View Full Version : Now this is a T,T & H casket you don't see that often!

Steven Tribe
21-Sep-2013, 03:08
Well actually twice in the past 2 weeks. One in London and the other at an auction in Australia, where it was listed as something like "lens attachment". I am sure the collector is turning in his grave!

This is mentioned in the Lens VM, but very much in passing.

Early on, T,T & H had the good idea to combine the RR and WAR into a small casket version, with an additional barrel length to make a Rapid View meniscus - a total of 2 barrels, one with the iris and 5 lenses. Darlot had done something similar with the "Universel" a few decades before.
The one illustrated below is incomplete (minus one lens - an RR cell- and another badly scratched). Fortunately the price was on the basis of its condition and I was only only interested in the RV possibilities. This is the half plate size.

It has the bonus that the iris had to cope with both the RR and the WAR, so I can come up to more than F10 with the RV, perhaps as open as the later RVP?

By the way, have there been no sales of the RVP - they are certainly missing in the Soft Focus sales list?

21-Sep-2013, 06:40
Nice. I have a friend that bought one of those sets. Very nice set.

On the RVPs, I've not seen any for sale, ever, except for the one I bought!

Mark Sawyer
21-Sep-2013, 17:36
It has the bonus that the iris had to cope with both the RR and the WAR, so I can come up to more than F10 with the RV, perhaps as open as the later RVP?

By the way, have there been no sales of the RVP - they are certainly missing in the Soft Focus sales list?

Just don't put the aperture section on and use it wide open! :)

BTW, I think I'm the friend Garrett mentioned, but my boxed set is an 11-inch RV and an f/6.5 7.5-inch Series III Triplet, two complete lenses, no interchangeable parts. Yes, the RV/RPV/Cooke Achromatic Portrait Lens are rare treasures indeed! Your set is a great one, use it well!

Steven Tribe
22-Sep-2013, 00:39
Yes, that is the second "casket" set mentioned by the Lens VM - nice to know that exists as well.

I am a little puzzled by the focal lengths of your set, Mark.
These triplets have less coverage than the equivalent focal length RRs?
So your RV/Series III is 11"/7,5", whilst my RV/RR is 8.72"/7.28" (I just love this period with second decimal points from T,T & H!)?

You are right about easy removal of the iris section - there is still enough barrel to prevent unacceptible stray light.

Mark Sawyer
22-Sep-2013, 11:44
My experience is that the Triplets cover more than the long-barreled "normal" Rapid Rectilinears, though not near as much as the Wide Angle Rectilinears, (WAR's can have remarkable coverage, I have a 5-inch that covers 8x10!) Both the RV and Series III Triplet in that set are engraved as being for 4 3/4 x 6 1/5 -inch, thou I think they'd go up to whole plate.

I think pulling the iris will be my way to use the RV lens. The RV aperture only opens to f/11, while the RVP went to f/8. But pull the aperture off, and the RV is f/8! The lens is the same as the RVP, TTH just changed the aperture mechanism. Removing it on either lens will give a bit more coverage, and if you pull the barrel too, it will cover a much larger plate; my 11-inch covers 8x10+ without the barrel. The corners are mushy, but sometimes, for some things, that works.

A quick reminder of Garrett's excellent thread on these lenses, for anyone who missed it: http://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showthread.php?94655-Rapid-View-Portrait-(RVP)-Pictorial-lens&highlight=cooke

Steven Tribe
22-Sep-2013, 13:37
I remembered this thread - especialy the apparent complete equivalence between the RV and RVP - but couldn't find it!
Search engine wouldn't accept RVP and considered "Rapid View Portrait" unacceptible. There is a good catalogue of the two in Garrett's (OP) thread. I note that the proposed coverage for the RVP is reduced compared with the matching RV. I'll check the coverage of the 8.72" (compared with usual 8") tomorrow.

Steven Tribe
23-Sep-2013, 01:27
The 8.72" RV covers 13x18cm very well.

I have discovered the iris form is exactly the same type as that used on the RVP (Garrett's photo comparison in the thread on RV/RVP) and that T,T & H did mark an F8 on the iris for the RV possibility for the casket.
Perhaps this is when they discovered the additional qualities of the RV?

Anyway, I am changing the description of this lens to RV(P)!

Mark Sawyer
23-Sep-2013, 10:41
My RV has the same larger aperture mechanism as Garrett's RVP, rather than his RV. But it's maximum marked aperture is the RV's f/11, while the "genuine" RVP aperture mechanism is marked and opens to f/8. Remove the aperture mechanism, and everyone is happy! :)

A couple of odd notes on mine: while it's marked for 4 3/4 x 6 1/5, the 1904 TTH catalog lists 8-inch as the size for that plate. Also, Garrett's RV and RVP are slightly shorter in focal length than mine, but engraved as covering a slightly larger plate. I'd guess mine was engraved to be part of a two-lens set for a particular format, rather than for what the lens was capable of. And checking the focal length at infinity, it's 11-inch back focus, not 11-inch from where the aperture is, (about 2 1/4 inches in front of the lens). (Just a note for anyone using landscape/view lenses but used to measuring from the aperture.)

Steven Tribe
26-Sep-2013, 14:49
The casket set I mentioned as being sold at public auction in Australia a few weeks ago has resurfaced.

Having looked at the detailed photos, I don't think it is the 3-way set (for full plate) but just the RR and WAR and minus the RV