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View Full Version : what camera can I get on $1,000?



yuexiachou29
22-Feb-2014, 18:15
Hello
I am borrowing money from parents to buy a 4x5 field camera, if i have $1,000
what used camera can I get ? I know there is one made in China, I never remember the name, Chinox...something

Thank you for your comments in advance.

Alan Gales
22-Feb-2014, 19:00
The Chamonix is a Chinese camera with a French name. They turn up used occasionally but hold their value well.

If you want a wooden field camera also look at Shen Hao and Tachihara. Wista's are nice if you can find one in your price range.

If you don't mind metal the Toyo's are great.


Just remember you will need a tripod, lens, film holders, etc.

yuexiachou29
22-Feb-2014, 19:33
thank you for the comments Alan. I will have to get one or two lenses and few film holders to start. ...

yuexiachou29
22-Feb-2014, 19:34
also where to buy film holder? god i know nothing!

Alan Gales
22-Feb-2014, 20:08
Since you are on a budget I would recommend buying used film holders either from someone on this forum or Ebay.

Just advertise on the forum's For Sale Section that you are looking to buy 4x5 film holders in nice shape.

StoneNYC
22-Feb-2014, 20:13
I have so many extra film holders for 4x5, I'll sell them to you for $15 a piece. All fidelity / lisco regal style.plastic ones. As many as you want.

And for $1000 I would expect you can only get about 1 lens in the $150-$200 range and one decent used camera like a toyo45a for $500-$650 so you'll be playing it really tight. But it's do-able.

For the lens you could start with the standard 150mm if you want something relatively good but cheap because there are an abundance, or 210mm if you want a little longer focal length but still can be gotten reasonably.

zelph
22-Feb-2014, 20:21
SINAR - a whole outfit including a lens if you look around a bit.

Jmarmck
22-Feb-2014, 20:23
When searching ebay for 4x5 view camera. You will get quite a few items. I have found that you really need to dig. I found some good deals that way. There are a couple decent Horseman 450 with lens on there right now within your budget. But they are heavy. There are a whole lot of Calumet CC-400's with and with out lenses. Some come with lenses and boards as well as holders and some even have a case. But be careful of the bellows and ground glass condition. These have all the movements of a pro camera but they are not graduated like the newer horseman or toyo.

yuexiachou29
22-Feb-2014, 20:26
if they have field camera
SINAR - a whole outfit including a lens if you look around a bit.

Jeff Dexheimer
22-Feb-2014, 21:03
KEH.com is probably your best bet. I buy a lot of stuff from them and it's usually priced better than ebay and even here. With ebay, quality is hit or miss and a lot of stuff is mis-marked because many sellers have no idea whet they are selling. Here you can find a lot of good quality stuff and sellers are usually honest and reliable, but people tend to ask high prices. Of course that can depend, but if there is a really good deal on this forum, it will usually get snatched up pretty quickly.

Keh is great and you can buy their bgn rated items and always get things that are like new. Last time I bought from them I scored 6-4x5 fidelity elite film holders (the second best film holders available IMO) for $6 a piece after shipping. They were rated bgn, but minus a little writing on the label, they were perfect.

Anyway, that has been my experience. Ymmv.

yuexiachou29
22-Feb-2014, 21:17
thx for sharing Jeff. I like KEH too, i got my first hasselblad from them. but the problem is there aren't many options on KEH when i comes to LF.
they have plenty medium format stuff though

Alan Gales
22-Feb-2014, 21:35
Here you can find a lot of good quality stuff and sellers are usually honest and reliable, but people tend to ask high prices. Of course that can depend, but if there is a really good deal on this forum, it will usually get snatched up pretty quickly.

Jeff, I agree with you but did you see that bargain Wista SP with lens that recently sat on here for several days before finally selling?

Bernice Loui
22-Feb-2014, 23:53
It may be better to decide on which lenses and the type of images you would like to create, then decide on the camera.

The ideal situation would be to purchase a complete system used in known good condition with lenses, camera, film holders, focusing loupe, dark cloth, exposure meter and ...

This way it will be easier and more cost effective to get started. Do not limit the choices to a field camera or mono-rail as each has specific trade offs dependent on your imaging and lens needs.

Purchasing an entire 4x5 system in known good condition that is ready to work should be quite do-able within the allotted budget of $1000.

What matters most when learning LF image making is the skill set required to create the images in mind and these first tools must be as problem and frustration free as possible or discouragement and frustration will result causing much grief and more..

Be patient with shopping, wait for a good and fair deal. This will have good returns in the long run.


:)
Bernice

Luis-F-S
23-Feb-2014, 08:48
If you want a wooden camera, I'd look for a Zone VI (Wista) you can sometime find an entire system for your price range. If a Monorail, look for a Sinar F1 or F2. There's a Zone VI monorail on the auction site for $200 that look like an F1 for $299 with no bids. You can probably get a 210 mm Caltar II for around $200 or so. L

Larry Kellogg
23-Feb-2014, 10:08
Be sure to budget for a spot meter, like one of the Pentax spots. The analog ones are good but they're more fragile than the digital equivalent.

Plus, you'll need a tripod, dark cloth, loupe, and some kind of bag to carry your gear. This game gets expensive in a hurry, as I have discovered for myself, but the image quality is stunning, and well worth the trouble.

I think you should look carefully at weight, and decide whether you want to go for a wooden folding field camera or a monorail. Monorails tend to be heavier and harder to carry in the field. Are you going to be mainly shooting outside or in a studio?

I started with a Wisner Technical Field camera, a beautiful camera, which can be had for around $600-900. Terrance Hounsell, who does large format photography in Newfoundland wrote an excellent review of the camera, after using it for five years: http://www.largeformatphotography.info/cameras/wisner-expedition-technical/

Be sure to compare the bellows draw on different cameras, as this limits how long a lens you can shoot on the camera. Oh, be sure to watch some videos on how to unfold cameras like this, you have to take care to not to crinkle the bellows. Once the bellows are crinkled, there is no un-crinkling them.

Good luck!

Peter De Smidt
23-Feb-2014, 11:04
As others have said, first decide what kind of pictures you want to take. Consider how important weight, packability, versatility, sturdiness, and ease of use are. Do you know what range of lenses you'd like to use? If you eventually want to use super wides or very long lenses, then these impact what camera to get. Also find out all of the accessories that you'll need. List them. Now is your budget just for the camera, or will it have to include all of the accessories? At the very least, you'll need film, camera, lens, cable release, tripod head, tripod, case, loupe, film holders, dark cloth, meter. Plus, there are development costs... The more specific you get, the better the advice you'll receive.

gleaf
23-Feb-2014, 11:11
Jon Shiu has a Graphic II for sale under $200. Holders for film, lens board and a decent lens would need to be added.. It is fairly easy to put together an outfit under your price range. Calumet C-401's are also nice rugged and available used.

Jac@stafford.net
23-Feb-2014, 11:36
KEH will even help you assemble what you need. Just tell them you are starting from scratch.
They will point you to some very good buys.

Jim Jones
23-Feb-2014, 12:19
Jon Shiu has a Graphic II for sale under $200. Holders for film, lens board and a decent lens would need to be added.. It is fairly easy to put together an outfit under your price range. Calumet C-401's are also nice rugged and available used.

Yes, indeed! I still occasionally use the B&J flatbed bought in 1974, although it has been supplemented by monorails and press/technical cameras as bargains have appeared. The Graphic I and II are neat elegant cameras. The Calumet functions as well. B&J also made monorails in the same class. An Inba Ikeda or Tachihara weights about half as much as my B&J flatbed, and is more compact. This can be valuable where hiking is involved. Your first 4x5 view camera may well not be your last. With experience, you might want different features. So, don't try to select the perfect camera for you now. Choose one that is good enough, and learn from it.

Peter De Smidt
23-Feb-2014, 12:20
Is the original poster shooting near his vehicle, or is she planning on backpacking? If the latter, I've done it with a Sinar. It was no fun.

StoneNYC
23-Feb-2014, 12:21
Is the original poster shooting near his vehicle, or is he planning on backpacking? If the latter, I've done it with a Sinar. It was no fun.

Her

Drew Bedo
23-Feb-2014, 13:45
Sometimes a Zone VI outfit comes up on e-Bay within or very near your price range. Price depends on what is included. The camera alone (no lens) will be $700-$800. They are pretty and work well.

Another option is a Burk and James. They are old, a little 'clunky" and not pretty, but have about any movement you need. Also look for Ansco/Agfa.

Jac@stafford.net
23-Feb-2014, 13:49
thx for sharing Jeff. I like KEH too, i got my first hasselblad from them. but the problem is there aren't many options on KEH when i comes to LF.

There are a lot of 4x5 cameras at KEH, and reasonably priced, too.
Lenses are a different story. A lot of WA, not many nominal-normal lenses.

John Kasaian
23-Feb-2014, 15:50
also where to buy film holder? god i know nothing!
If you know nothing, you'll be money well spent buying a book and reading up on the subject first, then finding someone near you who will show you their LF kit and maybe shoot a few sheets just to see what you're getting yourself into. It's easy to waste a lot of money real fast if you "know nothing":)
I suggest Steve Simmons Using The View Camera.
Good luck!

StoneNYC
23-Feb-2014, 16:11
If you know nothing, you'll be money well spent buying a book and reading up on the subject first, then finding someone near you who will show you their LF kit and maybe shoot a few sheets just to see what you're getting yourself into. It's easy to waste a lot of money real fast if you "know nothing":)
I suggest Steve Simmons Using The View Camera.
Good luck!

She's used LF in school so she's shot before, just that now school is over and it's time to get her own :)

yuexiachou29
23-Feb-2014, 17:23
i ve used 4x5 before and read the book. i know nothing about what equipment to get. i was using whatever the school had.

yuexiachou29
23-Feb-2014, 18:00
thx Stone.

StoneNYC
23-Feb-2014, 18:22
thx Stone.

;)

Kodachrome25
24-Feb-2014, 22:51
Go to ebay and look up greatsaltlakephoto, he is a member here and always has lots of nice kits, maybe you can get ahold of him, tell him you are a member here and strike a deal.

And no, for god's sakes, don't get a Sinar if you want a field camera, they are studio tanks, not practical for field work. I had an F2 for about 3 days that I had bought for a macro project and my god, I would have never used that thing, just way too heavy and my Chamonix blew it away in terms of getting the shots I had bought it for.

jwaddison
24-Feb-2014, 23:58
I sent you a personal message.

DrTang
25-Feb-2014, 08:44
find someone selling out on craigslist in the area - you might have to seach several towns over time

eventually - you will find somone 'over it' and selling everything you need (and more) for 1000 or less..sometimes way less

buy the package - much better value and they may even have left over film so you can shoot that day

Peter De Smidt
25-Feb-2014, 09:05
For a field camera, the Toyo AR, ARII and AX are very solid, easy to use cameras. (I prefer the AX, but all are good.) Versions are still sold new, for about $2000, and thus parts and service should be available for the foreseeable future. Used ones have fallen quite a bit in value, though, and you should be able to pick up a decent example in the $500 range. Using lenses from 90mm to about 300mm are ok, and you can go wider and longer with accessories. Don't get me wrong, I like old wooden cameras too, and my 8x10 is from the 1920s, but old wooden cameras can have a number of gotchyas that might cause issues for a newbie. For instance, I had to have my 8x10 repaired, as some of the wood warped. The camera is also much more prone to vibrations than my Toyo.

The best value lenses are probably 150s and 210s. For example, something like this (http://www.keh.com/camera/Large-Format-Fixed-Focal-Length-Lenses/1/sku-LF06009031347N?r=FE) would be good. Again, you can take a risk on an old lens in a strange shutter, but there are lots of gotchyas there. For instance, the filter threads, flash sync, mounting hole size...might be non-standard. Old shutters might need a CLA (Clean, Lube Adjust), which costs about $100. The best value for a beginner is probably a lens from the 1980s from Fuji, Nikon, Schneider, Rodenstock, or some of the private label version of these. The shutters are modern and reliable.... If you buy from a place like KEH, the lens should be ready to go. If you buy from a guy on Craigslist, you still might need a CLA.

Larry Kellogg
25-Feb-2014, 09:13
There is a Burke and James 4x5 on here for $190, http://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showthread.php?111371-Burke-amp-James-camera-with-4x5-back-extras-excellent-operating-condition, hard to beat that price, and you will have money left over for a lens, tripod, and other gear.

StoneNYC
25-Feb-2014, 09:15
There is a Burke and James 4x5 on here for $190, http://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showthread.php?111371-Burke-amp-James-camera-with-4x5-back-extras-excellent-operating-condition, hard to beat that price, and you will have money left over for a lens, tripod, and other gear.

Get on this !!

Jon Shiu
25-Feb-2014, 10:22
What about a Graflex Super Graphic camera at around $150-200? Has front movements. Is compact and not too heavy.

Jon

Peter De Smidt
25-Feb-2014, 10:42
Jon, that's a good choice, too.

csxcnj
25-Feb-2014, 15:08
What about a Graflex Super Graphic camera at around $150-200? Has front movements. Is compact and not too heavy.

Jon

Where are you finding Graflex Super's in any kind of decent shape at that price range? Haven't seen anything but junk at that level. Good ones I've seen are $400 and above.

Thom Bennett
26-Feb-2014, 08:10
I would recommend getting a simple press camera (Crown Graphic, Bush Pressman, etc.) and a decent lens and spend the bulk of your money on film, processing and printing. You will learn, over time, more specifically what your needs are and you'll know when it is time to upgrade your camera, if ever. Even before changing cameras I would recommend adding a lens or two. You'll be surprised what you can do with a simple camera.

NancyP
28-Feb-2014, 10:06
Hi yuexiachou29, let's form the "god I know nothing" club, I am a complete novice as well. It is rather fun starting from scratch - I haven't shot and home-developed (135) B&W film since 1980. I would suggest trying to find a friendly LF photographer in your town. Alan Gales has been very helpful to me, gave me a very good deal on an old budget studio camera, lens, holders, etc, and it is great to see a demonstration of camera and lens in person. I figure that I can meter using a digital camera in spot meter mode. Time to get started on all those mistakes I need to commit :rolleyes: