Arca Swiss Basic with wide angle lenses

[itoyo]

Hey folks,

I've just got an Arca Swiss basic, axis tilt model, in like new condition. It came with the bag bellows and a flat board but it seems that because of the standards construction it doesn't allow to mount short lenses and leave room for movements. I've been searching the forum and one user says that the minimum focal length is around 110mm focused at infinity with a flat lensboard and no movements. I should have investigated before but it was my mistake, I saw the bag bellows and guessed that it was OK

I own a 150mm and a 75mm and I would like to add at least a 90mm on the short side and get full rise and some front tilt. Would a recessed board be enough for the 90mm or would I find trouble? I think there are some old Arca reccessed boards but it doesn't show second hand anywhere so I don't know how deep the reccess is. Any of you that has or had this camera know if it does exist a board to mount wide angles? Could I get so narrow as to infinity focus the SA 75mm or better forget about it?

Another thing I noticed is the lack of fresnel lens. I used a Toyo 45A which had a fresnel mounted in front of the GG, and often borrow a Sinar F2 with the removable one. Which is the Arca way? I've checked the back and the GG is mounted over four spacers or shims (on the lens side) that seem to be the width of a fresnel lens. Would any standard fresnel work on this back if I put it in the space where the shims are?

It's a beautiful camera and well built but I'm considering to dump it because of this limitations, I don't want the hassle of carrying a monorail that has less movements than a field.

Any help would be appreciated
Thanks

[John Schneider]

...I'm considering to dump it because of this limitations, I don't want the hassle of carrying a monorail that has less movements than a field...Thanks

Practically any monorail, including any Arca, will have much more movements available than a field camera.

[Rod Klukas]

Hey folks,

I've just got an Arca Swiss basic, axis tilt model, in like new condition. It came with the bag bellows and a flat board but it seems that because of the standards construction it doesn't allow to mount short lenses and leave room for movements. I've been searching the forum and one user says that the minimum focal length is around 110mm focused at infinity with a flat lensboard and no movements. I should have investigated before but it was my mistake, I saw the bag bellows and guessed that it was OK

I own a 150mm and a 75mm and I would like to add at least a 90mm on the short side and get full rise and some front tilt. Would a recessed board be enough for the 90mm or would I find trouble? I think there are some old Arca reccessed boards but it doesn't show second hand anywhere so I don't know how deep the reccess is. Any of you that has or had this camera know if it does exist a board to mount wide angles? Could I get so narrow as to infinity focus the SA 75mm or better forget about it?

Another thing I noticed is the lack of fresnel lens. I used a Toyo 45A which had a fresnel mounted in front of the GG, and often borrow a Sinar F2 with the removable one. Which is the Arca way? I've checked the back and the GG is mounted over four spacers or shims (on the lens side) that seem to be the width of a fresnel lens. Would any standard fresnel work on this back if I put it in the space where the shims are?

It's a beautiful camera and well built but I'm considering to dump it because of this limitations, I don't want the hassle of carrying a monorail that has less movements than a field.

Any help would be appreciated
Thanks
Itoyo,
This camera with a recessed board, 171 series, will handle lenses as short as 65mm. The newer 171 series cameras, made from 1983-1984, until the end of 2004, use a 171x171 board as well. But these boards are standard with a 13mm recess. This not what you need. You need a 25-30mm recessed board. We no longer make or sell these boards, but there are sellers on ebay offering them at good prices.
Hope this helps,
Rod

[toyotadesigner]

Another thing I noticed is the lack of fresnel lens. I used a Toyo 45A which had a fresnel mounted in front of the GG, and often borrow a Sinar F2 with the removable one. Which is the Arca way? I've checked the back and the GG is mounted over four spacers or shims (on the lens side) that seem to be the width of a fresnel lens. Would any standard fresnel work on this back if I put it in the space where the shims are?

The only way to verify the exact position of your gg is as follows:

Remove the rear standard of your Arca, insert a film holder with one developed film in it.
Place it on a table with the film holder facing down.
Position a steel ruler across the frame on top.
Use a caliper to measure the distance from the ruler to the film, write it down.
Now remove the film holder and insert your gg.
Repeat the above steps and compare the measurement. They should be identical to ¼ of a millimeter.

The frosted side of the gg has to face the lens - the light hits the frosted side of your gg/film plane.
You can add a fresnel to behind the gg, with the engraved side facing the lens, the glossy side showing to the back.

If you would place the fresnel in front of the gg, you'll experience severe focus problems.

For my small 6x9 Arca I had a mono-ocular viewfinder from Horseman, where the gg had been mounted with the frosted side to the back. So the first shots never had been sharp, because of a 1 mm out of focus...

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/108865744/forum/groundglass_fresnel_assembly_2013-12-27.png

[brucep]

I've got some recessed boards that I'm not using. They have all had the slot for the latch machined in that the earlier cameras needed. Pm me if you are interested in any of them, but there is only one with the very deep recess.
Bruce

[itoyo]

PM to brucep

[itoyo]

Itoyo,
This camera with a recessed board, 171 series, will handle lenses as short as 65mm. The newer 171 series cameras, made from 1983-1984, until the end of 2004, use a 171x171 board as well. But these boards are standard with a 13mm recess. This not what you need. You need a 25-30mm recessed board. We no longer make or sell these boards, but there are sellers on ebay offering them at good prices.
Hope this helps,
Rod

Thanks for the info Rod. Great to hear that. I knew about the standard 13mm recess lensboards of the later system.
Regarding this differences I have another question: I've got a flat lensboard with the camera that on the back side has a mechanical light trap (a double relief) and the camera frames has foam. By reading on the forum about compatibilities between the old and new systems I built the idea that this newer design was not appropiate for the older models, that used the foam to seal light with completely flat lensboards. But apparently the lensboard sits in place well (maybe with a little more effort than expected), as the relief seems to deep into the foam. It seems that I can use any 171 lensboard newer or older, right?

[itoyo]

Thanks for the advise. I've checked it and the measurement is exactly the same, so the shims are in the right place. Now I need a fresnel.


The only way to verify the exact position of your gg is as follows:

Remove the rear standard of your Arca, insert a film holder with one developed film in it.
Place it on a table with the film holder facing down.
Position a steel ruler across the frame on top.
Use a caliper to measure the distance from the ruler to the film, write it down.
Now remove the film holder and insert your gg.
Repeat the above steps and compare the measurement. They should be identical to ¼ of a millimeter.

The frosted side of the gg has to face the lens - the light hits the frosted side of your gg/film plane.
You can add a fresnel to behind the gg, with the engraved side facing the lens, the glossy side showing to the back.

If you would place the fresnel in front of the gg, you'll experience severe focus problems.

For my small 6x9 Arca I had a mono-ocular viewfinder from Horseman, where the gg had been mounted with the frosted side to the back. So the first shots never had been sharp, because of a 1 mm out of focus...

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/108865744/forum/groundglass_fresnel_assembly_2013-12-27.png