4x5: Linhof Kardan ST-E vs Linhof Kardan Bi-System--Differences?

[Peter Collins]

There's two 4x5 Linhof Kardan ST-Es up on the Bay. How are they alike/different from the 4x5 Linhof Kardan Bi-Systems on the same site? There's virtually no info on the ST-E on the 'net. There appears to be a difference in price. Can anyone help? Thanks!!

[Bob Salomon]

ST-e has square profile rail geared over it 18" length. B has a round 12" rail. B has base and optical tilts ST-E has Optitcal tilts. Otherwise they are similar. ST-E is much newer and is also lighter. B has geared shift ST-E does not.

[siuling337]

Thanks for the sharing.

[Jim Andrada]

The Bi also allows extension rails to a total of close to a meter - and with base tilt utilized at both ends you can get another few inches or so. I use an intermediate frame on my 5 x 7 Bi with a 4 x 5 bellows between the intermediate frame and the lens board and have used a 600mm RD Artar on it with base tilt to extend the effective length. (And something to brace the long rail!)

I also have an 8 x 10 Bi and the rails and front lens board are interchangeable with the 5 x 7 (or a 4 x 5 for that matter.) Great camera but sort of a hernia maker if you try to carry it any distance over a few yards.

And just for fun I also have the ST/E and a 5 x 7 Kardan Master. I love the base tilt on the Bi's and really miss it on the ST/E, The Master is so flexible you can have pretty much any kind of tilt you like. Someday maybe I'll get lucky and find a longer rail for it.

I sort of recall that Sinar went after Linhof over base tilt or asymmetrical tilt or something but I may be wrong.

[Bob Salomon]

The Bi also allows extension rails to a total of close to a meter - and with base tilt utilized at both ends you can get another few inches or so. I use an intermediate frame on my 5 x 7 Bi with a 4 x 5 bellows between the intermediate frame and the lens board and have used a 600mm RD Artar on it with base tilt to extend the effective length. (And something to brace the long rail!)

I also have an 8 x 10 Bi and the rails and front lens board are interchangeable with the 5 x 7 (or a 4 x 5 for that matter.) Great camera but sort of a hernia maker if you try to carry it any distance over a few yards.

And just for fun I also have the ST/E and a 5 x 7 Kardan Master. I love the base tilt on the Bi's and really miss it on the ST/E, The Master is so flexible you can have pretty much any kind of tilt you like. Someday maybe I'll get lucky and find a longer rail for it.

I sort of recall that Sinar went after Linhof over base tilt or asymmetrical tilt or something but I may be wrong.

The suit was over the asymmetrical tilts.

Sinar had a fixed assymetrical tilt point and linhof used a variable asymmetrical tilt system but the judge ruled that since Linhof's asymmetrical tilt points included the fixed point that Sinar used that Linhof violated Sinar's patent. So the Master L system was immediately taken off the market and Linhof did not use the variable asymmetrical tilt system again until the Sinar patent expired. Once it did they introduced it again on the GTL and system.