Looking for a 4x5 Field Camera - Suggestions?

[jrmst102]

Hello,

I have had a Tachihara 4x5, it was a great beauty but I had to sold it due to financial hardship. I currently own a Canon DSLR systems but I am looking to come back to 4x5 photography. Based on my experience with the Tachihara, I am looking for:

(a) Portability
(b) Quality
(c) Easy of use

In no particular order. In spite that I mostly used the Tachihara for portraits and landscapes, I am looking to work mainly portraits with the 4x5.

In a recent survey of what is available in the market, I have found the Tachihara to be particularly expensive, and Wista and similar cameras are either expensive or in need to serious TLC.

I have also found a Calumet Cambo, Calumet NX, Sinar F and similar rail cameras that are sold as "field" cameras. I have not experience with them but they are in my budget. In particular, the Calumet fits my budget very well.

Could I get advise on which camera (Calumet, Sinar, Toyo View, etc.) would be the most natural transition from a Tachihara? I know that these are not apples versus apples but if I can find an affordable camera that is also portable, with a reasonable good quality and easy of use, I will consider it in lieu of a Tachihara or a Wista.

I am already aware of differences such as:

(a) Cherry wood versus plastic or metal
(b) Folding versus rail
(c) Rotating back versus fixed back
(d) Fitting in a small backpack versus fitting in a carrying case or backpack with rails

But I am curious about whether a Calumet Cambo, NX, Sinar F can be used as a "field" camera. I will appreciate your advice.

Many thanks

Regards

[Alan Gales]

Yes, Calumet, Cambo, Toyo and Sinar F series monorails can and are used by some photographers as field cameras. The lightest ones will weigh about 8 lbs and are a bit bulky to pack in a back pack but it can and is being done.

Transitioning from a Tachihara to any monorail is easy. It's harder to transition from a monorail to a field camera because some of the movements on field cameras are not all that straight forward. Also on a monorail you have all the movements where I think all field cameras are compromised somewhere, especially in back movements.

[Alan Gales]

Oh, there is a Calumet/Cambo Cadet and another brand of monorail (the name escapes me right now) that are ultralights. Finding lens boards and bag bellows for them may be a bit difficult though.

Welcome to the Forum!

[soeren]

Expensive as in ?.??$?

[Regular Rod]

Hello,

I have had a Tachihara 4x5, it was a great beauty but I had to sold it due to financial hardship. I currently own a Canon DSLR systems but I am looking to come back to 4x5 photography. Based on my experience with the Tachihara, I am looking for:

(a) Portability
(b) Quality
(c) Easy of use

In no particular order. In spite that I mostly used the Tachihara for portraits and landscapes, I am looking to work mainly portraits with the 4x5.

In a recent survey of what is available in the market, I have found the Tachihara to be particularly expensive, and Wista and similar cameras are either expensive or in need to serious TLC.

I have also found a Calumet Cambo, Calumet NX, Sinar F and similar rail cameras that are sold as "field" cameras. I have not experience with them but they are in my budget. In particular, the Calumet fits my budget very well.

Could I get advise on which camera (Calumet, Sinar, Toyo View, etc.) would be the most natural transition from a Tachihara? I know that these are not apples versus apples but if I can find an affordable camera that is also portable, with a reasonable good quality and easy of use, I will consider it in lieu of a Tachihara or a Wista.

I am already aware of differences such as:

(a) Cherry wood versus plastic or metal
(b) Folding versus rail
(c) Rotating back versus fixed back
(d) Fitting in a small backpack versus fitting in a carrying case or backpack with rails

But I am curious about whether a Calumet Cambo, NX, Sinar F can be used as a "field" camera. I will appreciate your advice.

Many thanks

Regards

If you are looking to buy new then take a look at SHEN HAO PTB45B (http://www.shen-hao.com/PRODUCTSabout.aspx?i=953&id=n3). I have it's big sister in 8x10 and it is very easy to use and built with great quality.

http://www.shen-hao.com/Postimage/big/20110520091056.jpg


Second hand and low budget but excellent see if you can source an MPP Mk VII.

http://www.mppusers.com/mtmkvii.jpg

RR

[Tim Meisburger]

You should just buy another Tachi. Does everything.

[Drew Bedo]

I like my Zone VI. It does whatever I want and looks great. Well made in the 1980s and still a great value for the money.

Complete shooting kits come up on auction sites from time to time at ~$1500 or less depending on the gear it comes with. The camera itself will run <$900.

[smithdoor]

Try Crown or Speed Graflex
Has work great for me since 1973

Dave

[Preston]

Interesting that the Shen-Hao PTB54B looks so similar to the Chamonix 045 series cameras. If you like the Shen-Hao PTB, then the Chamonix 045N-1, N-2, or the new F1 is certainly worth a look. I have a Chamonix 045N-2 and like it a lot.

--P

[Drew Wiley]

You'll get a lot of conflicting answers to this kind of question because we all have personal preferences based on individual experience. You should probably first
decide whether you want a folding full-featured camera, a semi-featured "technical" folder, or a monorail. There are lots of bargains out there, as well as a number
of very nice new cameras. But remember that once cameras get too lightweight, unless they are very well designed, they are going to become more subject to wind
shake and other foibles outdoors. Another initial consideration is what kinds of focal lengths and respectives angles of view do you prefer - this will affect what type
and length of bellows you need, hence what categories of cameras you want to investigate more closely. It would be very helpful for you to look up some large
format photographers in your area so you can see these things in actual use and form your own preference.

[Peter Lewin]

Drew is absolutely right, that each of us will tell you what we like the most. I will try to restrict my response to experience: I have owned a Sinar F, a ZoneVI/Wista (which is very similar to your Tachihara), and my current Canham DLC 4x5 (which was my compromise, but is way out of your implied price range).

The Sinar F was designed to be Sinar's "field camera" (F for Field), but that is in comparison to the Sinar P which was their studio camera. So it's lighter than other Sinars, but heavier than most (all?) wooden folding cameras. Unlike folders, which collapse into a box-shaped package, the Sinar F was designed for you to disconnect the bellows from the front standard, fold the two standards down parallel to the monorail, unscrew any monorail extensions you might have, and end up with a "relatively" compact package looking something like a narrow box on top of a pipe. You could fit it into a small backpack, but loose, not in any sort of protective case (the shape is just too awkward). So the downside was weight, packing shape, and a slightly slower set-up process. In return you had essentially an infinitely flexible, well-made all metal and plastic camera. Throw in a bag bellows, some monorail extension sections, and you could handle virtually any lens, and in fact since it was a "system camera," configure almost any set-up (behind the lens shutter, reflex viewer, etc.) that you could think of.

The Wista (think your Tachihara) was limited both in wide-angle lens and very long lens capability, didn't have all the movements of the Sinar, nor it's rigidity. But it was about 1/2 the weight, easier to pack, and quicker to set-up. Also, with smaller lens boards, there were lenses within its focal range that wouldn't fit simply because they were too big for the board (think of Petzval lenses), while the Sinar boards are big enough for anything.

So in comparison, the Tachihara is better suited for landscape work where you have to do some hiking, the Tachihara and the Sinar are equal for portraits, and the Sinar wins out for architecture or close-up work.

P.S. You could substitute "Cambo" for "Sinar F" in everything above, but the Cambo is even heavier, and as far as I know the accessory range is limited relative to Sinar's.

[Drew Wiley]

Peter - I backpacked with a Sinar F 4x5 for many years, and it was much faster to operate than any wooden folder, because I left it set up in the backpack. All I had to do was put the thing on the tripod and extend the rail standards. I could even leave any lens in place. The big advantage of a Sinar is the extreme range of movements and extension. And it's rugged system with readily available replacement parts. But it is a bit bulky, so I prefer a little Ebony folder for airline travel or
long backpacking trips. There was once a time when Tachis and little wooden Wistas were popular with backpackers, but they also struck me as a little on the flimsy
side.

[gsinico]

I suggest
- Chamonix (whatever model you can bring) best for backpack and extensions of bellow, very light and sturdy.
- wista field (the wooden one)
it is similar to tachiara but faster to open and fix.
You can have a small lens fit on it, such a 135 or 150mm primary lens and close the wista leaving the lens on.
- arca swiss F, it is a leisure fast to backpack but heavy monorail, better than the sinar F.
- an Ebony, but it is very expensive if you look for nicer models.

I've used all of them except for the ebony, and now I bring a Chamonix for outdoor landscape, and the Arca when I need big smooth movments and the car is close to the subject!

[Peter Lewin]

Drew: I don't think we are disagreeing, merely our experiences are a little different. I also did a lot of hiking with my Sinar F, almost always sticking it in a now-ancient Sierra Designs "guide pack." Partly for compactness, and partly because I simply followed Sinar's instructions, I would fold it up.

When a friend decided to sell his Z6/Wista, I grabbed it and also used it for quite a while. I got an adaptor board for the Sinar, so I had all my lenses on Wista boards, but could also use them on the Sinar.

Ultimately I wanted to simplify, and saw the Canham as a good compromise, with the rigidity of an all-metal camera, the ability to handle a pretty wide range of focal lengths, but some of the weight and portability advantages of the folder. I sold the other two to buy the Canham. In retrospect, while I would do the same thing again, I do miss the Sinar. Perhaps we all should just own a bunch of cameras!

[Andrew Plume]

You should just buy another Tachi. Does everything.

+1 as Tim says

[Maris Rusis]

I now use Tachiharas in the field, both the 8x10 and 4x5 versions, but in the past I had to use monorails (8x10 and 4x5 again) because they were "cheap" and available.

The secret for me was to practice carrying a monorail on a tripod over one shoulder then the other as fatigue accumulated. This way I could do one set-up at the car and then walk into the forest for a day of shooting with the camera fully deployed. Putting the camera down to relieve the weight meant putting it down on the tripod. The camera was covered by a garbage bag to keep it waterproof so I wouldn't have to disassemble and pack it away even during rain storms.

[sceptic]

I've read quite a few suggestions about Chamonix as well. I myself am also looking for my first LF camera. From my understanding they were around $700 new in the past, but closer to $1,000 new now. I am having trouble finding a second hand version. Any suggestions?

[uphereinmytree]

I now use a deardorff 5x7 with a 4x5 reducing back. It's light weight considering it has enough bellows and strength to handle a 450mm nikkor M and still allow the use of a 75mm lens. I used to have a tachihara and couldn't deal with the front base tilt. I also carry a cambo around sometimes when I'm feeling strong. My poor zone vi (wisner style) is smooth and pretty and better crafted than the deardorff, but sits on the shelf now.

[Alan Gales]

I've read quite a few suggestions about Chamonix as well. I myself am also looking for my first LF camera. From my understanding they were around $700 new in the past, but closer to $1,000 new now. I am having trouble finding a second hand version. Any suggestions?

They do come up for sale on occasion. The problem is that they are a newer brand so there are not as many produced yet as some other brands. Also the people who buy Chamonix cameras seem to really like them and hold on to them.

You could post in the Forum's for sale section that you are looking for one. Maybe someone has one they are willing to part with.

[jrmst102]

Dear Alan, Peter, Drew,

Many thanks for your kind and insightful replies. I just got a Calumet NX. I believe that it will be an easy transition from the Tachihara - as said by Alan - but it won't be a full-featured as presented by Drew. I found that I have to compromise features for portability and the Calumet got me the best value plus a lot of compatible options out there. In addition, I like the fact that the camera has a rotating back and it seems even compatible with digital backs (I rather shoot in B&W but I have two Calumet stores nearby and I can rent a digital back over the weekend). My next quest is to get the right lens. I am aiming for a 150 f5.6 and a 180 f.56 but as said by Drew, I will need to research better the lenses when it comes to wide angle and telephotos since I might need a different bellows.

The camera is in a mint quality, which is great given my poor camera restoration skills and I can stop by the local Calumet store and try before buy some lenses (I know that I can do it with any other camera).

In response to Tim, I might still get a Tachihara down the road, as of now, it seems like they are asking over $1,000 for one (although I am bargaining for one at $500 but it seems like it will sell for more than that) and I have yet to invest in the lenses (I have the rest of the equipment from my previous experience with the Tachihara). I also tried to get ahold of a Shen-Hao and a Zone VI but the former was too costly (again, over $1,000) and I could not win the bidding on the latter.

I was also interested in a Crown or Speed Graphics but frankly, what I found was a bunch of old cameras that needed restoration. I would rather be taking photographs. Nevertheless, I have a great feeling for a good Crown or Speed Graphics.

So, thanks for your kind and instructive answers. I have to admit that the posts by Alan and Drew made me decided for a view camera.

I will post another threads with recommendation on lenses. I have used Schneider lenses but I want an assortment such as :

.- A regular lens (135mm, 150mm or 180mm)
.- A wide angle lens (90mm perhaps?)
.- A long lens (300mm?)
.- A macro lens (I have yet to see the Nikkor Macro lenses)

Thanks

Regards

[jrmst102]

I wish, as matter of fact, I bought mine when living in London (and earning in GBP) from Midwest Photo Exchange. But now I am earning US$ and they are now out of reach for me!.

I should have never sold my Tachihara in first place.

Thanks

[jrmst102]

I tried to get ahold of a Sinar F after reading your posts but somebody else outbid me in eBay. So, I got a Calumet NX. I read some great comments about the Sinar F and F1 in this forum.

[jrmst102]

They do come up for sale on occasion. The problem is that they are a newer brand so there are not as many produced yet as some other brands. Also the people who buy Chamonix cameras seem to really like them and hold on to them.

You could post in the Forum's for sale section that you are looking for one. Maybe someone has one they are willing to part with.

Dear Alan,

Thanks. I got a Calumet NX today.

Next quest : lenses

Regards

[jrmst102]

Ciao

My teacher Yoke Matze had a Arca Swiss and I learned there before moving with a Tachihara. I never tried a Chamonix or a Wista. Will consider as well Giovanni. In the meantime, I got ahold of a mint Calumet NX and will focus on the lens before trying to get a more field camera such as the Tachihara (or Chamonix, Wista or Zone VI).

Grazie Giovanni,

[jrmst102]

Alan,

Thanks, what are you using for instant film? I have an Polaroid 545i and found that the film is not longer available ( I know, it was back in 2007 when I was using 4x5 and the film was available, at least at my local store).

Do you have the new Fuji Instant Film Holder, Polaroid 550 or are you still sourcing film for the 545?

Thanks again

Regards

[Alan Gales]

I don't shoot instant film so I have no advice to offer there. I started with large format 4 years ago and Polaroid quit making film soon after.

Congratulations on your Calumet NX. Since you mentioned possibly buying a field camera down the line, I would keep my eye open for a Cambo to Technika board. Tachihara's, Chamonix's Shen Hao's, and Wista's all use Technika style boards so you could easily swap your lenses from your monorail to your field camera.

The general consensus here about lenses is to buy a "normal" focal length lens, shoot a lot of film with it and then decide what focal lengths you want later. I agree with this advice although I didn't follow it. ;) I bought the 75mm I thought I wanted right away only to sell it later and replace it with a 90mm.

A "normal" focal length is considered to be 135mm through 180mm. Some add the 210mm lens and call it a "long normal". The 210 is very popular for portraiture so you might consider it. My advice is to buy a clean Schneider, Rodenstock, Nikkor, Fujinon or Caltar in an accurate modern Copal shutter.

What lens did you use with your Tachihara? Were you happy with it or did you feel you wanted something a little longer or shorter?

[ProfMS]

I have a 4x5 field camera for landscapes. For portraits, I use a Mamiya 7. The 4x5 is too slow. What is important in portraits is not to miss the elusive moment in which the person photographed opens up. I find it too difficult to do it with a view camera, unless I use a digital back.