Ventilation

[Allen in Montreal]

I am starting to look at ventilation in my new darkroom setup.
The easiest way would be to piggy back the exhaust to the dryer vent out of the house.

Are there any solid reasons why this should not be done?
Lint getting in to the darkroom etc?

I have a decent darkroom exhaust fan now, but if need be, Home Depot sells an inline fan to supplement the flow if need be.

http://www.homedepot.ca/product/vortex-powerfan-4-inch/995921

[dodphotography]

I picked up a range hood for 49 bucks... a few sections of 4 inch PVC and a few elbow and I was golden!

[Nathan Potter]

The piggyback scheme you mention is a bit unclear but. I think the issue with what you propose is with a possible backflow from the dryer into the darkroom when there is not enough positive pressure from the darkroom into the exhaust hose to prevent any backflow with its lint infested air. A suitable damper in the darkroom line that can be fully closed could be sufficient to avoid this backflow if it is really tight when closed.

Note also that a four inch diameter dryer hose is somewhat restrictive to a really good airflow.
I think figures are available for the pressure drop per foot for various diameter vent lines. So essentially the CFM (Cubic Feet per Minute) rating for the darkroom fan you might obtain will be diminished as a function of the exhaust vent diameter.

Nate Potter, Austin TX.

[Leigh]

Like Nathan said, you'll have hot soapy air flowing into the darkroom whenever you dry clothes.

You can buy dryer outlet kits that have the exhaust fitting for the outside wall and plastic duct.
Installation is usually simple.

- Leigh

[Leszek Vogt]

Nathan is right, I'd get a 6" separate duct (metal or abs) and hook up each fan (however many you desire) with reducer/expander...if you can do this in the attic. The abs is little tricky, at least in woodworking, where you have to wrap the pipe in ground wire to prevent spontaneous ignition. I've used ultra quiet type Broan fans and have also v. good results with Panasonic. I doubt if either are available at H. Depot, but your local elect supply place should have them (or similar). Probably the last thing you want to hear is a screeching fan (in total misery) for hours while in the darkroom.

Les

[Tin Can]

I put a 6" Panasonic right through my glass block, it moves air pretty good. Put a Broan rain vent damper hood on the outside with a bird screen that came with it.

Glad I did.

Panasonic FV-20NLF1 WhisperLine 240 CFM In-Line Fan, 6-Inch Duct

[Leigh]

Glass block wall in a darkroom? That's a novel ideal. :eek:

Guess you do your darkroom work at night.

- Leigh

[Tin Can]

It's my biggest problem, and my only windows. My condo was not designed by me, not ideal, clear glass block with tiny crank out windows above. And my only windows in the whole darn place. I am in the process of walling it all off to give the full dark I seek. The fan had to go in first, a fan inspection hatch, a storefront display hatch, a permanent street display, etc. Then make it light tight as the sinks go under it. All DIY and I have bouts of physical pain, which stops work. It's been 9 months, I had a rough winter, I need to get this done and soon. Soon as my back comes back...

Making the whole thing ADA. Darkroom and studio for my 'golden' years.

Currently I still use the bathroom/darkroom, but as I ramp up to bigger things, it's just too small. Last night the film wash tray upended into the bathtub. :(

This is a legal live/work condo building only for artists, we were the first in the country 10 years ago. I still had to petition the board for ventilation.

10 years ago I was doing only digital and did not need a darkroom.

This keeps me busy and not chasing...models. :)




Glass block wall in a darkroom? That's a novel ideal. :eek:

Guess you do your darkroom work at night.

- Leigh

[Ken Lee]

See http://www.eepjon.com/VentHoods.html

Consider ventilation hoods - which should be right above the trays, not via a ceiling or wall fan.

You want to pull the air off the trays before it goes past your nose, not afterwards.

I have purchased from Jon Edwards before and recommend him with the highest regard.

[ROL]

This is a legal live/work condo building only for artists, we were the first in the country 10 years ago.



Is that what the realtor told you? The folks over at the Brewery (http://www.thebreweryartistlofts.com/brewery_website_002.htm) in LA would be surprised at that. The lofts there were at least 10 years old when I looked at them 10 years ago.

[Tin Can]

Perhaps I have the definition wrong. This is a warehouse conversion developed by a non-profit as a sustainable artist owned condo, with a price control codicil, there was no realtor, simply a buy in group, with long term downpayments. We think we are unique in that way.

We have gotten some bad press and even a documentary was done on us. Our core group is strong and have had almost no turnover.

Don't believe everything you see in a movie or read in the news. Most of us are very happy to live here.

Bloomingdale Arts Building, formerly, http://fnewsmagazine.com/2004-nov/current/2004-nov/pages/1.shtml

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1675808/

http://the606.org/

Now our former ghetto is next to a 2 million dolar home and Chicago's newest park is being made on our street. Damn good thing we bought when we did.




Is that what the realtor told you? The folks over at the Brewery (http://www.thebreweryartistlofts.com/brewery_website_002.htm) in LA would be surprised at that. The lofts there were at least 10 years old when I looked at them 10 years ago.

[ROL]

Specifics, that's all I'm asking for, :D. And of course, I thought it was absolutely crystal that everyone already understood how gullible I am. Well, I just suppose that's the price for being Mr. Wonderful. I've actually got a few people convinced that I'm unique, only for all the wrong reasons!

[William Whitaker]

Like Nathan said, you'll have hot soapy air flowing into the darkroom whenever you dry clothes.




...Or the smell of fixer-laden air in your fresh clothes.

[Tin Can]

I have yet to meet a real clean freak analog photographer.


...Or the smell of fixer-laden air in your fresh clothes.

[wclark5179]

How long will you be working in your darkroom each time you make prints?

Hobby or main source of income for you?

I have my analog darkroom set up in a bathroom and wash the prints in the kitchen sink. I do have a fan in the bathroom but only use infrequently during a hot summers day.

Perhaps when I open the door to take a tray of prints to the kitchen helps with change of air.

[Allen in Montreal]

Wclark,
I tend to spend many long nights in the darkroom during the winter months when the sun is down early and the temperature does not invite me outdoors. During the summer months I don't often print, only process and file waiting for the snow to fall.

[Allen in Montreal]

Thank you guys,

Nathan, the negative pressure and back flow was my concern. I have to cut a hole in a very think concrete wall (it is an old building and the wall appears to be at least 1.5 times the thickness of modern homes) to exhaust.
So the idea of the "short cut" and installing a T with some type of trap made sense in the short cut effort kind of way.

I will see what costs are involved to cut a new hole through the wall and exhaust directly from the darkroom.
There will be 2x 8 foot stainless sinks, and the ceilings are just high enough, not ideal but workable.
As a result, I can't see myself using hoods. I was thinking more along the lines of a 4 inch PVC pipe along the back wall with holes every 6 inches or so to create an airflow up and towards the back wall and out.

Does that seem workable/effective?

My last darkroom was 10x12
This setup will be 12ft by 24ft. Which I find is a little too wide, the gap between dry and wet side is a little large.
But I will not move the existing wall to reduce it 2 feet. 10x24 feels like it would be perfect.

[Keith Fleming]

The here requires new houses to have a "whole house fan" on a timer. It's a good, strong exhaust fan that comes on each day and completely exchanges the air in the house. When we built our house in 1998, I had a whole house fan also installed in the my 8X10-feet basement darkroom. It is connected to a standard light switch rather than a timer. A light-proof platic louver in the door admits fresh air but not light. Given the size of my darkroom and the fan's capacity, it has worked well to keep the air fresh as I work.

The only problem I have had with the fan occurred because the builder put a round flapper on the outside wall, and it did not close fully. The following spring the starlings started building a nest in the exhaust pipe, and I had to clean it out and install a cap that opened like venetian blinds when the fan is on, and closed when I turn the fan off.

I will add that from my perspective the goal was to build a darkroom, but my wife insisted on attaching to my darkroom such things as bedrooms, kitchen, baths, living room, etc. It was a prime example of the compromises necessary in marriage.

Keith

[Drew Wiley]

Just a couple of reminders: when it is humid outside, there will be considerably more difficulty drawing the air out; so always use a bigger fan than you initially think
you need. Air is more efficiently pulled than pushed; and this also allows the noise to be isolated from the workspace. Airflow efficiency is decrease by corrugations
and bends in the exhaust duct, but you will need something of this nature to assist to mitigate light piping. Never underestimate the possibility of long-term respiratory irritation even with casual exposure. No art is worth compromising your health. Otherwise, the huge art colony at the end of the block here was demolished a few months ago, and a giant expensive condo complex is arising on the lot right now, now quite finished. In between there is a wannabee building,
currently holding an illegal indoor pot farm which presents a huge fire hazard to all those expensive condos surrounding it. The building already had a huge fire a
few years ago due to an illegal candle factory. Somehow potheads don't make very good electricians. But in the general neighborhood a couple of condos have
been specifically dedicated to either live-in artists or rental workspaces - not cheap by any means. If you want an art space in a low-rent neighborhood, you'll
want bulletproof windows! The other option is in one of the nice old communities next to a refinery - and subtract ten years from your life.

[Tin Can]

I am actually installing some scrap 3/16" diamond plate steel behind my glass block, inside my darkroom wall, as stray bullet protection. It's too thin to be bulletproof, but it should slow down the smaller calibers. It will be stealth, no point in advertising. Still a lot of stray bullets near my ghetto art condo. Been here 10 years and plan to die here of old age. God willing.


Just a couple of reminders: when it is humid outside, there will be considerably more difficulty drawing the air out; so always use a bigger fan than you initially think
you need. Air is more efficiently pulled than pushed; and this also allows the noise to be isolated from the workspace. Airflow efficiency is decrease by corrugations
and bends in the exhaust duct, but you will need something of this nature to assist to mitigate light piping. Never underestimate the possibility of long-term respiratory irritation even with casual exposure. No art is worth compromising your health. Otherwise, the huge art colony at the end of the block here was demolished a few months ago, and a giant expensive condo complex is arising on the lot right now, now quite finished. In between there is a wannabee building,
currently holding an illegal indoor pot farm which presents a huge fire hazard to all those expensive condos surrounding it. The building already had a huge fire a
few years ago due to an illegal candle factory. Somehow potheads don't make very good electricians. But in the general neighborhood a couple of condos have
been specifically dedicated to either live-in artists or rental workspaces - not cheap by any means. If you want an art space in a low-rent neighborhood, you'll
want bulletproof windows! The other option is in one of the nice old communities next to a refinery - and subtract ten years from your life.