My First large format and I want to buy and load film? I need help

[pudentaineLf]

Hi- I haven't had been able to use my new large format 4 x 5 because i don't have a clue where to get the film, what the film is called and anxiety about whether or not I can load the film or not. I know it has to be loaded in the dark but can I make my bathroom light tight and use some sort of safe light to load the film in the film holder. I want to start shooting and experimenting but I'm not ashamed to say I'm poor and can't really afford to waste film loading it. It was just pure luck that got me my Busch Pressman Model D and C. I bought a speed graphic for $50 and was able to sell the saber Flash, extra 4X5 holders and speed graphic camera restored it and ended selling it all for $350, speed graphics are great but I've always liked the design of the Busch Pressman. Anyway, I've got the cameras and the holders. So anyway enough of my story, I guess I'm asking for help with buying and names /types/sources for film and the economic steps in making a bathroom light tight and whether I can use some sort of safe light. My hands aren't as good as they used to be nor my eyes. That's why I ask about the safe light. Thanks Thomas

[AtlantaTerry]

Thomas,

You absolutely MUST handle undeveloped film in total darkness.

After a bit of practice loading film into 4x5 sheet film holders in total darkness becomes second nature. I use my bathroom sink countertop at night with the windows blacked out using black foamcore boards cut to shape in order to block street lights, etc. from fogging my film. Also, I unplug any night lights in the house and put an old t-shirt outside the bottom of the bathroom door. After about 20 minutes in total darkness you will be able to see any light. If you have other people in your house remind them to not turn on any room or hallway lights while you are in the darkroom otherwise they will go on Santa's "Naughty List".

Be sure each sheet film holder is well cleaned. Many photographers use a vacuum cleaner's flat attachment. Do not vacuum the film holders near where you will later be hanging wet film to dry.

In total darkness open the box of film. There will either be two or three boxes in order to protect film from light. Also there will likely be a sealed pouch that the film is in. So have a scissors in the darkroom in order to cut open the pouch.

Place the packet of film in one of the boxes cross ways so the film is leaning up on one side. Use your fingers to feel for notches that the manufacturer cuts into one of the 4 inch sides. Orient the film so the index finger of your right hand can touch the notches. This way the emulsion will be facing you. EVERY film manufacturer does it this way.

Still in total darkness hold the sheet film holder so the slide is at least half way out and pointed toward your tummy or toward your left hand. (Practice beforehand to discover which is more comfortable for you.) Since the slide is moved now the little flap that runs along the 4 inch side of the film holder is free to move on it's paper or cloth hinge. Using your thumb or index finger of your left hand gently flip the flap out of the way. Now pick up the film as we discussed earlier so the index finger of your right hand can touch the notches. (Remove any thin sheets of paper that prevent the film sheets from scratching each other - I use one of the other box sections to hold these papers.

Now you want to slide the sheet of film into the holder and run it under two small metal channels that run along the 5 inch sides. (You will have seen these earlier when you were cleaning and vacuuming the film holders.) Slide the sheet of film all the way in until it stops. At this point I like to put a fingernail under the 4 inch side of the film and gently pull it up. It should stop. If not, this means the film is not under one or both of the channels so you must start over again. Allow the end flap to move back into position. If the film is not all the way in then the flap will not easily close. This is a big clue - in the dark you need to figure out why the film is not properly in place. Fix the problem.

At this point I use an air puffer to blow away any dust that might have fallen to rest on the raw film in the holder.

Once the film is in place and the 4 inch flap is pressed against the film you can move the dark slide to the closed and locked position. Most people orient the dark slide so the white side is visible which means the film has not been exposed. Later, in the camera, after exposure, flip the dark slide so the black side is now facing out which indicates light has stuck the film. (Think sun tan: skin turns darker when exposed to light.) Lock the slide and remove the holder from your camera.

While still in total darkness, and all your sheet film holders are loaded, check them before anything else. Be sure all the little flaps are closed on both sides of the holder. Be sure all the dark slides are fully closed and locked.

Take the thin sheets of paper that you set aside and place them on the working table so they are out of the way of the box sections.

Now put the unused film back into the packet then the packet into the smallest box then the smallest box into the middle box and finally the middle box into the largest box. At each step be sure the bottom of the section is facing out to block light.

If you are sure you put everything away that is light-sensitive, you can turn on the light.

›

Only enlarging paper can be used with a safelight. Multicontrast / Polycontrast paper needs a very weak amber safelight, not red. Color film and color enlarging paper must be handled in absolute darkness.

The least expensive 4x5 black & white film that I know about is Shanghai film. I buy it from eBay vendor Isaac Chen: http://www.ebay.com/sch/Film-Photography-/69323/m.html?_ipg=&_from=&_nkw=&_armrs=1&_ssn=isaac.chen
Other black and white films are available for more money such as Ilford and Kodak. Some dealers carry film made by Eastern European firms but I have no experience with that. Google: Arista

If you are going to develop your own black & white film there are several things you will need:

› #316 stainless steel photography thermometer with an instant-read dial

› photography mixing paddle to use with powdered chemicals; #316 stainless steel or hard plastic

DO NOT use the thermometer to stir chemistry, you will damage or break it.

› five quart-sized mixing container or larger to mix chemistry (rinse well between uses)

› somewhere other than your darkroom to mix the chemistry (bathroom with exhaust fan running)

› a darkroom timer (best is a used clean GraLab)

› Boston brown glass bottles from local lab or school supply firms:
4 quart sized for developer - to reduce air contact thereby lengthen life
a couple gallon-sized for fixer, hypo eliminator

Up until a few years ago one could ask a pharmacist to keep empty brown glass bottles for you but these days all their supplies come pre-packaged so there are few free bottles available. Some photographers use litre-sized brown or green glass beer bottles for developer to minimize exposure to air.

› some sort of developing tank for the sheet film (HP Combi; MOD54; etc.)
Not an FP tank, they leak badly.

› steam distilled water (use to mix developer also for final wash and for a PhotoFlo bath).
I get my steam distilled water by the gallon at the grocery store for about US $1.

› chemistry: developer, vinegar (weak acid stop bath), fixer, hypo eliminator, PhotoFlo

› a nylon or wire clothes line (to hang the wet film to dry)

› some spring-type wooden clothes pins (clip to the wet film to dry).
I believe the wood swells when wet so grips slippery film much better than metal or plastic film clips which actually damages film by pinching it.

› hooks or other means to attach the wood clothes pins to the line. Or you can thread the clothes line though the middle of the spring, if there is enough room. I like wire clothes lines because they don't shed material and are easily wiped clean with a damp cloth. Most any hardware store should have this.

› after the film dries you will need some acid-free archival storage medium to preserve your film. I use archival plastic pages that hold four 4x5 films to a page.

Tips:
-› number each sheet film holder - front and back
-› use a small notebook in the field to record the film holder side number as well as lens & exposure data
-› after you place the film in the storage medium transfer the information from your notebook with an acid-free pen

[billie williams]

Tom, hi.

Try Freestyle Photo in Hollywood for all film supplies. Their Arista-edu b/w ISO 100 is about $18 for 25 sheets. And shipping will be cheap because you are in California.
http://www.freestylephoto.biz/

Watch a youtube video to see how to load the holder.

As AtlantaTerry typed, you'll need to create a totally black space - try using some black plastic to darken your bathroom. I use a small hall closet with plastic over the door.

Then just take out a sheet (in the dark), put the box away and come into your livingroom, sit on the couch and practice. Watch tv and practice. Then practice with your eyes closed.
When it feels somewhat comfortable, take a deep breath and go do it. What's the worst thing that's going to happen? Maybe you screw up a few pieces of film? Five bucks worth? No big deal. And maybe nothing untoward will happen. Maybe you'll do it right.

Hang in there! You can do it.

[Lachlan 717]

Get on Youtube and look for Large format videos.

Here's a good starting point:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AvHAeKltwBo

Time spent watching videos like these will save you heaps in both time and money...

[Tim Meisburger]

Ya. No worries mate. You can also buy a darkbag on ebay for film loading.

[gavjenks]

If you want to practice loading in the light, just sacrifice one sheet of film (take it out in your light tight dark room, reclose the box!) and load it/unload it over and over until youre comfortable, then practice with that one in the dark or with your eyes closed.

If you don't even want to waste one sheet, then you could probably also use a 4x5 cut rectangle of cereal box thickness cardboard or something, but that seems a little silly when a sheet costs <$1 for cheaper brands.

[AtlantaTerry]

Ya. No worries mate. You can also buy a darkbag on ebay for film loading.

Yeah but. Darkbags get humid and clammy very fast. Better is a dark tent from Photoflex, Calumet and others. This is because the tent design is held up by spring metal hoops so there is a lot more air space. Tents do get humid, just not as fast. And tends don't have fabric touching the film, holders and your skin.

[JeRuFo]

Don't worry too much about it. Loading film is something that has/had to be done often, especially by press photographers and is designed as a pretty foolproof procedure. You just have to know how to do it and once you've done it rarely goes wrong anymore. You'll build up a routine soon enough.

This video also has good advice, he has more helpful videos about how to handle the camera and develop film too.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LbST9NFR7SU

Arista Edu/Fomapan and Shanghai are all good and affordable films and are probably a good starting point, there are plenty of posts on the forum to find the pros and cons of each.

[guyatou]

I would recommend reading "Using the View Camera" by Steve Simmons. It outlines all the things you will need to know about shooting and processing large format -- and it's easy to understand. Read it cover-to-cover a few times before you start to shoot. That will save you a lot of headaches and money! There's more info about the book here: http://www.largeformatphotography.info/books/general.html

I keep a copy of the book in my LF backpack, and refer to it in the field all the time!

Cheers,

Michael

[Pfiltz]

Get on Youtube and look for Large format videos.

Here's a good starting point:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AvHAeKltwBo

Time spent watching videos like these will save you heaps in both time and money...

Ditto on the YouTube route, as well as APUG.org and this site... That's how I cut my teeth, and I'm just a babe in the woods.

[Jim C.]

If you want to practice loading in the light, just sacrifice one sheet of film

pudentaineLf, Instead of doing that, PM me, I'll mail you a sheet or two of fubar film that I have.
Waste the good stuff shooting ;)

[John Kasaian]

No safe lights for loading panchro B&W, please.

[AtlantaTerry]

If anyone reading this thread wants some practice film I must have 20 or so sheets found in used 4x5 holders I purchased. Just drop me a note with your mailing address. USA only, please.

[Lachlan 717]

Thomas,

Maybe you can post your first shot here (http://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showthread.php?50125-Post-your-first-(LF)-shot) when it's done?

[Jac@stafford.net]

i don't have a clue [...] I can load the film or not.

Consider that shooting LF will entail greater risks of failure than simply loading film holders, so take heart and go forward with confidence that you will mess-up (we all have) but you will learn at every step.

[John Kasaian]

I envy you. Loading a film holder for the first time and eventually getting a mind blowing huge negative to show for your effort is a great feeling! Press on regardless and enjoy the adventure!:D

[pudentaineLf]

Yeah but. Darkbags get humid and clammy very fast. Better is a dark tent from Photoflex, Calumet and others. This is because the tent design is held up by spring metal hoops so there is a lot more air space. Tents do get humid, just not as fast. And tends don't have fabric touching the film, holders and your skin.

All sound good, the tent makes sense but I think I can get my bath light proof, it's small with only one small window & some local members have offered exposed film to practice with until I learn the process, I think once learned, I'll be okay, does the film come cut with all the necessary notches and such?

[pudentaineLf]

100% Yes

[AtlantaTerry]

... does the film come cut with all the necessary notches and such?

Yes, to cut the notches is an international standard. The shape and design of the cuts is up to each manufacturer. For instance, I tried some Shanghai B&W film and there is just one notch which is shaped like a wide "U".

Read my earlier reply in this thread for more information.

[AtlantaTerry]

I have mailed off four blank sheets of 4x5 film to both of the people who requested it.

In order to freak out the folks at the US Postal Service, I marked each envelope in large black printing with:
FILM!
DO NOT
X-RAY!:rolleyes:

[pudentaineLf]

Terry, Thanks so much, I received thee film the other day and am just getting back to you, sorry for the delay, a little under the whether but thanks, it will go to good use!!

[pudentaineLf]

will do!!

[Pitcherman]

I got my first LF camera about this time last year. You will find that the process just kind of draws you along. I have made just about every mistake a newby can make, but I will tell you that I now have an 8x10 and am learning about new and exciting ways to screw up with it. I will add a recommendation to decide whether the dark or the light side of the dark slide will indicate exposed or not. Decide and stick with your decision.

[AtlantaTerry]

I got my first LF camera about this time last year. You will find that the process just kind of draws you along. I have made just about every mistake a newby can make, but I will tell you that I now have an 8x10 and am learning about new and exciting ways to screw up with it. I will add a recommendation to decide whether the dark or the light side of the dark slide will indicate exposed or not. Decide and stick with your decision.

I think of it as though it were a suntan: lighter skin = unexposed to light / darker skin = exposed.

[Gregg Obst]

I think of it as though it were a suntan: lighter skin = unexposed to light / darker skin = exposed.

That makes total sense. I'm going to use this analogy to explain this part of the process to new folks from now on. It's harder for them to forget when it's explained this way. Thanks.

[Lenny Eiger]

I would say that you have a lot of resources locally. I live up in Petaluma, and if you can get here, I am always happy to give someone a quick lesson in basic techniques with a view camera. There are plenty of others even closer, i am sure. There is also a Large Format Meetup group. The people who started it are from San Jose/South Bay but the general membership is from all over the Bay Area. Nice bunch of people. They have events where they go out and shoot and everyone is happy to share their tips and tricks with people who are starting out.

Best of luck,

Lenny