Inkjet paper / printing issue - printing experts advice needed

[DennisD]

I sometimes make prints using Epson Exhibition Fiber paper. I have a roll of 24" wide paper and another roll of the same paper 17" wide. I find that prints made using the 24" roll have beautiful, rich blacks enhanced by a uniformly shiny surface of the paper. The sheen or slight gloss is imparted by the paper itself.

On the other hand, I find that prints made using the 17" roll are quite different. The same image printed by the same printer using the same profile, setup, same inks (on the same day) - no changes - has a different appearance. The print does not have the glossy appearance mentioned above - especially in the black areas. The ink almost seems to sit on the surface of the paper and has a somewhat dull appearance in the darker areas and blacks as compared to the print made on the other (24") roll. The difference is apparent even to the casual viewer. I would describe the darker areas of the print as being somewhat "bronzy" whereas the lighter areas still have the shiny-ness the paper imparts. Looking across the surface of the paper there is definitely a "gloss differential".

I'm mystified because the paper of this quality should provide the same print regardless of roll size. I don't think I'm doing anything wrong ! I can only assume there is some manufacturing defect or paper issue involved. The two rolls are from different lots (the lot numbers are close), both were bought at the same time and have been stored under the same conditions. Looking at prints made sometime back, the same problem was present, but somehow I did not make the comparison till now.

Any thoughts, advice or experience others have had in this regard would be most appreciated. Thanks,

Dennis

[Leigh]

Are you printing on the wrong side of the 17" paper?

Some coated papers are only coated on one side.

- Leigh

[DennisD]

No, definitely right side of paper - the coated side.

BTW- forgot to mention the prints are in Black & White

[Lenny Eiger]

Dennis,

There is a huge tolerance between lots of paper. Way more than there should be. I've and a number of agreements with top paper manufacturers about this, even those who make paper more high end than Epson.

There are all sorts of coating differences, surface differences, and on occasion complete coating failures.

No, you're not crazy, you're just expecting too much. Especially from Epson, who has nothing but disdain for its customers.

Lenny

[djdister]

No, definitely right side of paper - the coated side.

BTW- forgot to mention the prints are in Black & White

Dennis,

This is a no-brainer. Send the defective roll back to wherever you bought it and ask for a refund or replacement roll. It would be crazy to adjust your profile or image just to fit a different size of the same paper. It sounds like the 17" paper is missing the gloss layer altogether.

[DennisD]

Dennis,

There is a huge tolerance between lots of paper. Way more than there should be. I've and a number of agreements with top paper manufacturers about this, even those who make paper more high end than Epson.

There are all sorts of coating differences, surface differences, and on occasion complete coating failures.

No, you're not crazy, you're just expecting too much. Especially from Epson, who has nothing but disdain for its customers.

Lenny

Thanks, Lenny, for your re-assurances ! I thought for a while it was me, but going carefully, step-by-step, I know it's the product. Frankly, I don't think I'm expecting too much - just expecting Epson to live up to its product standard.

I think you're very right about the problem issues with papers. The difference I'm experiencing is night and day and for no reason other than a paper problem.

I did call Epson - see my comment below to Dan - after they got over the fact I'm using a Canon printer, they were appropriately responsive to the issue.

Thanks again for your message.

Dennis


Dennis,

This is a no-brainer. Send the defective roll back to wherever you bought it and ask for a refund or replacement roll. It would be crazy to adjust your profile or image just to fit a different size of the same paper. It sounds like the 17" paper is missing the gloss layer altogether.


Hi Dan,

You're right, it should be a no brainer. I did call Epson thus morning. Their support was open at 7:30am pacific.

When the support rep realized I had a Canon printer, he was about to say that Canon inks on Epson paper was not subject to warranty consideration.

However, when he realized that 2 rolls of Epson's very same paper were performing differently (when all variables were precisely the same), his tune changed immediately. He asked for samples and agreed to replace the problem paper lots.

The 17" roll appears to have the standard coating, but it's definitely missing something !
The way the paper responds to medium and darker tones is horrendous - really noticeable bronzing and metallic look. I've not experienced anything quite like it, considering the other roll is so perfect.

Thanks for your response to the post.

Dennis

[James515]

Cut the 24 paper to 17 inch size and see if size really matters.

[biedron]

Cut the 24 paper to 17 inch size and see if size really matters.

Well, following that thought, are the printer setting the same for both papers? Sounds like one might be using matt black and the other glossy.I would first double check the setting for each. If they are the same, then try James515's suggestion. It *could* be a defective paper, but I would rule out operator error first.

[f5top8]

Hi Dennis D,

Believe it or not but inkjet paper is actually sensitive to moisture and light. In fact the paper technically can go bad if you do not story it in its proper air tight container it is supposed to be in or it is left on the printer for too long. It is possible also that the conditions that the paper was in before you purchased the paper was different and therefore contributed to such changes in printing details.

Best,
F5top8

[DennisD]

Thanks to everyone who replied to this thread.

I just noticed this thread was recently reopened and commented upon by F5top8.
So I wanted those who read this to know what was the cause of the problem.

Rather than blame the paper supplier, the issue was most likely caused by my own "operator error." ...so "I'll have to eat my hat" (not sure who originally coined that phrase, but it applies here !

Biedron's post was on the right track. While I thought the Media Type settings were identical between the prints, I believe they were not. I say this, because I discovered I was able to duplicate (or correct) the problem by changing to different media type selections. In this case, interchanging the media selection of HW Photo Glossy with HW Photo Fine art will produce the problem effect. These media types, for a canon printer, use different blacks.

The problem occurred when I attempted to duplicate a print based on my notes made from printing on an earlier date. The original print was probably made using media type of HW Photo Glossy. However, my notes (erroneously) indicated HW Fine Art Photo. All the while, when I was attempting to reprint, I was using the incorrect media selection.

I did return the paper to Epson for testing, as per their request. The roll was replaced about a month later without question, but there was no indication from Epson as to what their testing revealed. However, I'm quite certain the media type selection on my end must have been the issue.

If nothing else, I'll take more careful notes in the future and make them at the time of printing- not afterward.

[andy]

Thanks for the follow-up/update. It's always good to hear the ultimate solution.

[Greg Miller]

Hi Dennis D,

Believe it or not but inkjet paper is actually sensitive to moisture and light. In fact the paper technically can go bad if you do not story it in its proper air tight container it is supposed to be in or it is left on the printer for too long. It is possible also that the conditions that the paper was in before you purchased the paper was different and therefore contributed to such changes in printing details.

Best,
F5top8

I've never seen this happen. But if it were to happen, I would expect that I would notice it prior to making a print on it.

[Jim Andrada]

I've had problems with different boxes of Museo Silver Rag, but more related to feeding issues. I opened a new box and started getting head strikes near the corners - turned out the paper curled up towards the printing surface whereas the previous box had curled down. IT Supplies replaced the paper immediately and all was well.

[djdister]

I've had problems with different boxes of Museo Silver Rag, but more related to feeding issues. I opened a new box and started getting head strikes near the corners - turned out the paper curled up towards the printing surface whereas the previous box had curled down. IT Supplies replaced the paper immediately and all was well.

I've had bad edge curl problems with the Harman glossy baryta, in two different sizes. I complained about it to no avail.

[Greg Miller]

Edge curl is fairly common. When I encounter a head strike because of this, I just change the platen gap to a wider setting.