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NancyP
27-Jan-2014, 18:12
I am trying to figure out what I will need for 4 x 5 LF work, and today I want to learn about 2-sheet film holders - talk about unglamorous! I figure that I can start accumulating the parts needed, and you can't get any more basic than film holders. You can do without a lens (pinhole), but you can't do without a film holder if you plan to shoot standard sheet film.

1. What brands are good? (good defined as: keeps the sheet film sufficiently flat, dark protection ok, doesn't scratch film, not flimsy)
2. Should one buy new or used? (I might add, ARE there any new film holders?)
3. How to tell if a used film holder is damaged? (not light proof, has dirt inside that scratches). There's a ton of used holders on eBay.
4. Do all 4 x 5 2-sheet film holders fit all view cameras (folders or monorails)?

Karl A
27-Jan-2014, 19:08
Here are some new ones:

http://www.freestylephoto.biz/24500-Fidelity-4x5-Double-Sided-Sheet-Film-Holder-Twin-Pack

They should be good enough for any application. Toyo are also available new too, and are a bit more expensive.

If you buy used, you will see a lot of Fidelity and Lisco Regal, which are both essentially the same. In that case, try to get them in as clean condition as possible. If they look beat up, there might be issues with light leaks etc. Look at the dark slide for starters, they need to close completely flush. If they look very dirty, I would be sceptical of buying them, personally. The advantage of used is the prices will be a lot lower.

Any brand should fit any modern view camera, the dimensions are standard.

Lffbug
27-Jan-2014, 21:19
I am trying to figure out what I will need for 4 x 5 LF work, and today I want to learn about 2-sheet film holders - talk about unglamorous! I figure that I can start accumulating the parts needed, and you can't get any more basic than film holders. You can do without a lens (pinhole), but you can't do without a film holder if you plan to shoot standard sheet film.

1. What brands are good? (good defined as: keeps the sheet film sufficiently flat, dark protection ok, doesn't scratch film, not flimsy)
2. Should one buy new or used? (I might add, ARE there any new film holders?)
3. How to tell if a used film holder is damaged? (not light proof, has dirt inside that scratches). There's a ton of used holders on eBay.
4. Do all 4 x 5 2-sheet film holders fit all view cameras (folders or monorails)?

Here are my thoughts and opinions on the matter. Others are more qualified than me to answer.

1. I've used several like Lisco, Fidelity, Riteway, and some others, both wood and plastic. Any of them can be quite alright, if they're in good enough condition.
2. I guess it depends on their situation. I would probably buy used and put any savings toward a lens, if you don't have one yet... [reading (perhaps incorrectly) between the lines]
3. Dirt and grime can be cleaned. If they're not broken, have the correct dark slides, and the hinge tape is okay, that's a good start on being light tight. Maybe there are no guarantees to be had here. IMO, I think it's best to store the film holders in dark locations, just in case.
4. All? Not certain; there are probably some odd ball exceptions out there. Most? Yes, I would think so.

AtlantaTerry
27-Jan-2014, 21:49
Be careful, I once bought a two-pack of new-in-box 4x5 sheet film holders from an eBay seller in Los Angeles. I really believe they are Chinese knock-offs because they have several problems:

1. they are a tiny bit too large inside so film does not want to stay under the little tracks.

2. they are constructed so loosely that the two halves of the holder can flex a bit then the film can shift sideways and get pinched which ends up with the image being crooked when developed.

3. there are NO ridges across the 4" dimensions. Those ridges need to be there for a reason: they act as a bit of a light trap but more importantly they serve to position the film holder in the correct place and they keep the film holder from pulling out along with the dark slide.

These are the only film holders that I own out of about 100 that are riveted together. So if you EVER see an ad for 4x5 sheet film holders that shows rivets RUN!

By the time I discovered these problems it was too late to get a refund. I figure I can fix problem #2 by removing the rivets, using epoxy glue to affix the halves then rivet them back together.



I buy used 4x5" sheet film holders from eBay sellers for about US $5 to $8. Often they need cleaning but that's OK. One thing I learned is to not use pre-packaged 1x1" alcohol squares to clean the matte black 4x5" area because sometimes that matte black coating comes off. Now I use wipes that are designed for LCD displays.

IMHO do not buy wood film holders because if they were stored improperly they can be warped. Plastic ones do not have that problem.

What you will read here is that some holders were badly made so your film is in the wrong image plane. I am no expert in this area so would like to know how to measure the holders.

If the tape on the end flap is worn out or damaged you can replace it with black book binding tape.

The final problem you will run into with used holders is cracked dark slides. I'm not sure if there is a good way to repair the crack because the dark slides are thin yet need to be flexible.

Tip: once you have film holders that are "keepers" number them so when you are creating photos you can keep track of which side has what exposed image. I use a Brother TZ label printer.

Some people like to notch the end flap with a small file. They develop a coding system so the notch codes match the holder side number. This notch will show up on the film after developing. That way if over time you notice a problem with the same holder you can stop using it.

Tim Meisburger
27-Jan-2014, 22:49
Ya. I never worried about it. Just bought used ones on ebay from reputable sellers, and all mine are fine. (Some are old and some are newer)

Liquid Artist
27-Jan-2014, 23:38
I think that I have around 30 mixed brands I bought used and none have any noticeable light leaks.
I did want to buy some new Toyo's however I have read that they stink and my nose is very sensitive.

My research has taught me that Toyo does make the most consistent film holders, so if you find some oldies that don't stink or can put with the smell they may be worth the investment.

Heroique
27-Jan-2014, 23:51
Should one buy new or used?

When it's holders, maybe a poll would show a close race between "used is okay" vs. "always buy new."

From the threads I've read, I bet "used is okay" would win at the tape.

But count me in the "always buy new" category – I've learned my lesson.

Doremus Scudder
28-Jan-2014, 01:45
When it's holders, maybe a poll would show a close race between "used is okay" vs. "always buy new."

From the threads I've read, I bet "used is okay" would win at the tape.

But count me in the "always buy new" category I've learned my lesson.

I'm in exactly the opposite category as Heroique here: I would never buy new. There are so many good used holders out there for so much less that it is more economical to simply buy a bunch of used ones, clean them up, test them and get rid of the ones that leak.

As for cleaning up used holders: don't be afraid to get them wet, especially the plastic ones. Soaking them in some mild detergent and warm water and then rinsing in running water (through the light trap too, to get any crud out) seems to restore 90% of them to great working order. Make sure to let them dry thoroughly.

Of course, if there are stickers or other remnants of adhesive, etc. on them, you need to clean that off carefully. I use everything from erasers to mild solvents (and Goo-Gone) to acetone on a cotton swab. This latter is good for getting rid of ink markings in the white areas of some holders.

Don't use strong solvents on the flat black septum inside the holder. If there is bare metal showing on the septums you can touch up small defects with a Sharpie or paint the whole inside of the holder with flat black spray paint (I use Rustoleum).

Wipe down the holders and vacuum them clean. Once your holders are clean, examine the light traps with a strong flashlight from inside and out. If you have any doubts, test them: load them with a piece of 4x5" photo paper, insert them into the camera back, making sure they seat properly, make sure the lens is closed, pull the darkslide and expose the light trap to bright light. The sun is best, but a flashlight will work too. Develop the paper and see if there are any light leaks. If not, you are good to go. If so, you may be able to rejuvenate the light trap by washing again.

Keep in mind that even the best light traps sometimes leak a little light. Most users of film holders try to keep the light trap area shaded or covered when the dark slide is pulled. I like to keep the dark cloth over the back of the camera whenever possible. When not, I shade the light trap area with the pulled dark slide or cover the end of the filmholder with a small black cardboard cover that I cobbled together out of the inside of old sheet film boxes.

As for brands: any of them are fine with the exception of the poorly-made Chinese ones mentioned above (I've heard about them before, but never seen one) as long as they are in good enough condition. I have everything from newer Lisco, Fideleity and Riteway holders to older wooden Graflex holders and they all work fine. For some reason, though, I really like the older wooden holders I have... Maybe just my aversion to plastic rearing its head.

Best,

Doremus

John Kasaian
28-Jan-2014, 07:45
For used, I think the old style plastic Riteways are a safe bet. Always check used holders with photo paper as others here have said.

Ari
28-Jan-2014, 08:00
Save yourself a lot of trouble and misery, buy new or used Toyo holders.

There is nothing worse than having a film holder that is out of register with your GG, or bent, or sloppily constructed.

Buying other brands, in my experience, are akin to playing roulette.

If you buy Toyos, you will buy them once.

mdarnton
28-Jan-2014, 08:07
I have a bunch bought used that I've accumulated over the years. Personally, I think the key to buying used is to look at the corners that go in first. Are they all beat up and worn? Stay away. When I see perfect ones of any era on Ebay with a cheap opening bid and low shipping relative to the number of holders (figure bid + holders, divide by holders, stay under $4 each, is my rule) , I throw on a minimum bid and let it sit there. Once in a while, for whatever reason, no one else bids, and I win. I just bought 11 wooden Graflex brand holders on Ebay that were virtually brand new. Including shipping, they cost me $2 each. I guess because they were old and not plastic (???!!) no one wanted them.

Of all the holders I have, I think the wooden Graflex type are the best made.

NancyP
28-Jan-2014, 09:16
Wow, a great response. Thanks for your help, everyone.

smithdoor
28-Jan-2014, 09:32
I have purchase new and use both work well
I did sell some for cash, sold them for $6.00 to $10.00 plus shipping

Hope this helps
Dave

PS I am not sell any more at this time

Alan Gales
28-Jan-2014, 09:41
Nancy, I have bought Riteways and Fidelity Elites still in the box for cheap. The owners didn't know if they had been used or were new old stock. They sure looked new. I also own some almost new Toyo's that came with a camera I purchased. I have never bought new film holders.

I have sent you a private message about used film holders. Of course if you feel more comfortable buying new go ahead. If I bought new I would spend the extra money on the Toyo's myself. New 4x5 holders are not real expensive. Not like new 8x10 film holders!

John Kasaian
28-Jan-2014, 12:18
When buying Toyos, smell them first. Don't buy stinkers.

Alan Gales
28-Jan-2014, 12:42
When buying Toyos, smell them first. Don't buy stinkers.

I bought a set of American made Klein screwdrivers and the handles stunk real bad. My daughter and wife had a fit. I took them outside and let them off gas for a few hours and the smell went away. My used Toyo film holders don't stink but I know there have been complaints about new ones sometimes.

The funny thing is most everyone seems to love the new car smell and it's the same thing! When I bought my Jeep new I took the top down and got rid of the smell as soon as possible! ;)

NancyP
28-Jan-2014, 14:17
This is too funny - stinky film holders. Rest assured that I am immune to most stink - I am a pathologist. :)
Alan, I am amazed that you could FIND American made screwdrivers. I go into Home Depot and everything I pick up seems to be made in China. :( The one advantage of made-in-China tape measures is that some have both inches and centimeters on the same tape.

AtlantaTerry
28-Jan-2014, 14:19
Nancy, some Ace Hardware stores carry German screwdrivers. Look for ones with a black handle and red rotating top.

Alan Gales
28-Jan-2014, 14:50
This is too funny - stinky film holders. Rest assured that I am immune to most stink - I am a pathologist. :)
Alan, I am amazed that you could FIND American made screwdrivers. I go into Home Depot and everything I pick up seems to be made in China. :( The one advantage of made-in-China tape measures is that some have both inches and centimeters on the same tape.

Nancy, I'm very familiar with Klein tools and I ordered them online. They are very popular with Electricians. I was also in the building trades as a Sheet Metal Worker. It's so depressing for me to walk into Home Depot and Lowes and see all the American tool names which I knew and loved that are now manufactured in China.

toolbox
28-Jan-2014, 16:51
Most of my 4x5 holders are old kind of beat up Riteways. They work fine, and I probably paid about $5 a piece for them over the years. Some of the fancier ones will be a little easier to remove/install the dark slide, but as far as being functional the old Riteways are fine.

Leigh
28-Jan-2014, 17:07
Modern Fidelity, Riteway, and Lisco holders are all made by the same company.
Whether they all are made on the same machines/tooling is not known (by me anyway).

The Toyo holders are generally thought to be the best available, and priced accordingly.

I have standardized on the latest version of the Riteway holders.
These have an automatic slide lock, with a little white button sticking out the front.

They also have two rotating number discs that imprint on the film, outside the image frame.
I use that feature to key into my shooting log.

- Leigh

c.d.ewen
28-Jan-2014, 17:14
Hmmm....am I the only one who uses Linhofs? No mention of them in this thread.

Charley

john borrelli
28-Jan-2014, 18:58
Nancy, I have been using Chamonix film holders and some Toyo holders which I had purchased prior to the Chamonix holders.

This may be a little off topic but after you have bought the film holders the real challenge begins, namely loading them properly, using them properly in the field or studio, and unloading the holders for processing without errors. We all make errors in one of those steps from time to time. If you have not loaded film holders in total darkness before, definitely practice in day light with a piece of film or two. I would recommend using one type of film for a while as it reduces the number of these little errors. In closing, there are Youtube videos these days to help with film loading, prior to that there was a Paul Butzi web site, which may still exist.

All the best, welcome to LF, and please ask any questions here on the forum, John

towolf
28-Jan-2014, 19:40
Who needs one hundred film holders? Am I being naive?

StoneNYC
29-Jan-2014, 01:56
I have way too many right now, I'll be unloading some in the next few days...

Doremus Scudder
29-Jan-2014, 03:24
Who needs one hundred film holders? Am I being naive?

Yes, a bit... :)

I take 50 - 60 holders with me plus Readyloads (yep, still got some) and 35 loaded Mido holders when I go on a road trip. Sometimes I have to unload and reload twice during a few-week trip. And, I don't consider myself an especially prolific shooter. Five or six set-ups a day is average for me; maybe 8 or so negatives a day.

I've returned from many a trip with well over 200 negatives to develop (by hand in trays...), which takes a few days as well.

That's one thing I like about being able to buy used holders at such a good price these days; I can have the luxury of owning 100 film holders without breaking the bank.

Best,

Doremus

AtlantaTerry
29-Jan-2014, 03:47
Who needs one hundred film holders? Am I being nave?

The reason I bought about 100 used 4x5 sheet film holders is that I figure over time they are going to get more and more scarce and the price is only going to go up.

But the main reason is that I create character portraits on movie sets and also people who are into LARP (live action role playing) such as Dagorhir or Creative Anachronism, not landscape or architectural. On a given day I may have 20 or 30 portrait sittings and don't have the time or facilities to reload the holders. That's why I need so many.

Thank you for asking.

Dagorhir:
http://www.dagorhir.com/

Society for Creative Anachronism:
http://www.sca.org/

AtlantaTerry
29-Jan-2014, 03:56
One thing I forgot to mention about cleaning old sheet film holders is that I wax the dark slides.

Once the main body of the holder is cleaned and the light trap has been vacuumed out, I turn my attention to the dark slide.

First I flex it a bit looking for cracks or other damage. Then I use prepackaged 1x1 inch alcohol squares to clean both the dark slide and the handle. If the black of the handle is too worn, I repaint it.

Finally I draw the two long edges gently down a bar of bee's wax then rub it in with a lint-free cloth. Note: only the thin edge touches the wax. I feel this helps the dark slide smoothly move into and out of the sheet film holder when in use. I do NOT wax the short end because I feel all that is going to do is contaminate the felt light trap over time.

Heroique
29-Jan-2014, 03:59
NancyP probably needs a few less than a hundred as a beginner. ;^)

I sense that a new twin pack might get her into the field in no time & no worries w/o ebay or CL searches, warm water flushing, mild detergent soaking, drying, dust cleaning, vacuuming, adhesive and ink removal via solvents, black spray paint and sharpie touch-up, flashlight inspection, light-leak testing, test photo-paper cutting, exposing, developing, hanging, drying, evaluating, tossing bad holders, keeping good ones, etc., etc.

Those have all been great tips, by the way – as was towolf's hilarious remark.

StoneNYC
29-Jan-2014, 05:24
Yes, a bit... :)

I take 50 - 60 holders with me plus Readyloads (yep, still got some) and 35 loaded Mido holders when I go on a road trip. Sometimes I have to unload and reload twice during a few-week trip. And, I don't consider myself an especially prolific shooter. Five or six set-ups a day is average for me; maybe 8 or so negatives a day.

I've returned from many a trip with well over 200 negatives to develop (by hand in trays...), which takes a few days as well.

That's one thing I like about being able to buy used holders at such a good price these days; I can have the luxury of owning 100 film holders without breaking the bank.

Best,

Doremus

That's more a choice of not wanting to re-load every day in a dark tent though, you're not actually shooting 100-200 images a day ...

You could easily take 10-15 holders and empty them into boxes each night if you wanted to.

Or get GRAFLEX holders (which seems more practical for your system)


The reason I bought about 100 used 4x5 sheet film holders is that I figure over time they are going to get more and more scarce and the price is only going to go up.

But the main reason is that I create character portraits on movie sets and also people who are into LARP (live action role playing) such as Dagorhir or Creative Anachronism, not landscape or architectural. On a given day I may have 20 or 30 portrait sittings and don't have the time or facilities to reload the holders. That's why I need so many.

Thank you for asking.

Dagorhir:
http://www.dagorhir.com/

Society for Creative Anachronism:
http://www.sca.org/

No way!

You work in the movie industry and still shoot portraits with film? LF even?! Wish I worked in Atlanta! In NYC they only use the latest canon 5d's in their blimps. I've wanted to join 600 but it's 8,000 and no one knows me to hire... I do have a blimp though I never use it...

Doremus Scudder
29-Jan-2014, 08:08
That's more a choice of not wanting to re-load every day in a dark tent though, you're not actually shooting 100-200 images a day ... You could easily take 10-15 holders and empty them into boxes each night if you wanted to. ...

Yes, absolutely right, but I prefer not having to unload and reload my holders in the backcountry in a tent at night, especially in the winter or in dusty conditions. I'd much prefer to enjoy the campfire and a glass of spirits. When I do unload and reload, it is usually in a darkened motel bathroom, although I've done it in my (cleaned) sleeping bag inside the tent a time or two.

The convenience of not having to unload/reload so often is why I have so many holders; and the used price makes that possible for me.

Best,

Doremus

NancyP
29-Jan-2014, 09:18
Yep, it occurred to me that my first task was learning to load the things, and for that I need one holder and a sheet of paper for practice. I am accustomed to darkroom work, including work in total darkness (135 film reel loading). But, dry runs are important. For the time being, I can use one of the darkrooms at work for loading, those darkrooms are now used minimally and are devoid of equipment, but the rooms are still dark.

It strikes me that one of the key things is keeping good habits re: correct dark slide face out, recording data on individual holders and individual sheets of film, separating exposed from non-exposed holders so you don't grab the wrong one. It might behoove me to write down a checklist for each procedure, as I do for complicated experiments. When I have camera and lens in hand, I will need to do dry runs with it as well. Film development also seems as if it might take a little practice to keep the sheets evenly circulating when in the developing tray.

As a resource for other newbies, here's a text and photos website: http://photo-otaku.com/loading-4x5-sheet-film-holders/
and another one, mentioned by an earlier commentator: http://www.butzi.net/articles/filmload.htm
There is also a YouTube demo video:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XdnzJlNVg2I by AllAmericanRadioFive

There are also some explanations of Graflex holders and the Graflex 1258 6 sheet universal holder for cameras other than Graflex - pretty clever, that! The classic 2 sheet holder is the way I want to go at first, it seems simpler. No, I don't need 100. For the time being, I don't need 10.

AtlantaTerry
29-Jan-2014, 09:19
No way!

You work in the movie industry and still shoot portraits with film? LF even?! Wish I worked in Atlanta! In NYC they only use the latest Canon 5Ds in their blimps. I've wanted to join IATSE Local 600 but it's $8,000 and no one knows me to hire... I do have a blimp though I never use it...

Yes, I'm one of the few photographers in the country who works on sets of film and TV productions with large format film cameras. Maybe I'm the only one left. But, I also use a Nikon D3S and have a Jacobson blimp with lens tubes for it.

May I suggest your best bet is to work on indie films to build up your portfolio and reputation. Not all films are union, however, most every TV production is.

My IMDB:
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1669504/board/thread/100119963

smithdoor
29-Jan-2014, 09:41
I started with 4 new holders and with 1 or 2 12 holders (24 shoots) I found this number work will for most work. Over years I got used holder over 50 holder. They all work good even in sun light. I use my new ones only for important work as the cost today in $75.00 per pair.

Dave


I am trying to figure out what I will need for 4 x 5 LF work, and today I want to learn about 2-sheet film holders - talk about unglamorous! I figure that I can start accumulating the parts needed, and you can't get any more basic than film holders. You can do without a lens (pinhole), but you can't do without a film holder if you plan to shoot standard sheet film.

1. What brands are good? (good defined as: keeps the sheet film sufficiently flat, dark protection ok, doesn't scratch film, not flimsy)
2. Should one buy new or used? (I might add, ARE there any new film holders?)
3. How to tell if a used film holder is damaged? (not light proof, has dirt inside that scratches). There's a ton of used holders on eBay.
4. Do all 4 x 5 2-sheet film holders fit all view cameras (folders or monorails)?

StoneNYC
29-Jan-2014, 11:23
Nancy,

I can send you one for $6 shipping if you want. I'll put two sheets in it (already developed that I don't need because I messed them up).

Just know the dark slides are written on with sharpie, and written backward from everyone else... Meaning the side most call "exposed" and the side most call "unexposed" are backward.... To me it was about noticing... The BLACK wording on WHITE base saying "EXPOSED!!!" Was much easier to stop me from double exposing something....

So if you can live with that, I'll send you one of my crappy ones as a starter (it will still be light tight, but I almost always use a dark cloth over the Canada just in case).

Let me know.

StoneNYC
29-Jan-2014, 11:25
Yes, I'm one of the few photographers in the country who works on sets of film and TV productions with large format film cameras. Maybe I'm the only one left. But, I also use a Nikon D3S and have a Jacobson blimp with lens tubes for it.

May I suggest your best bet is to work on indie films to build up your portfolio and reputation. Not all films are union, however, most every TV production is.

My IMDB:
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1669504/board/thread/100119963

Cool! And yes but I can't afford to live off indie's they only pay about 1 day for a whole indie these days, the rest if the time they just pull stills from the HD canon videos they are using.....

Here is mine... You'll notice I'm also Mark R's stand in.

http://www.imdb.com/name/nm5192397

RandyB
29-Jan-2014, 11:54
Have you checked any of the camera stores in St. Louis? There used to be a shop in Clayton the handled a lot of LF equipment. Shillers and Creve Couer on Olive might have a few holders in their used stock. I try to visit each store in person when I'm in town, I've found that if you call you may not get a person who knows the used stock plus by being in person you might find something else you can't live without.

Alan Gales
29-Jan-2014, 15:26
Have you checked any of the camera stores in St. Louis? There used to be a shop in Clayton the handled a lot of LF equipment. Shillers and Creve Couer on Olive might have a few holders in their used stock. I try to visit each store in person when I'm in town, I've found that if you call you may not get a person who knows the used stock plus by being in person you might find something else you can't live without.

Randy, those places are pretty much all digital now. Schillars is by my house and they will have a little medium format gear and some 35mm cameras. They know me and think I'm crazy for messing with large format and try to talk me into upgrading my D300. They tried to talk my buddy, Harold, into giving up his X-Pan and learning how to stitch panoramas. I can't print what he had to say! ;) The last time I was at Creve Couer Camera they did have a used Hasselblad. I miss City Photo Stock House and their huge selection of film gear many years ago.

I'll set her up with some good film holders.

NancyP
29-Jan-2014, 18:17
The only LF stuff at Schiller's may be on the top of the wall-mounted cabinets where they keep presumably non-working "antique" cameras, and IIRC, almost all of that old stuff uses 135 or 120/220 format. In defense of Schiller's, it is a good store for digital and it does still carry some darkroom items and presumably film. Creve Coeur Camera's main location also decorates with old Brownies, etc - or maybe it's just Very Old Stock. It's been an age since I thought to look, but I bet the photographic equipment repair shop on Clayton Road near Brentwood is also kaput. They looked at me a bit strangely when I took the old copy stand lens in for "sticky shutter" cleaning some 10 years ago.

RandyB
29-Jan-2014, 20:53
Amazing how quickly things change. It was just a few years ago that I did a little trading at both Schillers and CC. Fair deals and both had a decent amount of used equipment. I guess I'll have to mark them off my "must visit" list.

cowanw
30-Jan-2014, 15:20
http://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showthread.php?110684-Eight-4x5-film-holders-in-excellent-condition&highlight=4x5+holders
There you go.

tonyowen
28-Jul-2015, 08:19
What is the difference between Fidelity Deluxe and Fidelity Elite 4x5 sheet film holders?
Is one preferable to the other?
regards
Tony

Doremus Scudder
28-Jul-2015, 10:54
I have lots of different brands of film holders. All of them work well if they are in good condition. Little things like composition and size of the darkslide, locking tabs, etc. are different, but functionality is the same. As for the two models you mention; they are very similar. I believe the Elite is just an update of the Deluxe.

Best,

Doremus

Jac@stafford.net
28-Jul-2015, 16:16
How do we identify infra-red safe film holders?
Or can we?

StoneNYC
29-Jul-2015, 08:30
How do we identify infra-red safe film holders?
Or can we?

So far I can say that the Fidelity elite and Riteway are IR proof in both kinds of dark slides (hard and stiff and shiny, and the dull and flexible versions) and the Chamonix with carbon fiber, and the graflex grafmatics, the cambo/calumet 6x12 roll holder as well, all are IR proof. If that helps, those are the ones I've tested.

Jim Jones
29-Jul-2015, 11:04
As far as I know, both plastic and metal dark slides with five raised dots on the shiny side of the handle are safe for IR. The 8th edition of Graphic Graflex Photography by Morgan & Lester confirms this for Graphic holders, although at least some later editions of this valuable manual don't mention it.