Old G.Rodenstock Camera

[louis_asd]

Help me to identify this G.Rodenstock Doppel-Anastigmat Eurynar 1:4.5 f=15cm with F. Deckel-Munchen Compur shutter.
The stops on the lens are as follows f4.5, f6.3, f9, f12.5, f18, f25 and f36. The Compur shutter speeds are Bulb, 1 sec, 2, 5, 10, 25th, 50th, 100th, 200th of a second.
I can't find anything about this camera, can you help me with some info? is it rare? appraisal...
If anyone has any information on this, I'd appreciate it.
Thank you!

[Steven Tribe]

I doubt Rodenstock made your camera. The 15cm suggests it is a 9x12cm plate camera which has a Rodenstock up-market lens mounted.

[louis_asd]

I doubt Rodenstock made your camera. The 15cm suggests it is a 9x12cm plate camera which has a Rodenstock up-market lens mounted.

Hi Steven,
Thanks for the fast asnwer.
I've attached some photos (not HQ made with phone)

[Sevo]

Probably some other makers camera with Rodenstock lens, they supplied quite a few Bavarian makers. Rodenstock mostly was a lens maker, their dabblings in cameras were few and far between. They had a very brief flirt with camera fabrication in the 6*9 folder boom years - they may only have made one roll film camera (with a peculiar rangefinder of their own invention) themselves and bought in a few more. I can't find a reference to Rodenstock made plate cameras within the period in question.

[Steven Tribe]

If the embossed leather is on the ordinary back with GG, then it appears convincing. I would guess this is on a film holder or film pack holder?

[Sevo]

There seems to be a Rodenstock name plate on the standard as well. It probably was some camera bought in and re-branded - their doubtlessly own contribution to between the wars camera production was much less mainstream.

[louis_asd]

If the embossed leather is on the ordinary back with GG, then it appears convincing. I would guess this is on a film holder or film pack holder?

Yes the embossed leather is on the ordinary back and yes is on a film holder.

[louis_asd]

There seems to be a Rodenstock name plate on the standard as well. It probably was some camera bought in and re-branded - their doubtlessly own contribution to between the wars camera production was much less mainstream.

Here's the name plate.

[louis_asd]

Even the lens i can't find it anywhere..
So, is this rare? can be appraised?

[Martin Dake]

I don't think Rodenstock actually made cameras, the took other makers cameras,mostly Welta, and put their own lenses and name on them.

[Steven Tribe]

It was a way of increasing their lens sales in a market that turned very difficult post WW1.

[louis_asd]

So, if i want to sell it what value does it have? because i've never seen another one like this..

[Sevo]

By the pictures it does not appear to be in a collection worthy condition, so it will not be more valuable than the average twenties German 9*12 folder with Doppelanastigmat in need for a cleaning before it reaches user condition. YMMV depending on where you sell it, in the current condition it might fetch more when sold as decoration than as a camera.

[IanG]

I have the same camera although mine's probably slightly older with a rimset Ibsor shutter and a Eurynar lens.

http://www.lostlabours.co.uk/photography/cameras/images/rodenstock%20camera2.jpg

The lens on these cameras can be worth more than the camera as a whole if in good condition and a working shutter, the 15cm Eurynar is a dialyte and very sharp but they do suffer from being uncoated. It was Rodenstock's top of the range lens.

There's plenty of similar German c9x12 cameras available at reasonable prices, I was offered a mint Nagel Recommar with a 150mm Xenar for £35 ($53) two weeks ago and I wouldn't put the value of my Rodenstock camera at much more than £60 ($92).

On the other hand I've seen 160mm Eurynars selling for as high as £120 ($184) on Ebay in the past.

Ian

[Steven Tribe]

9x12cm cameras are certainly not "collectable" items - apart from a few Voigtländer models and, perhaps, KW.

They provide, however, a very low cost entry to large format. You get a camera and lens which give far more interesting and controled results than any digital camera. Performance of roll film cameras which replaced them gradually in the 20's and 30's was generally much poorer. Film is still readily available. The problem of a single fixed lens can be solved. The later models, which had to have a "front standard" big enough to handle F4.5 Tessars, are more versatile.

[IanG]

This is why the KW Etui is collectable :)

http://www.lostlabours.co.uk/photography/cameras/images/etui06.jpg

Large format 9x12 negatives and a fraction of the weight & size of a Crown Graphic, in this shot both have 150mm f4.5 Tessar lenses. It will fit in a pocket . Here's a comparison in size to a more typical German 9x12 camera, the Rodenstock.

http://www.lostlabours.co.uk/photography/cameras/images/etui03_sm.jpg

Ian

[IanG]

I revisited this thread by accident while looking something up.

Last year I had a visitor after some plate holders for his Welta 9x12, he brought the camera with him, it was identical to my Rodenstock 9x12 camera except for the name plates.

Ian

[J. Patric Dahlen]

I've just bought the same camera and it will probably arrive next week. What made me buy it on impulse is the fact that it has the fast 150mm f:3,5 Eurynar. The winter here above the Polar Circle is dark. In December we have early morning, then evening and night. No Sun.

It's a Rodenstock branded Welta Watson, I believe.

I have three KW Patent Etui's in 6,5x9 (12cm Tessar, 4,5 Helioplan and Unofokal). They fit in a pocket. Not all three at the same time, though.

[plaubel]

the 15cm Eurynar is a dialyte and very sharp but they do suffer from being uncoated.
It was Rodenstock's top of the range lens.


I wouldn't call my Eurynar (135mm) as top of the Rodenstock range.
Nor is it very sharp .
It gives a mystic look on the screen, and focusing is hard, more like a soft focus lens.
Somehow milky, but sharp enough to me.
Love this lens..
The Eurynars I know are convertible.

Ritchie

[J. Patric Dahlen]

I wouldn't call my Eurynar (135mm) as top of the Rodenstock range.
Nor is it very sharp .
It gives a mystic look on the screen, and focusing is hard, more like a soft focus lens.
Somehow milky, but sharp enough to me.

Eurynars are easy to take apart to clean the individual elements, so perhaps one of the middle elements has been put back the wrong way? It is supposed to be very sharp and look razor sharp even wide open on the groundglass.

[plaubel]

Not even my (and anotherone) Eurynar shows this effects - another photographer told me about the collection of his Eurynars with different focal lengths, showing the same unique phenomenia.
It's a thing between missing a coating in a bright light, and soft focus behaviour.
The surfaces are as clean as possible.
I try to scan a print next days, which will show what I usually get on my groundglass.

In printing harder, let's say gradation 3,5, the effect dissolves, and the print looks more sharp - but the GG stays milky, wide open or closed.

Ritchie

[J. Patric Dahlen]

Mine arrived yesterday. The shutter seems to be a Compur #2, working nicely on all speeds. The outer diameter of the lens is 53mm. The lens elements cleaned up great, and I have 14 fitting holders.

154810

[plaubel]

Here I can give an impression of the last results ( not finished, I'm still working on)with my 135mm Eurynar, printed straight, no filters:
154811

This nearly mirrors the vision on my groundglass.

Printing hard, then it looks more like a "normal" lens.
But, no reason to print hard :-)

Ritchie

[plaubel]

I have to say, this 9x12 camera inc. Eurynar came from a female photographer.
She bought this camera 1957, during her study time, but never used the camera since the early sixties - she preferred to retouch negatives instead of photographing as her business.
Camera plus lens look very clear, and I gave an extra clearing to the lens.

[J. Patric Dahlen]

Ritchie, I see what you mean by "milky". :p

I don't see that on the groundglass with either the 4,5/135 or 3,5/150 Eurynar I have. I also have the Goerz Dogmar 6,3/135 that has the same dialyte construction, and the negs are very sharp and have no problems with contrast. I've used it both in cloudy and sunny conditions. I will report back when I have tried my Eurynars.