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spacegoose
2-Oct-2013, 11:07
I received a CP-31 today that looks like it might need some TLC.

Am hoping to get some hints here on where to begin.

I've read don't operate without water or chemistry. I'm planning to test the processor first by putting 2L water in each bath and then turning it on, testing the temp, transport, etc.

Is there some checklist I should follow? E.g. pumps, rollers / transport, temperature, etc.? It's a little dirty, any cleaning recommendations?

Here's my observation / inspection so far:

1) On the WD module, the top rail, that the roller units rest on, is missing a screw (closest to entry of unit) - the screw hole may also be damaged. I imagine on the WD unit, this will likely cause a problem as if I recall correctly, there is only one other screw holding the rail place.

I notice on the processor the bottom rail is also missing a screw, closest to bath 3, at the exit of unit.

2) On the WD module, the plastic tube with the rubber L in the bath well, which connects to the sprayer rod, is broken off from the bath. How should I try to repair? It's broken right at the base.

3) I have a 3-pin DIN like cable, I think to connect the WD module to the processor, but I can't see where to plug either end.

4) There's a rubber hose with a metal cuff - off the paper exit end of the processor, seems to come out of the gear shaft, what is it?

5) On the processor unit, the paper guide is missing a screw on one side, I seem to have the 6-sided bolt for it (it matches the one on the other side), but not the screw. Wondering if this bolt is also used elsewhere, in case it may go somewhere else.

6) The WD module has 3 tubes, the processor seems to have 3 plugged-tip drain tubes in front, and 6 tubes in back, 3 clear and thin with plugs (seem to have some chemistry inside), and 3 bigger and black, no plugs. Any info on the purpose of these tubes?

7) On the WD module, the gear shaft was unseated from the metal guide holes, e.g. the white plastic inserts on the rod, had come out of the guide holes.

I was able to reseat it, but the washer/rivet thing that seems to hold it in place is loose, not sure how to secure.

Appreciate any guidance.

Thanks,
Bill

George Richards
2-Oct-2013, 14:44
Sounds like it needs lots of TLC and maybe some parts.

Yes, do not run the unit dry. You risk damage to the pumps and heaters. Start with the roller assemblies out, fill each section in the main unit with water to reach the overflow. I'd disconnect the wash/dry unit to start. After you've filled it with water (pour it directly in the hole in the bottom of each section or use a funnel - the idea is to try and force any air out of the pumps. Turn it on and make sure each section is pumping and water is coming out the spray bars - turn it off right away if they aren't all flowing. This assumes water doesn't flow out the bottom as soon as you pour it in. From there it's cleaning and checking the temp controls.

I'm assuming you don't have any manuals. I have a most loaded here (http://www.silveruser.ca/index_files/Manuals.html) I can put the rest up in time if you can't find them.

I have but have never used the wash/dry unit. You'll need to fix that connection to the spray bar somehow. The plumbing section in most hardware stores will likely have nylon "L"s etc that may be usefull.

other questions.
3) I believe the DIN connections are on the back side.
4) This might be the coupling to power the W/D unit. it gets it's drive from the main unit drive shaft.
5) I think one of the manuals I have up is a parts manual.
6)The W/D unit 3 tubes: IN, OUT, overflow. Processor 3 in front are drain tubes - they must be plugged to use. 3 clear in back are for the replenisher unit - without it they should be plugged. The black rubber hoses are for the overflow - there should be 4 one for each section and one for the drive section.
7) not sure

I'm sure others may join in but this might get you started. As to cleaning avoid abrasive cleaners they'll just make it worse. The is/was a Kodak Pub on cleaning esp on the silver (black) staining.

On the roller units check that all "springs" are in place - rubber O rings can be used as a sub.

George

spacegoose
2-Oct-2013, 15:55
Thanks for the info George,

I've downloaded from your site before, so will study those documents at some point soon, thanks for making them available.

I was able to setup the processor on my kitchen counter. The transport system seems to work.

A piece of paper made it all the way through, came out the other side, more damp then wet.

I set the speed to 255mm. It's finicky to get a constant speed, but I think it settles eventually.

I am able to use the set button and up / down temp arrows.

Only one of the paper sensors causes the green paper light to display ... what triggers the warning light?

I'll read up, but any idea what the 2 & 3 screw dials on the panel do?

The dials are each set at 5. There's a hole in the panel that says reset, but no button (is that on the board, what does it reset?).

All the spray rods seem to spray fine - all the baths are heating, though there is variation in temp between them.

Should the water / chemistry be above the rod holes so the spray is through the water in the well?

I ended up just pouring 2L into each well, without a funnel, because I hadn't read your post yet.

The machine is rather quiet and seems to run smoothly.

There's a fair amount of particulate in sections 1 and 2, stopping up the hole with my finger, I could feel the pump suction, and this seemed to bring up more particles when letting go.

What's the best way to drain the unit? I imagine opening the tubes in front?

How about the replenishment tubes, they are dirty ... just open them up?

All my springs seem to be intact and in place, for now.

As for the WD module, haven't connected the transport from the processor yet, but turning it on with the 3 pin cable and heater connected, there didn't seem to be any pump action, the heater did turn on and off though.

Would be interested in that Kodak pub re: staining, I think I have some in the CP-31, and wonder if the remedy also works in similarly stained plastic bottles.


Bill

George Richards
2-Oct-2013, 17:16
I just uploaded the operation manual so you might check that.

The LCD panel controls the temp in the first section only. The two controls on the board control the 2nd & 3rd. There is a reset for the LCD it"s been a while but it needs to have a couple dots flashing or something like that it's in manual.

There possibly two problems hiding. On the control board there is a Nicad battery - I believe this is used to power the LCD when the main power if off and to retain the temp setting. Unless someone has changed it, it will die hotly after the power is turned off. Second some people have had to replace the larger capacitors - they also suffer from old age.

... More to come. Multitasking here

George Richards
2-Oct-2013, 17:52
I'm back. The LCD & reset is in the operations manual on a page called "setting the Solution Temperature" near the bottom Make sure you have the right display.

I set the speed to 255mm. It seems finicky to get a constant speed, but I think it settles eventually.
The control is rather simple and a bit touchy.

The paper and warning lights are not displaying, but I do seem to be able to use the set & up / down temp arrows.
The paper sensing IR switch is on the inlet rack - it may be disconnected or broken.

I will read up, but any idea how these with the 2 & 3 screw dials in the panel work?
They control the temps in the 2&3 baths - not as precise as the LCD.

The two dials are set at 5. There is a hole in the panel that says reset, but no button (is that on the board?).
The button is on the board. It resets the LCD control as best I can figure out.

All the spray rods seem to spray fine - however, only baths two and three are heating up
As I've mentioned each bath has it's own controller - LCD up/down controls the first bath - it may need to be reset.

Should the water / chemistry be above the rod holes so the spray is through the water in the well?
I'd say at least equal to the rod holes - don't need to introduce any air - esp in the developer

I ended up just pouring 2L into each well, without a funnel, because I hadn't read your post yet.
I don't think I've ever used a funnel but I do aim for the drain hole and make sure I have flow before I put the rollers in.

The machine is rather quiet and seems to run smoothly.

There is a fair amount of particulate in sections 1 and 2, stopping up the hole with my finger, I could feel the pump suction, and this seemed to bring up more particles when letting go.
It just needs to cleaned an run - you should be able to remove the spray wands and use a "bottle brush" type cleaner (or a piece of cloth on a stick)

What's the best way to drain the unit? I imagine opening the tubes in front?
The front tubes are meant for the drain but you need to flush out the replenisher tubes as well. They are just "T"ed into the system.

How about the replenishment tubes, they seem dirty ... just open them up?
Yup try and flush them out. I doubt if much of the bleach stain will go away though. I usually drain the unit using both front & back tubes and at least a couple fills of water.

All my springs seem to be intact and in place, for now.
Good but they do get fragile.

Would be interested in that Kodak pub re: staining, I think I have some in the CP-31, and maybe wonder if the remedy would also work in similarly stained plastic bottles.

I put the link on my site. Most stained bottles I just get rid of.

As for the WD module, haven't connected the transport from the processor to it yet, but turning it on with the 3 pin cable and heater connected, there didn't seem to be any pump action, the heater did seem to turn on and off though.

There is no pump in the W/D unit just uses continuous flow from your tap.

spacegoose
2-Oct-2013, 20:25
Wow, great info! I need to read up.

Seems like the only real issue I have other than a few missing screws is the broken spray rod connector on the WD module.

The drive for the WD module seems to fix the WD gear shaft issue I thought I had.

Since you don't use the WD module, I am wondering how you setup your system, do you use a wash or stop in any of the baths? What temps and speed?

Thanks a lot,
Bill

George Richards
3-Oct-2013, 15:32
My current darkroom is a spare bedroom - no running water for the W/D unit. I've only used it BW with stop in the center section. I just let the prints drop into a holding tray with water and then gather them to wash in the nearby bathroom.
I do have a better space but right now it's full of lots of other stuff - someday.

I had really hoped to use it for colour, and still might.

For BW, temp and speed will depend on what you have for developer. Most BW developers don't like high temps. Ilford still makes the 2000 & 2150 dev & fixes. These run at 90F. You'll need good volume to justify the cost espically if you have to order case lots. Ansco 130 is supposed to be pretty good. All I used was some Ilford Multigrade dev & rapid fix, I'd have look up my notes but they were based on Ilford times at the highest temp they listed. Once the CP31 has warmed up even with just the pumps running it will be in the mid 20Cs. Unless you have a very cold room.

George

spacegoose
5-Oct-2013, 14:09
I was able to repair the riser which connects to the WD shower rod by inserting a brass hose nipple, wrapped in Teflon tape (because it was slightly too loose) inserting between the broken pipe and into base of WD well.

Seems to work well. I imagine the flow is slightly less, but still seems to go a liter per minute, based on overflow, depending on water pressure.

I also easily replaced the missing paper guide screw and bolt, and just popped in the 2 screws that were missing in the the rails (didn't worry about bolts, because I expect they are inside, and I'm not ready to disassemble this yet :)).

I'm struck by how well manufactured this machine is! Mine really hums. I hope to give it a color printing session tonight.

I am using Ektacolor RA-4 (doesn't seem to be the RT variety), wondering if that should influence my process?

I'm probably going to start with 34C, 280mm/min with chemistry order - dev, blix, pre-wash, WD module.

Bill

103037103038


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0dVIynFj9fQ&feature=youtu.be

spacegoose
2-Nov-2013, 08:08
The machine has been working very nicely.

I don't have a replenishment unit yet and have been adding it manually, which is a drag, and, I am not sure it (or some of it) just doesn't overflow.

Does anyone know a good method to add replenisher in a way (without the repl unit), that would be most effective, and not too difficult?

I am considering getting a 40" x 18" x 33" (W, D, H) Rubbermaid cart to hold the machine, I haven't cooked in a while since it's been on my stove :) - anyone have experience putting theirs on a cart?

It is unwieldy to move, and while moving, inevitably spills some liquid (even after cleaning and draining, etc.).

Thanks,
Bill

frotog
2-Nov-2013, 08:38
Unfortunately without the replenishment module you'll need to lift the cover off the machine every time and manually pour in your replenishment. If using RA-4 chem., technically speaking you'll need to drop in 20-30ml. of fresh replenisher with every 8x10/11x14 you make in order to keep the process in control. But given the current state of digitally optimized papers coupled with the rarity of process control strips, the science of in-control analogue color is not what it used to be or even necessary for home printing. However, good results should be obtainable with accurate replenishment every four or five prints.

Replenishment systems need overflow to work properly. In order to ascertain proper replenishment make certain that baths are topped off at the beginning of each session. This means that you should get 100ml. of overflow with every 100ml. of replenishment. Just make sure that there is a meniscus at the overflow port at the back of the machine. Since the overflow is at the surface, proper introduction of replenishment would occur through the fill tubes at the front of the machine and thus introduced through the spray bar.

I have a cp32 that's a designated b/w rc processor for proofing that I store on one of those rubbermaid carts with castors. I placed the machine ontop of a piece of 3/4" plywood since the surface of the cart is not quite large enough. It works well and the shelf below has ample room for replenishment bottles and drainage bottles for overflow.

spacegoose
2-Nov-2013, 13:58
Thanks for the info, I just want to find a way to make sure the replenishment I am adding isn't what's overflowing; the tubes in the front are drain tubes, I think the rear tubes are for using the repl unit.

frotog
3-Nov-2013, 06:07
Yes, the tubes in front are drain tubes but directing chemistry the other way will force it through the spray bar just like the auxillary replenishment pump that you're missing. This technique is also useful for filling the tanks and priming the pump. Your small amount of manually introduced replenisher will go into solution quick enough not to have to worry about it going directly to overflow. However, introducing the replenisher manually through the front tubes will exactly mimic what the replenisher kit does.

spacegoose
3-Nov-2013, 07:05
Good to know, thanks!

spacegoose
4-Nov-2013, 13:44
Can anyone familiar with the unit suggest how to fix (or replace) one of the two paper sensors?

frotog
5-Nov-2013, 04:46
Did you try contacting omega-brandess? It's been a while since I got spare parts but they used to place orders with fujimoto/lucky japan several times a year.

EdSawyer
5-Nov-2013, 12:29
I think those are infrared LEDs and receptors or something along those lines. Would be worth figuring out what is wrong with them (one of them?) before ordering parts. If it's just wiring that's easy enough. You really only need one working (to turn the unit on), esp. if you are not using the replenishment unit.

-Ed

frotog
6-Nov-2013, 04:55
Doesn't the sensor also trigger the dryer in addition to the repl. unit?

spacegoose
7-Nov-2013, 06:57
I contacted Omega, Joboman, and a guy named Gregory, one of them recommended finding the number on the part and looking for a suitable replacement online, maybe at Mouser Electronics, but no one had an actual spare.

As long as one is working, it seems fine but I don't want the other fail. The dryer is triggered successfully. I may ask a friend more electronically inclined to take a look.

frotog
9-Nov-2013, 14:14
Any news from omega-brandess about the availability of spare parts? Has their support of fujimotos dried up?

spacegoose
9-Nov-2013, 19:57
I've called Omega-Brandess in the recent past for CP-31 parts, and they haven't yet had a what I needed; they do look in their computer, and ask for a part number, I give what's in the parts document, maybe their system numbers and the parts document don't jive?

I was able to read the part as an Omron EE-SB-5:

http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Omron-Electronics/EE-SB5-B/?qs=pWf36BUtxBiVGONaNQU2Ew==