Any interest in a modern timer release for LF lens?

[richardman]

I am thinking about building an electronic timer cable release. It can be used a as one shot (LF selfie :-) ) or timed exposure. I am thinking something that can be velcro'ed on to the camera base or tripod leg and then actuate a cable release type of thing.

For user interface, I am thinking about simple 2 selectors:
1) 2 or 15 secs (LF selfie may take more steps to get into position :-) ) for the first trip.
2) a logarithmic style "2nd trip" selector from 0 (no timed exposure) then from 30 sec to 2 hours. Unless you are Michael Kenna, that should be long enough?

When doing 15 secs non-timed exposure, there will be the customary blinking LED.
The unit will probably run on a couple AAAs, bring spares :-). It will have a battery gauge of course.

Questions:
1) Is this interesting to anyone else?
2) For timed exposure, it's best to use T mode. Should I go ahead and require that or should I handle B mode too. The design is such that T mode would hardly use any power, not sure about B mode.
3) I could design it to be all fancy that can be controlled via a phone app, and truth be told, since my main strength is software, this actually would be easier :-) but it is probably overkill?

Fr the eventual question of "how much," if this ever becomes a commercial or KickStarter product, the cost should be fairly minimal. The parts should be well under $15, except for the injection molding. Those require $2000-$3000 startup cost :-/

Comments and suggestions?

[vinny]

Yes, because those long air bulb releases suck.
There's only one item sort of like this sold but it's using a manual remote and runs about $140. I've started threads on this subject in the past (and a few months back) because i need something like that.
I planned on using an rc servo and a bluetooth module but i need a new phone first.
Rfduino was one option but not for $15. Having the phone control it would be a great thing for numerous reasons. An led indicator when the shutter is open would be great.
Put me down for one.

[Tin Can]

Timing it is easy, but a lot of shutters need a fairly hard push on the release lever and some require a long small wire push.

I suggest you research shutters before designing anything.

I tried RC servos with a programmable command unit to operate a Packard shutter, you can find my project in the DIY thread.

I use an NOS German spring wound device that works for me on any shutter that can be cable operated.

[BetterSense]

http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B00E594ZX0

Of possible interest

[richardman]

I am NOT concerned about the electronic part. That's my dayjob. In fact, we will release our own "better" RFDuino probably in 3-4 months.

Yes, it will use a small servo.

I understand some shutters require more work than others. I am mainly supporting the modern Copal and similar shutters. I am not proficient with mechanical designs, so I figure to get the first version out and see what happens.

The cost will definitely be significantly less than $140. $50($49 :-) ) is probably the ballpark.

[vinny]

Yeah, don't worry about anything other than copal shutters. In a perfect world it would fire my pentax 67II and prontor shutters but hey, you're on the right track. I'm not smart enough to write the app or wire everything myself. I wish you the best of luck.

[Vaughn]

My Copal 3 requires a cable with a medium-long throw. Not every store-bought one will work for that shutter. It has gotten picky with age/use.

I do not think I would use such a timer much. But at the same time, it would be fun to have. Not being tied to the camera could open up some new types of imagery..who knows?

Sometimes during long exposures I have to close the lens due to wind, then reopen the lens when the wind stops and continue with the exposure. So it might be nice to have an interrupt feature on the timer that can do the same.

[munz6869]

I'd be interested in that - I often make LF 'selfies' and I am always attached to a bulb and rubber tube in them :-)

Marc!

[John Koehrer]

For the selfie I'm guessing you would select a shutter speed and the timer just trips the shutter?

Be nice to have timed exposures using B simply because it's an open/close with only one release stroke.

It would also be easy enough to have a dual size battery holder AA/AAA like some of the NIMH chargers use.

[jp]

I think a good selling point would be the ability to choose long shutter speeds. The lens shutter goes to 1s. How about 2,4,8,15,30,60,120,240,480 seconds selectable with a dial and displayed on a simple lcd.

Another useful way of using it would be a x second delay. It could permanently replace the cable release (for landscape, probably not for people photos) if it can do it's job without undue vibration if I can push a button and 5 seconds later, the shutter does it's thing.

[richardman]

Right, the X second delay is what I meant by 2sec / 15 sec first "tripping."

Not a problem with B timed exposure. It will at worse draw more current, but let me think about this.

Once if we consider fine control, e.g. precise timed exposure etc., then a phone integration makes more sense. May be it will have both - simple selectors and fancy phone control for advanced use (yes, it will support both Android and iOS) - but may be not for initial prototype...

Yes, a way to interrupt timed exposure is important.

Thanks all!

[Oren Grad]

If you can make a reliable device for $50, then I want one. Ideally it would allow timed exposures up to a few seconds - beyond that doesn't matter to me for this device. But it needs to be usable without a phone.

[StoneNYC]

I would be for sure, I like the iPhone app idea, could you add a motion sensor to it? For LF wildlife?

Also, why stop at 2 hours? Could you at least do 4 or 6?

I ask because on winter nights, it's cold and the night is long, I've done 2.5 to 4 hour exposures before so, I could see need for longer than 2 hours, especially using FOMA or even any ilford film, TMY-2 and Acros100 really are the only two that wouldn't need more than 2 but that gets expensive in 8x10.

So that's my input! Now what's the price point? Or did I miss that info?

[jp]

The phone access is cool, but I find it hard to read my screen when I'm outdoors.

[hoffner]

I am thinking about building an electronic timer cable release. It can be used a as one shot (LF selfie :-) ) or timed exposure. I am thinking something that can be velcro'ed on to the camera base or tripod leg and then actuate a cable release type of thing.

Fr the eventual question of "how much," if this ever becomes a commercial or KickStarter product, the cost should be fairly minimal. The parts should be well under $15, except for the injection molding. Those require $2000-$3000 startup cost :-/

Comments and suggestions?

Forum guidelines: "promotional" posts promoting your own business enterprise, or one to which you are financially connected (e.g. owner, employee, contractor), are not allowed.

[richardman]

There is no business to promote yet, but if the moderators do feel inclined to do so, go ahead and remove it.

[richardman]

Just on page 1 of Unified Views, I see posts on "Photobackpacker" and "Platinum Women" both are excellent posts that should be there, but both can be said to promote the original posters' business, so how come I get the special treatment?

[Ken Lee]

Forum guidelines: "promotional" posts promoting your own business enterprise, or one to which you are financially connected (e.g. owner, employee, contractor), are not allowed.

This forum supports and encourages development of products of interest to Large Format photographers.

The OP has not announced a new product, but is soliciting feedback and advice from forum members. That is another of the purposes of this forum.

If and when there's a product to announce, that too is welcome, in the appropriate location.

[Struan Gray]

I would love to have an modern autoknips. Even better would be if its functionality could be extended through an app and a wireless connection.

My only demand would be that it be weather sealed. Not fully waterproof, but able to cope with prolonged dampness.

[Jac@stafford.net]

Not a problem with B timed exposure. It will at worse draw more current, but let me think about this.

Maybe not a lot more current. I had a shutter that worked from a circular solenoid. After opening the shutter, the current required to remain open was significantly less.

Regardless, your device could have a T setting activated through the shutter's T setting or through B if you include a small mechanical latch to hold until reset by the device, drawing no motor current during exposure.

[Atul Mohidekar]

I would buy it for $40-$50 if it had the following features:
- Good accuracy in the lower range - 1 to 5 seconds.
- Finer duration settings in the lower range - 1.3, 1.5, 1.7, 2, 2.5, 3, 3.5, 4, 4.5, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, ...
- Android or iPhone interface would be a plus, but full mechanical is fine.

I have tried using multiple Prontor timers, but the accuracy is in the lower range is horrible. There are no notches for different seconds or sub-seconds, so it is impossible to accurately and consistently set the exposure duration to any specific value (and for the lower durations, it matters).

[Jim Noel]

It would be of no interest to me. I have a small RC one which works well, and a Prontor which makes time exposures up to one minute.

[StoneNYC]

I would buy it for $40-$50 if it had the following features:
- Good accuracy in the lower range - 1 to 5 seconds.
- Finer duration settings in the lower range - 1.3, 1.5, 1.7, 2, 2.5, 3, 3.5, 4, 4.5, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, ...
- Android or iPhone interface would be a plus, but full mechanical is fine.

I have tried using multiple Prontor timers, but the accuracy is in the lower range is horrible. There are no notches for different seconds or sub-seconds, so it is impossible to accurately and consistently set the exposure duration to any specific value (and for the lower durations, it matters).

Good point, 1-5 seconds are always hard to be accurate with, having that added and even 1.5 and 2.5 etc would make sense.

Although in a dream world I would also like it to be tiny and cost $40 in realistic to say in this small market I could see it easily being $70-$100. I don't want that, but if $40 discourages you from it, consider that others might pay slightly more.

And yes iPhone interface a MUST then I can activate it from the warmth of my car! :)

I also see this as an acceptable thread, I've seen many "product announcements" and never saw anyone complain, it would be like shooting ourselves in the foot to discourage product announcements.

Maybe there should be a product announcement / industry news sub-section? LF info on new and potential discontinuing products is always hard to find, why not help spread the knowledge on the forum? Maybe make it an OP only post with updates only every week so as to limit spam?

[BrianShaw]

Probably yes.

[Paul Cunningham]

Rather than injection moulding, perhaps CNC milling or 3D printing.

[biedron]

I would buy it for $40-$50 if it had the following features:
- Good accuracy in the lower range - 1 to 5 seconds.
- Finer duration settings in the lower range - 1.3, 1.5, 1.7, 2, 2.5, 3, 3.5, 4, 4.5, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, ...
- Android or iPhone interface would be a plus, but full mechanical is fine.


+1 (though I'd be willing to pay more if it did all of the above, and did it well)

[brucep]

Put me down for 1

Bruce

[Jason Greenberg Motamedi]

I often need exposures ranging up to 15 minutes, so would love to have something like that automated. Also not all shutters have a T mode, so having B and T would make sense.

[richardman]

Since it will use a microcontroller, accurate time to any amount of seconds or hours are no problem. It's really down to what we want and the complexity of the user interface.

As for current draw for B, the problem is the servo. One it pushes the plunger, the servo needs to maintain that position and that means the servo must be engaged, unless there is some other mechanical mechanism that it uses. The micro will need to continue to generate a pulse width modulation also, but micro takes very little current to run, comparing to the servo.

Since this is not a business proposal yet, it would definitely look like sufficient interest to proceed tinkering and prototyping. No promise on timing yet (see what I did there?) as I have a boatload of stuff on my plates, but looks like this will be interesting to some people.

Thank you for all the comments and I will for sure consider all the feature input etc. when I start the tinkering process. Please feel to add additional comments :-)

[Jac@stafford.net]

As for current draw for B, the problem is the servo. One it pushes the plunger, the servo needs to maintain that position and that means the servo must be engaged, unless there is some other mechanical mechanism that it uses. The micro will need to continue to generate a pulse [...]

False.

You would do better with a solenoid rather than a servo.

Look into 'magnetic latching solenoids'. Once activated and in target position (shutter depressed), it draws no current and stays in place until an opposite polarity pulse is applied, and then it activates to withdraw. They have other advantages such as generating negligible heat, and gentler activation than some other push/pull/rotate models.[/QUOTE]

[rbultman]

I had a very similar idea recently. My day job is as an embedded system guy. I thought of using a Bluetooth LE module to control it with the thought that it might be a better energy tradeoff than using an LCD or other display on the device. Put the UI on the phone. It also makes it a remote for doing selfies. Worst case, you might need a button for pairing the phone and timer.

+1 on the magnetic latching solenoids.
+1 on a 3-D printed case.

[richardman]

Excellent, solenoids it is!

And I do know about 3-D printing. Certainly any prototype will be 3-D printed. If we ever go to "production," then we will see.

My dayjob is running an embedded tools (C Compilers) business. Actually, the more I think about it, the prototype will probably use a touch screen LCD. We used one of those for a Drink-bot controller demo just a few months ago. The board is way too powerful for production use, but we can slip in a cheapie Nucleo board from ST...

[angusparker]

I'd be interested in one. Thanks

[richardman]

It just occurs to me, while I am a computer person "by trade," I really appreciate going out to photograph with a backpack of 3 lens, 12 film holders and no electronic stuff except the phone (what? no one else checks their email in the middle of the desert? XD), and now... I am going to bring that tranquility ;-P

[bobwysiwyg]

I would be interested as well. I believe $40-$50 is an unrealistically low target price. I could be wrong. I would be willing to pay more for such functionality.

[hoffner]

Since this is not a business proposal yet, it would definitely look like sufficient interest to proceed tinkering and prototyping.
Please feel to add additional comments :-)

Dont worry, richardman:


This forum supports and encourages development of products of interest to Large Format photographers.

If and when there's a product to announce, that too is welcome, in the appropriate location.

[Jacques-Mtl]

I will also be interested in one.

[vinny]

so the Bob's want to pay more than $40-50. I'm still okay with it being $50.

[StoneNYC]

It just occurs to me, while I am a computer person "by trade," I really appreciate going out to photograph with a backpack of 3 lens, 12 film holders and no electronic stuff except the phone (what? no one else checks their email in the middle of the desert? XD), and now... I am going to bring that tranquility ;-P

I use my phone always for LF because it has the reciprocity timer app, it's really handy and keeps track of long exposure issues and also calculates for bellows extension, it's really essential for my work, I would have no clue otherwise on some of my really long (hour long) exposures. Many of the new to LF shooters are utilizing apps to help, I know it's probably making older folks grumble but it gets all the math and chance for error out of the way so you can focus on creating.

[StoneNYC]

so the Bob's want to pay more than $40-50. I'm still okay with it being $50.

I'm also a bob (technically) so I guess that's a true statement. But I wouldn't want it to be more than $100 I think it would limit order numbers and there wouldn't be enough.

Also, if you are making it for the standard cable release trigger, then including some kind of cold shoe attachment might be good, it could open up the purchasing arena to MF and even 35mm shooters with older cameras who want to trigger their camera with their iPhone...

[Light Guru]

I use my phone always for LF because it has the reciprocity timer app, it's really handy and keeps track of long exposure issues and also calculates for bellows extension, it's really essential for my work, I would have no clue otherwise on some of my really long (hour long) exposures. Many of the new to LF shooters are utilizing apps to help, I know it's probably making older folks grumble but it gets all the math and chance for error out of the way so you can focus on creating.

I use the Reciprocity Timer app also and it is GREAT. I've used the "use voice to start" feature several times to have the apps timer start when it hears the shutter open. But it would be nice to have it be able to close the shutter at the end of the exposure.

If you could control a bluetooth cable release from an app that has all the features of the Reciprocity Timer app I would definitely buy it. In fact I bet if you came out with the hardware you could partner with the developer of the Reciprocity Timer on the software.

[StoneNYC]

I use the Reciprocity Timer app also and it is GREAT. I've used the "use voice to start" feature several times to have the apps timer start when it hears the shutter open. But it would be nice to have it be able to close the shutter at the end of the exposure.

If you could control a bluetooth cable release from an app that has all the features of the Reciprocity Timer app I would definitely buy it. In fact I bet if you came out with the hardware you could partner with the developer of the Reciprocity Timer on the software.

+1 to that!

AND the guy who invented the app is a forum member ;)

[richardman]

...including some kind of cold shoe attachment might be good...

Lets not worry about pricing too much right now... it's just an idea.

And this is a great suggestion. Even some LF cams have cold shoes!

[gmfotografie]

would be great to snyc. those apps ( with reciprocity...)
maybe there will be also an option measuring the vibrance. if the value goes under a given point, the shutter starts :-)

(when i use an app which measures the vibrance i always notice that holding the shutter release is a essential key for making sharp photos... exception of the tripod, wind and so on....)


this is a great idea!

[richardman]

...
maybe there will be also an option measuring the vibrance. if the value goes under a given point, the shutter starts :-)

(when i use an app which measures the vibrance i always notice that holding the shutter release is a essential key for making sharp photos... exception of the tripod, wind and so on....)


this is a great idea!

Oh my goodness. Now THAT is a killer application! Instead of a set start of 2 seconds or 15 seconds, also have the start when the damn thing STOPS moving. Yes, I will add that feature. Need to research the right sensor....

THANK YOU,

[gmfotografie]

((don´t want to interrupt this thread but "setmycamera" has such a feature.. i use it because some of my first images where unsharp! so i put always my iphone on the camera turning on the vibrance of setmycamera. when the vibrance is under 1/15 i fire the thing :-)
))

[Liquid Artist]

I'd buy one at a reasonable price, however I have more than 1 camera system so I'd rather have a package price with 2 or 3 at once.

Plus I'd love to see an option to sync flashes at the same time. Even fire 2 or more cameras at once.

[StoneNYC]

I'd buy one at a reasonable price, however I have more than 1 camera system so I'd rather have a package price with 2 or 3 at once.

Plus I'd love to see an option to sync flashes at the same time. Even fire 2 or more cameras at once.

Oh!!! Large format stop motion or matrix style images all surrounding a moving subject ;)

[richardman]

I'd buy one at a reasonable price, however I have more than 1 camera system so I'd rather have a package price with 2 or 3 at once.

Plus I'd love to see an option to sync flashes at the same time. Even fire 2 or more cameras at once.

Sounds like "version two" type of features, but I do like the idea of Matrix, LF style, ha ha. With Grafmatics, we can take 6 "high speed" Matrix style images at a time, ha ha.

[vinny]

I can't wait to make selfies on sheet film, oh my! I'm giddy.

[StoneNYC]

I can't wait to make selfies on sheet film, oh my! I'm giddy.

Then we can scan it and upload it to Instagram! Whoot! LOL

[cyrus]

YES! I recommended building one of these instead to a fellow who makes shutter timers. He seemed interested but I haven't heard back from him. I'm definitely interested. Not just timed-release but wireless remote shutter release too... But phones and stuff will only add complications to me, I'd prefer it as mechanical as possible

[StoneNYC]

YES! I recommended building one of these instead to a fellow who makes shutter timers. He seemed interested but I haven't heard back from him. I'm definitely interested. Not just timed-release but wireless remote shutter release too... But phones and stuff will only add complications to me, I'd prefer it as mechanical as possible

I think the idea is to make it mostly electronic, this would keep the cost down. A fully mechanical one would be a lot more engineering and costs a lot more in today's world for parts and design.

[jp]

I can't wait to make selfies on sheet film, oh my! I'm giddy.

Yes, we can shoot a selfie on a precious sheet of discontinued instant film, photograph it with the smartphone, and upload!

[cyrus]

But dealing with different phones and different apps etc. I still can't get some apps to run on my Windows phone.

[Tin Can]

Why didn't I think of that?


Yes, we can shoot a selfie on a precious sheet of discontinued instant film, photograph it with the smartphone, and upload!

[richardman]

This gadget will be mostly electronic, but I will make sure whatever form of user interface I end up designing, it will not be only phone dependent or overly complicated...

[StoneNYC]

But dealing with different phones and different apps etc. I still can't get some apps to run on my Windows phone.

Your first problem is using a WINDOWS phone... *facepalm*

[cyrus]

Your first problem is using a WINDOWS phone... *facepalm*

41 megapixels

[jp]

41 megapixels

You're choosing between camera and apps. Windows is still a last choice for a smartphone.

[cyrus]

You're choosing between camera and apps. Windows is still a last choice for a smartphone.

And this is why I'd prefer as mechanical as possible thingies

[StoneNYC]

And this is why I'd prefer as mechanical as possible thingies

Except the 41megapixel camera which is far from mechanical... LOL

BTW I would bet my 8mp iPhone camera is better than the 41mp camera, MP don't mean anything anymore, it's all about the sensor itself not the number of MP which are often exaggerated or "interpolations" of much smaller MP numbers.

So yea, back to the shutter, so glad it will come with an iPhone controller app :)

[polyglot]

Would I buy one? Well, I built one (servo and attiny85) and I'll be seriously impressed if you can retail it for under $50 in small quantities due to the tooling cost on injection molds. Or you can 3D print, but that has a high per-unit cost and low production rate. If you could sell them for $50 and it met even half of the features below, I'd buy one in a flash.

To me, phone integration is not a feature; it's an anti-feature if included at expense of a physical interface. What I would want is:
- buttons or a rotary controller to change settings
- trigger via button press, or via flash radio-remote (PC-sync input port)
- programmable delay, say 0, 10s or 30s
- B or T mode (single or double press)
- exposures from 1s to about 4 hours in 1/2 stop increments
- probably a little LCD to show the current settings, exposure shown in log (stops) and linear (seconds) scale
- countdown on display for long exposures
- powered by rechargeable LiFePo4 cell, e.g. 18650 or CR123 or whatever.
- an SCR to trip flashes (PC-sync output port), with option for at least first- and second-curtain
- maybe an option to trigger strobe a set number of times, to get multiple pops onto the scene automatically
- USB port (even if physically hidden) for firmware upgrades

If you put the Arduino bootloader on there, you stand a good chance of selling bucketloads of them. There are lots of aspiring nerds who buy cameras, however for that case you probably want an electrical output too; that can be a simple 3.5mm stereo plug with a pair of contacts for "focus" and "expose" on a digital camera. While we're LF people, profitability and continued existence of a product like this will be helped greatly by an ability to sell it to the DSLR crowd.

Power consumption in B/T mode doesn't have to be high because you can put a FET in the power supply to the servo, which means you can cut power and it will just sit there during the exposure. Because there's so little push-back from a shutter the servo gears can hold the cable in; only need to power up the servo when it's moving.

Edit: MEMS accelerometers are real cheap (e.g. MPU-6050) but I don't know that they have the sensitivity you'd want for shake detection. I would imagine not at all if you want something as fancy as "expose when the wind stops" unless you put a bunch of signal processing / integration in there to look for signals between 1Hz and 20Hz.

[Light Guru]

41 megapixels

Megapixels isn't everything. Sensor quality is more important then mega pixels.

Think of it like this. If you are trying to make a high quality image would you rather use a 35mm camera with great film or a 4x5 camera with a paper negative.

[richardman]

While our ($DAYJOB$) big seller is still the AVR C compiler (heck, we will be releasing the only 3rd party debugger for Atmel pods by end of Oct), I will probably use a Cortex M0/M3 as the cost is actually not much more and actually less than normal AVR/XM (but not the Tiny). The Tiny85 is fairly limited so time to move on!

[cyrus]

Except the 41megapixel camera which is far from mechanical... LOL

Well unfortunately they don't make mechanical pocket phones!

[StoneNYC]

Well unfortunately they don't make mechanical pocket phones!

Settle for a hybrid?

http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B006C1TVZ6?pc_redir=1410484059&robot_redir=1

[vinny]

Richard,
When can I expect mine to ship?:) the suspense is killing me.

[richardman]

Richard,
When can I expect mine to ship?:) the suspense is killing me.

Bwahaha! I have not have any time to work on it yet, doing $DAYJOB$ (which actually IS sort of related to this gadget: we just released the first beta of a debugger for the AVR), photo project and.. Tai Chi. That plus a couple kids in college seems to soak up all the time! Who KNEW?!!

[axs810]

What about modding a Kodak auto release timer? It's all mechanical maybe someone could mod it so once it wound up it could release the shutter, shoot back up and reset itself, and maybe depending on how many winds its had release the shutter once more after either 2,5,10,15, 30 sec delay?



edit/ I know this isn't modern but thought it was worth adding (could be cool for wet plate self portraits lol)

http://youtu.be/F10efxa53qI

[richardman]

I did do some research on solenoid though and found a couple possibilities...

[Bill Burk]

But don't solenoids draw an incredible amount of current?

Also check patents for existing claims. I think PocketWizard wasn't allowed to trigger the camera from a flash position because of some claim.

[Jac@stafford.net]

But don't solenoids draw an incredible amount of current ? .

Not necessarily. Drill down into this thread to find out why.

[Jac@stafford.net]

See post #30, Bill.

[Carsten Wolff]

I tried a few things and ended up using a geared (Faulhaber, 485:1) micro motor (on a copal 1) a while ago; works well, (draws no current at all once in position) and is 100% reliable, i.e. strong enough for any shutter. I still preset the speed on the shutter, but can leave it on B or T even with the battery disconnected. Similarly, a decent servo from a R/C model would also work well. Connecting this to a timer, esp. for times over 1s is of course trivial.

[rbultman]

I tried a few things and ended up using a geared (Faulhaber, 485:1) micro motor (on a copal 1) a while ago; works well, (draws no current at all once in position) and is 100% reliable, i.e. strong enough for any shutter. I still preset the speed on the shutter, but can leave it on B or T even with the battery disconnected. Similarly, a decent servo from a R/C model would also work well. Connecting this to a timer, esp. for times over 1s is of course trivial.

Do you have any pictures or other information you could share regarding your solution? Any idea what the actuation time (open to close or close to open) is?

[Bill Burk]

That's once activated a latching relay takes little/no energy... To pull a mechanical shutter release can take many ounces of pressure, this is the kind of current I think would drain a battery-dependent system quickly. I would think a servo motor could be geared to require only as much energy available in a button cell, and could activate many times on a single AA size battery.

[Tin Can]

I tried using robot servos from here (http://www.pololu.com/) to actuate a Packard shutter. You can find my results in DIY. Speed of servo is critical in that application.

[cyrus]

Hi, any update on this project?

[richardman]

None, too busy trying to make a living :-/ Sorry.

[richardman]

OK, I feel ashamed, so I am going to order a couple servos (I know how to use them and where to buy them) and make a couple prototypes. I suck at the mechanical part but how difficult is to tie down a servo and glue down a long cable release :-)

The electronic part is almost trivial for me. I will do an overkill and use a Cortex-M3 board with a Touch Screen LCD because.. I have several of them. It will be easy to add a blue tooth module on top later too...

Stay tuned.

[sdean7855]

I'd be interested in one, in for $100 or perhaps more. Another design possibility is the scads of timers available from HongKong through Ebay, like this (http://www.ebay.com/itm/AC-DC-24V-8-Pin-0-01-9-99-Second-Digital-Timer-Time-Delay-Relay-Beige-ASY-3D-/321057989027?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4ac08c21a3). Alas, the load contacts are AC non-inductive, so there would have to be a relay most likely. K.I.S.S doncha know....doesn't *have* to have programmed computer....

[polyglot]

the electronic timers (at least for flash) have triac outputs, which are a bit annoying for converting to drive a solenoid. Far easier to just use a micro and implement the timing directly, instead of using two separate boxes (off the shelf timer plus mechanical adapter box).

An M3 I have no problem with (cheap!) but touch screen? That's going to ruin your pricing and form-factor. I was thinking one of those little 0.9" 128x64 OLED screens would be just the ticket for this.

[Photobackpacker]

I considered this briefly. My concept was a device that would connect at the end of a standard cable release. The shutter would be activated by the cable release manually. The closing of the shutter would be activated by the electronic timer. This eliminated the need for servos and could be accomplished with a small solenoid. Alas, my design skills in that arena are limited so I worked on backpacks instead. :)

Bruce

[Jeff Dexheimer]

Why not keep it simple? Maybe not quite what you were thinking, but what about a device that just trips the shutter once with each push of a single button? As far as times, all my shutters have the ability to control their own, so I wouldn't see a need for a timing feature. After I am done focusing, I need close my shutter and adjust my aperture, so setting my shutter speed is not a problem. That way, if I want to do a long exposure, I set my shutter to T and hit the button once - my shutter opens. When I am done I hit the button a second time, my shutter closes.

For $50, I'd buy that. If it was easy to switch from one lens to another, I'd pay $100.

[Tin Can]

I still use these. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Z4bLvcCOKc) work great.

[sdean7855]

Back 30 some years ago, I built a timing rig using a commonly available P&B timing relay to run a big solenoid operated Packard shutter.
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I did a lot of work with this which you can see here (http://imagovitae.org/hudsonvalleylandscapes.html)
A few years back, when I had big enlargements made in Cibacrome and FujiFlex (by Laumont in NYC, highly recommended!) I discovered this caused camera shake. Recently it occurred to me that I could just use the same timing lashup to trigger the lens shutters using T mode and a push solenoid. This is my first jury-rig effort..which didn't work because the specified push of this solenoid, 3/4 pound, wasn't enough.
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I have since ordered a push solenoid with more gimp. These push solenoids are commonly available, but at considerable price...I was looking for something costing like $10. Maybe this (http://www.surpluscenter.com/Electrical/Relays-Contactors-Solenoids/Electromechanical-Solenoids/12-VDC-POWER-DOOR-LOCK-PUSH-PULL-SOLENOID-11-3346.axd).
This whole business hardly needs microprocessors, though if that's what you know, that's what you'll use. The hardest part in this is acutating the shutter release...doing the timing is easy.
Here are some more pictures of the timing box. Everything's stuff into a small ammo box.
= There is a DPDT toggle switch that either (down position) sends current to the P&B timing relay OR in the other (up) position, uninterrupted voltage to hold the shutter open while you're focusing.
= There is a rotary switch, which selected one of several resistors. The timing relay came with a chart that told me what resistance resistor would cause the timing relay to operate (it offer both NC and NO) for the desired period. So I got the appropriate resistors for 1/8, 1/4, 1/2, 1,2,4, and 8 seconds.
=There are two 1/4' phono jacks.
-----One is connected to a momentary push switch (sometimes called a pendant switch, because you'll see them hanging from above in a shop to control machinery) that initiates the timing sequence. i originally had a door bell, but sometimes the contact would bounce and expose twice...so I busted apart an old game joystick and found the wries that went to its big trigger. A switch with authority and attitude!
-----The other connects to the shutter (the packard shutter or the solenoid rig which I haven't perfected yet
= There is a battery pack holding 8 alkaline D cells....which need to be changed maybe once every 6 months.
= There is a P&B relay, which is plugged into an octal socket, CKH-38-29010

It works. It's ugly, but it works, just fine (for 35 years!) and is a tank
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[sdean7855]

One more picture....you're only allows 4 per append
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I'm kinda busy...been going out to Colorado to see a lady friend and take pictures (this time in large format) of the Poudre River canyon north of Fort Collins
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So if there are any questions, it may be a while before I can answer them. You can email me direct at sdean aht sdean period net

[vinny]

One more picture....you're only allows 4 per append
129241

I'm kinda busy...been going out to Colorado to see a lady friend and take pictures (this time in large format) of the Poudre River canyon north of Fort Collins
129243 129245

So if there are any questions, it may be a while before I can answer them. You can email me direct at sdean aht sdean period net

does it come with a hot shoe mount? hahaha!

[Tin Can]

I used to use these (http://www.alliedelec.com/te-connectivity-cnt-35-76/70199337/) often at work, but never knew the cost as the tool crib just handed them out. $$$$$

Still need a holding solenoid that's affordable, reliable, long throw and powerful. ILEX 5 shutters require a big long push.

[sdean7855]

A relay similar to the one I used, but with the timing adjustment on the relay itself, is available used on Ebay (http://www.ebay.com/itm/360682110223) for $62 + ship. See also the 'also viewed' other P&B timing relays.

[sdean7855]

For what it's worth, should anyone else be pursuing this, the strength of a solenoid may be rated in Newtons. A newton is equivalent (I think) to a 1/4 pound or 4 oz. While a force of about that much or a little more may trigger your shutter, it will be slowed by developing that maxiimum force (if that is all your solenoid is good for). A force of around a pound or 4N would be better

[Deval]

+1, I'll be happy to beta test one