Removing lens and shutter from an old Zeiss Ikon

[Thrasymachus]

Hi,

I'm new in this forum, so hello everybody.

I have recently purchased a Zeiss Ikon Maximar 207/7 9x12 in decent/"so-so" shape. The Tessar 13.5 cm 1:4.5 lens it came with is however in very, very good shape (I think my "brand new" canon 50 mm 1.8 is dustier and more scratched than this one). It sits in a compur shutter, which seem to function at all speeds, albeit a cleaning probably wouldn't hurt.

I got the camera for the equivalent of 55$ with shipping from a guy who clearly didn't know anything about the camera, or cameras in general. So it was kind of gamble, but at that price I couldn't really go wrong, and I have wanted to get in to large format photography for a while. My plan is to make a detachable 4x5 holder that utilizes the groves for the film holderes and focusing screen, so that I can use 4x5 film and not only 9x12.

However I got a problem. The diaphragm blades are all loose / wrongly positioned, so I'll need to take the shutter apart and see if I can reconnect them (or get the shutter to a shop). But I can't figure out how to get the lens and shutter of the camera - and I have searched high and low on the Internet! There doesn't seem to be a button or lever to loosen it, and if it screwed into the camera, it must be stuck (I'm also a bit worried about putting to much force on it).

Can anyone guide me? Is the lens meant to be permanently fitted to the camera? Still, one would think that it could be removed somehow for repairs.

Best regards,
Kaare

[Dan Fromm]

Open the camera's back. Look at the back of the lens/shutter assembly. You should see a ring with two notches 180 degrees apart around the back of the lens. Use a spanner to unscrew the ring. Open the camera's front door. Pull the lens/shutter assembly away from the lens board.

[Tracy Storer]

Then get the shutter to a qualified repair person. If you can't figure out how to get it off the camera, you probably shouldn't be trying to open a shutter to re-stack a set of aperture blades.

[Tim Meisburger]

Or, go ahead and give it a try. I've done it with larger shutters.

Most lenses on cameras with bellows are attached with what is called a "retaining ring", which is simply a threaded ring that screws down the threaded tube on the back of the shutter. Its like a big nut.

If you have 9x12 holders for the camera, it might be easier for you to cut down 4x5 film, or order 9x12 film from Europe.

Good luck! Its a great camera, and if worse comes to worse you can pick up a useable replacement lens on ebay pretty cheap.

[Steven Tribe]

If you can't figure out how to get it off the camera, you probably shouldn't be trying to open a shutter to re-stack a set of aperture blades.

This sounds about right!

Replacement lenses/shutters are readily available! The focussing track scale can't be used with other focal lengths though and you will have to use the GG.
These are super useful cameras, but conversion to 4x5" is doomed to failure. Getting 9x12cm film from Germany is easy.
Note that a variety of film holders (single or double) are available and Zeiss-Ikon used a logical number code for different format (6x9, 9x12, 10x15 and 13x18cm) so you can't go wrong.

[Thrasymachus]

Thanks for the replies.

I have tried to remove the rear lens element, but that doesn't work. The shutter still won't budge. There is a second ring, with rounded edges, and notches every 90 degrees, could that be the/a retaining ring? I've carefully tried to remove it, but it doesn't easily come loose, and I don't want to break anything.

Is it possible or normal that the shutter gets stuck because of oxidation or dirt? From the looks of it, it seem that this camera haven't been used for a long, long time.

Best regards,
Kaare

[Dan Fromm]

I have tried to remove the rear lens element, but that doesn't work. The shutter still won't budge. There is a second ring, with rounded edges, and notches every 90 degrees, could that be the/a retaining ring? I've carefully tried to remove it, but it doesn't easily come loose, and I don't want to break anything.

If you can see the retaining ring, you shouldn't have to remove the lens' rear cell. The retaining ring (with notches every 90 degrees) hold the shutter to the board. The shutter won't come off until the retaining ring has been removed. I told you to use a spanner. That's the right tool. If you don't have/can't borrow a spanner you might (great stress might) be able to get away with using needle-nosed pliers; pliers are not the right tool. Using the wrong tool is, however, not a good idea.

[Tim Meisburger]

If you put a small screwdriver in one of the slots, tilt the handle clockwise, then tap it lightly, you might be able to turn the retaining ring anti-clockwise until it is loose enough to unscrew with your fingers. I've never actually used a lens spanner myself, BUT, I do have scratches on some of my retaining rings, AND if you are not careful, you could slip off. and damage the bellows.

[Michael Cienfuegos]

If you put a small screwdriver in one of the slots, tilt the handle clockwise, then tap it lightly, you might be able to turn the retaining ring anti-clockwise until it is loose enough to unscrew with your fingers. I've never actually used a lens spanner myself, BUT, I do have scratches on some of my retaining rings, AND if you are not careful, you could slip off. and damage the bellows.

You can also scratch the lens. :(

m

[Thrasymachus]

I thought you were talking about the rear lens cell, Dan, as it have notches every 180 degrees, and as it had squared off edges it seemed better suited to fit some sort of spanner, from a laymans viewpoint. I didn't know anything about "lens spanners" as I've never taken any of my 135 or 120 format lenses apart. A google search on the item made me understand the whole concept. (I've got the flu which I will no deny impaired my thinking a bit). I used a caliper as an improvised lens spanner rather than a screwdriver, using my free hand to keep the bellows out of the way.

I have taken the shutter apart (taking pictures every time I removed another bit). The good news are, that the diaphragm is a fairly simple mechanism that really only can be assembled one way, though it is undoubtedly going to be frustrating to do it. The bad is, that one of the blades have lost one of it's "hinges" (or pins), which must be why the diaphragm got messed up. The "hinge" seems to simply miss, it didn't turn up as i disassemblied the shutter [Ed. nevermind that, I found it in the shutter - I don't have any idea of how I'm going to reattach it, except to perhaps glue it on]. I've talked to a shop but they told me, that they don't do that kind of stuff (anymore), and that as far as they are aware, no one in my country does this kind of repairs.

I'm thinking of buying another shutter/lens, and put an enlarger lens with a diapragm in this one, as the shutter mechanism seem to work. I can see a local seller is selling a Schneider Kreuznach 150/5.6 Componar. Would that be a good lens (assuming it fits)?

-Kaare

[Tim Meisburger]

Glad you got it apart. I'm not sure about that shutter, but I have a old lens which is missing two of the leaves of the diaphragm (just like yours, the pins disappeared), but I put it back together and it still works with a slightly oblong hole. If yours does not work, you should look for a similar replacement lens (i.e. 135mm from a folder). They will be relatively easy to find on ebay for cheap.

Maybe something like this: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Jos-Schneider-Co-Kreuuznach-Xenar-13-5cm-f4-5-Doppel-Anastigmat-Lens-/250962957739?pt=Camera_Lenses&hash=item3a6e8ed5ab

Although I would ask around on the forum first, I I suspect many people have one of those in an old drawer (I've go a few, but not the 13.5)

[Thrasymachus]

Thanks Tim (sorry I confused you with Dan in the latter post, I've fixed it now).

How does focusing and bokeh work with an oblong hole?

I think I'm going to try and fix the blade, either with the pin (I found it) or by making something similar to it and glue it on. If it fails I'll assemble it without the broken blade and see what happens.

Thanks again for your advice and help.

-Kaare