of the best buys there is.

Steve

[Frank Petronio]

Wista SP - metal, lighter than a Technika, and excellent durabilty and workmanship... Toyos are OK too. But you can build an Arca to be very light - all it takes is money - a 4x5 to 6x9 bellows field camera with a short rail is pretty light. All good.

[CXC]

I took my Walker Titan to Burma in a shoulder bag, it worked great. Handles all of my lenses, from 65mm to 450mm (the latter focuses in to at least 15 feet). Not as light as my Gowland, but it does have a Grafloc back. I'm afraid that Grafloc and ultra-light may be mutually exclusive.

If you become interested in the Canham 5x17 rollfilm holder, be aware that there is a special Walker 5x7 Extra Wide which is designed specifically around that holder. Www.walkercameras.com

[Isaac Crawford]

If you don't need a lot of movements, the Gandolfi traditional might suit you well. I have the 5x7 and it weighs in a around 4 lbs. I don't know if they come standard with a graflock back, but since they are made to order, I'm sure that's an option. I have one that is who knows how old and it is rock solid and lightweight, a great combo!

Isaac

[Kevin Crisp]

Just a few more responses and we'll have the market covered, as usual.

[Gem Singer]

Hi Herb,

I agree with Steve's recommendation for the Ebony RW45. It meets with all of your parameters . Get one that is equipped with the universal bellows. Jim, at Midwest Photo Exchange (jim@mpex.com) is expecting a shipment of Ebonys at the end of next week. He will probably be glad to take your Wisner in trade toward the Ebony.

[tim atherton]

I hope you are getting a cut Eugene - Jim must have a waiting list with all the folks you've sent his way... :-)

[Gem Singer]

P.S. There's a WTB add for a 4x5 Wisner running in the photo.net classifies. You should be able to sell your Wisner for close to the price of a new Ebony RW45.

[Gary J. McCutcheon]

Well Herb, you've heard it all. Although, if I had to pick one camera to be my one and only, to try and do it all, it would have to be an Arca Swiss F line. My work is too diverse to be satisfied with just one 4x5. From what you describe I would say you have 3 choices. They are the Tachihara, the Wista DXII(no rear shift resulting in more stability), and the Ebony RW45. Any of these woodfields you could do exactly what you describe at a weight you would like. The Ebony will give you more bellows for a bit more money, but they all do the same thing. Just figure out your lens requirements. If price is no object then I'd choose the Ebony at about $1500. I've used the Wista for 20 years and wouldn't hesitate at spending the 1100 to 1300 for it again and the Tachihara is a bargain at just under $700. They all take Technica style boards. Good luck and happy shooting.

Gary

[Gem Singer]

No Tim, I'm not getting a cut. I'm merely a very satisfied customer who wants to spread the good word around. As you know, I began buying, selling, and trading cameras, accessories, and darkroom equipment in 1946, when I was 16 years old. I've never met Jim face-to-face. He's a voice on the telephone and the person who answers my e-mail. During all these years, I've never had the pleasure of dealing with an photo salesman that is as straight forward, sincere, and honest as Jim. How's that for an endorsement?

[Renee Galang]

I am a conservation biologist working in Panay Island in the Philippines. I am trying to save a species of deer by working in the field for months in a very rough (no trail) highland tropical rainforest where the deer lives. I use Zone VI with 360 apo ronar, 150 nikkor lenses and 7 1/4 inch verito with an adoptor to screw into the apo ronar's copal #3 shutter. I use quickloads. All these camera stuff are inside an aluminium case. I simply strap the case into a backpack frame carrier. When I am having a break or an opportunity present itself I take photograph of the landscape where the deer lives. Eventually I will accumulate enough good photos to produce a book and its proceeds will go to the Philippine Spotted Deer Conservation Foundation account.
Photographic equipments are just tools, yes some are heavier, better than others. But generally they will all do the job. Just make sure that the "job" is worth it, that is all.

[Bill_1856]

How about a nice, virtually new 4x5 Nagaoka (same as ANBA and Ikeda) weighing 2.5 pounds, and a 5x7 extension back (18 oz) for $650. Alas spring backs only.

[Brian Ellis]

Mark - You're right, the Tachihara doesn't have a Graflok back, it hs a spring back. I missed that in his list of needs.

Kevin - My Tachihara had a 13 inch bellows and I could focus my Nikon 300M to about 10-12 feet. Not as close as I could if the bellows were longer but adequate considering that I seldom would be using a 300mm lens for closeups.

[Kerry L. Thalmann]

I know all of Kerry's postings almost by heart, and MIGHT try the ARCA F line but am put off by the weight. The Toho is attractive, but no graflok style back, which keeps one from using Horseman roll film holders.

You might consider the ARCA-SWISS Misura. It doesn't have back movements, but is considerably lighter than the F-Line. Another option would be an ARCA-SWISS F-Line equipped with the 6x9 front standard and the new 140mm size rear standard. It's basically a cross between an F-Line and a Misura.

For a REALLY light camera, it's tough to beat the Toho. At less than 3 lbs. with 15" of belows and full front and rear movements, it's a great camera for hiking and backpacking. It does not have a Grafloc back, but it can still be used with roll film holders. The back on the Toho opens wider than any spring back I've ever seen. It handles the Toyo rollfilm holders (which are excellent and available in 6x7 abd 6x9) with ease. I've even used it with my Shen-Hao 6x12 back (you have to be careful not to scratch or break the ground glass when inserting or removing the roll film holder). The operation of the Toho is a bit unconventional, but that's how they kept the weight down.

As you can see from the huge variety of responses, there is no one perfect camera. Given all of your requirements, the Canham is probably the best compromise. If you can live without the 450mm and the Grafloc back, the Toho is 2 lbs. lighter than the Canham and can handle telephoto lenses up to 500mm.

Finally, if you are really concerned about weight (which you seem to be judging by the title of this thread), don't believe manufacturer's published weight specs. I've weighed many cameras, and several of them, especially many advertised as lightweight, weigh considerably more than advertised. From personal experience, I can tell you that the weight of my Toho, as delivered was a hair less than advertised. After a few simple modifications (mostly losing the useless focusing hood), it was even lighter (2 lb. 12 1/2 oz.). My Canham, which was one of the first one's built, weighed 4 lb. 14 oz. - or 3 oz. over spec. Not too bad. Other brands I've weighed have been as much as 25% heavier than advertised. So, buyer beware. I'm going to start a separate thread where people can post the ACTUAL weight of their cameras. This same problem exists with backpacking gear. So, some of the web sites that specialize in ultralight backpacking have sections where they report ACTUAL gear weights. So, what do you say guys. Put your Tachiharas, Wistas, Wisners, Ebonys, Shen-Haos, Horsemans (or is that Horsemen?), etc. on the scales and post the results (in the "other" thread I'm about to post).

Good luck, let us know what you get and how you like it.

Kerry

[Mike Lyons]

Maybe a Panfield if you can chase up Mr Meintjes. Light weight, get him to make it with a Sinar back so you have the Graflok facilities and also get the rear extension rail. This will give you lens coverage from 58mm to pretty much however long you need - I go out to 450mm no problems. No rear tilt or swing on the short version, though. Rear base tilt with the extension rail, but full movements on the front standard.
Mike

[Stan. Laurenson-Batten]

For a number of years I have been using the Sinar P which is a no no for trekking.

I have studied the market long enough to convince my suspicious self, that the 5X4 portable camera I should go for is the, Acra Swiss F-Classic with Orbix Geared Tilt.

Ideal for the back pack, so the hands can fully manipulate the trekking poles to assist balance over rough terrain, they can also be used as monopods.

It is my ambition to be the owner of an Acra Swiss early next year. In the meantime I will have to combine my wild country photographic exploits with weight lifting!

Good luck in whatever your choice, it will be a system worth the investment.

[Robert C. McColloch]

I'm a Tachihara user for 24-years; no complaints; light weight; has all needed movements for a field camera. Latest ones are sturdier.

[Herb Cunningham]

Ok guys, I got the RW 45 ebony AND the Arca Swiss F line. I took a page out of Kerry's book and plan to have a really light weight rig with the Ebony, and all the movements you can imagine with the ARCA.

Results later-stay tuned, and thanks to all for the kind words.

[Scott Rosenberg]

herb...

how are you finding these cameras? i'm thinking about swapping out my technika pretty soon for something lighter...

[Hening Bettermann]

A question concerning the Wisner Pocket Expedition: Can the (front) shift and swing be locked one at a time? -
Thank you!