Recent US to Europe travel with sheet film?

[ryanmills]

Has anyone recently traveled from the US to Europe and back? I'm flying to France next month and im planing on bring about 5+ boxes of tri-x 320. From what I have read asking for a hand check is still ok. But I have at times pushed it to 1280, and I will also be bringing a lot of 120 tmax 400 that I shoot at 1600. Am I risking fogging/scan lines if I push that high and cant get a hand check? Also any issue with hand checking sheet film and opened boxes on the return flight. I fly out of belguim and while im sure most speak english and I figure sealed boxes they wont worry about much but taped shut 4x5 boxes, worried they wont understand what sheet film is an try to open them.

[djdister]

I recently traveled from DC to Scotland and back, had 4x5 FP4, HP5 and Velvia 50 with me. I didn't ask for a hand check in either direction, just let the unexposed and exposed film go through the scanner for carry-on luggage. From looking at the film, I don't see any effects of fogging, but I didn't try pushing it either. It was only scanned once in each direction.

[IanG]

I often process while abroad taking a tank and chemicals. Most European airports won't hand inspect film and insist they get scanned, I've just flown with HP5 and never have any issues even with multiple scans (over 20).

Ian

[Philippe Grunchec]

My advice would be to buy the films here in France! Prices aren't that different...

[ryanmills]

Yea its the pushing and open boxes im worried most about. In the US from what I have read here and other places getting a hand check should not be an issue. France/Belguim, not so sure...

[ryanmills]

My advice would be to buy the films here in France! Prices aren't that different...

Do you know of an online place I could order and have shipped to bordeaux? I looked at having my normal source ship it (B&H) but with dutys, vat and shipping it was $250 and I still have to bring it back with me :(

[Philippe Grunchec]

http://www.selsdargent.com/index.php?page=shop.product_details&flypage=shop.flypage&product_id=1100&category_id=30&manufacturer_id=0&option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=1

is a place I would suggest (you can use my name)

[ryanmills]

http://www.selsdargent.com/index.php?page=shop.product_details&flypage=shop.flypage&product_id=1100&category_id=30&manufacturer_id=0&option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=1

is a place I would suggest (you can use my name)

I took a look but the costs are about $89 here vs $140+ shipping and vat. Wish the costs were not so high there, it would make it easier.

[Philippe Grunchec]

VAT is included (TTC in French)!

[Philippe Grunchec]

Adaflex (closer to Bordeaux :))?

http://www.adaflex.com/pages/films/kodak.htm

[Philippe Grunchec]

... or try Foma films:

http://www.cyberlabophoto.com/2-pellicules

PS: prices for 50 sheet boxes!

[ryanmills]

Adaflex (closer to Bordeaux :))?

http://www.adaflex.com/pages/films/kodak.htm

Oh Thanks, it is still a good bit higher than buying it here but I might have to plan for it next time. Thank you for the links!

[Doremus Scudder]

Five boxes of Tri-X 320? That's 250 sheets... more than I shoot in a summer usually (although, admittedly, my working style is slower and more contemplative). But, how long are you planning on staying abroad? 250 sheets for a vacation seems a bit high... Plus, you're taking all that 120 film as well. You might want to trim down a bit.

On to the main topic. I fly both ways often. Don't expect (or even bother to ask for) a hand inspection in Europe. However, on the way over, you can try. I put my film in one or more large clear Ziploc bags and remove them from my carry-on before going through security. In the States, you can ask the TSA for a hand inspection and, if you are lucky, they will recognize the large-format and 120 film and you'll have no problem. That said, since I don't push-process, I usually just send the Ziploc full of film through the scanner.

I've had Tri-X 320 and TMY that has been scanned up to 6 times and have had no problems at all. Others have reported even more passes and have had no problems. My advice is to simply scan the film and not worry.

For exposed film. Put sheet film into boxes and tape closed. Label them "Exposed Film - Open Only in Total Darkness" or the like, put the boxes in a clear bag and send them through the scanner. 120 film can also go into clear bags; label the bags as above and put them through the scanner. Again, remove them from your carry-on before putting them through the scanner. The reason for this is: if you have other items in your carry-on that may confuse the person reading the scans, then they'll put it through the machine a second time. I've had carry-ons rescanned because a bag of computer cables obscured the view of other items, because I had on pocket with three wristwatches in it, because the person scanning had never seen large-format lenses before, etc., etc. If your film is in there with the other stuff, it may get a second dose of radiation.

Try to arrange your flight so that you'll not have to go through security so often. Don't leave the secure area to go shopping, etc. during layovers, etc. This will help reduce exposure.

Have a nice trip.

Doremus

[tgtaylor]

I haven't traveled to Europe with film recently but when I did I never had any problem having film hand inspected except at Heathrow where they insisted on scanning it saying it wouldn't harm the film ("I wouldn't blow you.") All US and Canadian airports will hand inspect film and holders.

Thomas

[Philippe Grunchec]

Well! You can take the risk...

Last time I flew from Berlin to Paris, I took me ten minutes to convince the people to hand inspect my 8x10 films, then they took me to another part of the terminal (another 30 minutes wasted)... I still could catch the plane, but what a drag!

My German is fluent (at least much better than my English!) and my wife is a German citizen....

Another advice (if I may): even if your French is rusty or even almost non existent, try to address people in their native language. Europeans have a tendency to feel offended when foreigners (especially Americans:)) give the impression that everyone -even in the most remote places- should understand and speak English!

Have a nice trip!

[IanG]

I haven't traveled to Europe with film recently but when I did I never had any problem having film hand inspected except at Heathrow where they insisted on scanning it saying it wouldn't harm the film ("I wouldn't blow you.") All US and Canadian airports will hand inspect film and holders.

Thomas

Actually there's a UK committee that made sure scanners were totally film safe at airports even for the fastest films. The Scanners made in the UK get exported around the world except to the US, in the US the parent company only supplies it's domestic market and the specifications differ.

I've met people on the committee, in fact I worked for a former member company, it also dealt with photo wasteland effluent.

Ian

[ryanmills]

lol, I shoot portraits not landscape. We tend to go thru a bit more film. I'm attending jock sturges workshop at his house in montalivet. I was told to plan to shoot a lot. After that i head to the Ardennes forest in Belgium to work on my personal projects. I dont know that I will shoot 250 sheets. With what this trip will cost I certainly dont want to run out :) 120 is just for my carry around camera, serious work is done on the 4x5 but sometimes its not practical so the pentax comes out.

Sounds like no one has really tried pushing to 1600 and flying, i dont have to push tri-x past 640 much, its the tmax 400 that gets pushed but thats 120 so maybe its easier to just scan the 4x5 and ask for the hand check on a small bag of 120.

[toyotadesigner]

Would it be an option to purchase film in Europe? If you already have an address in France, you might contact these companies:

http://www.calumetphoto.de/INTERSHOP/web/WFS/Calumet-DE-Site/de_DE/-/EUR/ViewStandardCatalog-Browse?SearchParameter=%26%40QueryTerm%3D*%26ContextCategoryUUID%3DPjusEABbuYAAAAE_cI1t38YX%26ManufacturerName%3DKodak%26OnlineFlag%3D1%26%40Sort.CategoryPosition%3D0%26%40Sort.name%3D0&PageSize=30&CategoryName=321&CategoryDomainName=Calumet-DE-4

(Yes, Calumet is still alive in Europe)

http://www.nordfoto.de/index.php?cat=4&sort=&XTCsid=1537b95e29438f684797f5ed1f66298f&filter_id=6

Then you can mail them to an old fashioned lab, which even does push development and have them send the developed films to your home.

[ryanmills]

Would it be an option to purchase film in Europe? If you already have an address in France, you might contact these companies:

http://www.calumetphoto.de/INTERSHOP/web/WFS/Calumet-DE-Site/de_DE/-/EUR/ViewStandardCatalog-Browse?SearchParameter=%26%40QueryTerm%3D*%26ContextCategoryUUID%3DPjusEABbuYAAAAE_cI1t38YX%26ManufacturerName%3DKodak%26OnlineFlag%3D1%26%40Sort.CategoryPosition%3D0%26%40Sort.name%3D0&PageSize=30&CategoryName=321&CategoryDomainName=Calumet-DE-4

(Yes, Calumet is still alive in Europe)

http://www.nordfoto.de/index.php?cat=4&sort=&XTCsid=1537b95e29438f684797f5ed1f66298f&filter_id=6

Then you can mail them to an old fashioned lab, which even does push development and have them send the developed films to your home.

I did look at the links a few people sent me but the costs are much higher than buying it here and im on a limited budget this time. Might have to just not push any 400 film. I also don't trust any labs for b/w I prefer to do it all myself.

[BrianShaw]

Actually there's a UK committee that made sure scanners were totally film safe at airports even for the fastest films. The Scanners made in the UK get exported around the world except to the US, in the US the parent company only supplies it's domestic market and the specifications differ.

I've met people on the committee, in fact I worked for a former member company, it also dealt with photo wasteland effluent.

Ian

Ian. Can you point us to the studies or tests conducted by BPLC? All I can seem to find is their work on copyright education/protection and casual reference to independent testing. Thanks.

[Brian C. Miller]

What about developing the film yourself, in Europe? Take a look at Ilford's Local Darkroom (http://www.localdarkroom.com/countries/index.php) site. There might be something you can use, or get in contact with someone. But at 250 sheets, make sure there's a film dryer there! :)

[ryanmills]

What about developing the film yourself, in Europe? Take a look at Ilford's Local Darkroom (http://www.localdarkroom.com/countries/index.php) site. There might be something you can use, or get in contact with someone. But at 250 sheets, make sure there's a film dryer there! :)

I would have a day to try in belguim but i'm not sure I can do 250 sheets plus I don't even know how many rolls of 120 in a day lol. I might have to seriously think about that for next time.

[JMB]

Yea its the pushing and open boxes im worried most about. In the US from what I have read here and other places getting a hand check should not be an issue. France/Belguim, not so sure...

I have never had a problem getting a hand check at LAX. I could not get a hand check in Paris or London, and it seems that European airports refuse them. Your return will almost certainly be an obstacle. I just develop film wherever I shoot it now.

[jnantz]

hi ryan

i will be doing something similar to you in a month's time as well.
the last 3 or 4 times traveling to france ( the last being last year )
i had NO problem asking for hand inspection of film. just bring it all
as carry on ... and if they say send it through the scanner it is OK
for anything upto iso 400-800, tell them you expose it at faster speed
so it is actually iso 1280. even in the height of the scanner boom
cheryl jacobs ( portrait photographer who used to spend some time on APUG.org
and travel overseas for workshops and portrait gigs ) used to tell the security people
that same thing, " it says 320 but is really 1280" or something similar and her film was hand inspected, and no problems.

usually when i go through the scanners there is a "film buff" so they understand the film is marked one thing but is exposed at another ...
if i had the threads to link to i would but they are 5-7 years old ... as for the boxes of 4x5 film tape the boxes shut (strong clear tape after you open them
so the inspectors don't open them by accident .. ( and put your exposed film in a separate box and label it EXPOSED and tape it shut )

a few summers ago i exposed 100-200 sheets of film and maybe 70 rolls on a trip and it turned out OK ..
last year less and this year i will bring some, too but as i said i didn't push it (i usually give 5x more light, not less light)
so the affect from the scanners might not have shown itself. i've never flown through the airports you do, usually logan-heathrow-basel ..

have fun on your trip!
john

[cowanw]

ISO is ISO. Does it make any difference if you underexpose it i.e. push it. It is still the same film. After all the difference, if there is one is at the processing stage. ISO 400 pushed is not the same as ISO 1280 film.

[jnantz]

thanks bill

i am clueless in that department, and was just going by what cheryl said
and the way she spoke of xray/scanner damage .. from what i remember
she said something like she shoots it at a high iso and sometimes the damage
may present itself because it is being pushed ... in my cluelessness
i took it as seeing the film's midtones are turned into something else ...
and if there was mid tone banding, it might be more pronounced when it
is jolted into a higher contrast rather than being masked by other mid tones ..

but as i said, i am extremely ignorant in these things ..

[ryanmills]

ISO is ISO. Does it make any difference if you underexpose it i.e. push it. It is still the same film. After all the difference, if there is one is at the processing stage. ISO 400 pushed is not the same as ISO 1280 film.
Thanks Bill and John

I was wondering if pushing effected it vs a true high speed film like delta 3200. I just have not had any luck finding someone who had done it before to confirm it. At this point the plan is to bring mostly tmax 100 for 120 instead of 400, at least then when I push I wont ever go past 800 just to be safe.

[mathieu Bauwens]

Hello Ryan,

To buy film and/or chemistry, you can ask Aurélien ; http://labo-argentique.com/ but also to develop some of your work.

I am in Brussels if it can help you to have a darkroom for some work.

[ryanmills]

Hello Ryan,

To buy film and/or chemistry, you can ask Aurélien ; http://labo-argentique.com/ but also to develop some of your work.

I am in Brussels if it can help you to have a darkroom for some work.

Merci mathieu, If I end up getting more than one day off I might have to take you up on that :)