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rbailey23
27-Jun-2013, 18:03
I've come across a nice bunch of Rodenstock Lenses. Can anyone tell me if these can be used with a Beseler 23cII for 35mm or medium format enlargement? If not what are they for? (I apologize that I am not actually into large format yet)

APO Gerogon 150mm f9
APO Gerogon 150mm f9 (different version)
APO Gerogon 210mm f9
Eskofat ultragon 210mm f8
Staeble Magnogon R 105mm f5.6
APO Gerogon 240mm f9
APO Gerogon 30mm f9
APO Gerogon S 270mm f/11

Dan Fromm
27-Jun-2013, 18:42
Go to ebay and look for selling prices.

They are process lenses, were made to be used in vertical copy cameras. They can be used as enlarging lenses but there are better lenses for that purpose. Not worth very much because the cells are not direct fits in standard shutters.

Oh, yeah. Eskofot is rebadged Staeble, Staeble was, may still be, Agfa's captive lensmaker for their copier division.

Ivan J. Eberle
28-Jun-2013, 18:30
Their utility for MF enlarging is hampered by the longish focal lengths--which will cover 4x5" film and larger--but limit the max print size from smaller negs. Most of what you listed have small max apertures which won't as easily snap in and out of focus as will a faster enlarging lens. Better for MF would be something in the 75-105mm range if you plan on making 16x20 or larger prints. Good news for you is that MF enlarging lenses are themselves practically being given away nowadays, too.

Ian Greenhalgh
4-Jul-2013, 07:25
Staeble Magnogon R 105mm f5.6

I think this one is an enlarger lens, certainly you could buy Magnogons that were enlarger lenses. Does it have a fixed aperture or a normal iris?

ic-racer
4-Jul-2013, 08:06
One should be able to use them all for enlarging lenses and they should perform well. The only one really suited to your enlarger is the 105mm which would be used for 6x9cm negatives.

Bob Salomon
4-Jul-2013, 08:08
You should be able to use them all for enlarging lenses and they should perform well. The one best suited to your enlarger is the 105mm which would be used for 6x9cm negatives.

Most will not fit a 23C lens board and none are designed to be used as an enlarging lens other then the 5.6 one possibly.

All of the Apo Geragons are wide field process lenses designed for vertical graphic arts cameras. In short, they are taking lenses designed for 1:1.

ridax
4-Jul-2013, 12:32
The 5.6/105 Magnogon is also a wide angle process lens optimized for 1:1.

The difference of the ray paths/angles is actually greater between 1:1 and 1:2 work then between 1:2 and infinity. So for enlarging, process lenses are worse then the infinity-optimized taking lenses. (But stopped down, even the process lenses are certainly usable in emergency....)

Dan Fromm
4-Jul-2013, 13:27
Folks, this is an interesting discussion but isn't really what the OP had in mind. He sent me a message berating me for being pessimistic about his lenses' values. He'd thought this forum would be a good market for them and that I'd spoiled it for him.

So much for the belief that people who post here know anything.

Carsten Wolff
4-Jul-2013, 19:25
lol

Ian Greenhalgh
6-Jul-2013, 16:20
How someone wanting to sell some lenses indicates people here don't know anything is beyond me....

People were just trying to be helpful.

Dan Fromm
6-Jul-2013, 17:01
Ian, this forum isn't the best place to try to sell lenses that are hard to put to use.

The OP hoped to make a killing. The only way to make a killing with the lenses he asked about is to find ignorant buyers. If that's what he thought he'd find here, he's ignorant.

Keith Fleming
6-Jul-2013, 20:23
It seems to be standard that any new member who asks about the value of lenses is looking for someone here to buy them or is trying to find out a price for listing on eBay. I've gotten used to checking any OP's number of posts anytime the thread title mentions the value of lenses or other equipment.

Keith

rbailey23
7-Jul-2013, 09:23
Where do you find any indication that I thought people were ignorant? As my post stated, I only asked for information about what the lenses were used for. I did not ask anyone for the price of the lenses. Thats the reason I sent Dan a message in the the first place. The value of the lenses is a subjective matter. Therefore, establishing that they are not worth anything devalues them.

ridax
7-Jul-2013, 10:07
establishing that they are not worth anything devalues them

- for ignorant people only. And certainly not on this forum.


Where do you find any indication that I thought people were ignorant?

The above statement IMHO looks like one of those indications.

And btw I don't see anyone saying the lenses were not worth anything - neither in this thread, nor anywhere else on this forum....

Dan Fromm
7-Jul-2013, 10:09
Where do you find any indication that I thought people were ignorant? As my post stated, I only asked for information about what the lenses were used for. I did not ask anyone for the price of the lenses. Thats the reason I sent Dan a message in the the first place. The value of the lenses is a subjective matter. Therefore, establishing that they are not worth anything devalues them.


A large portion of the market is on this site so I would appreciate it if you didn't go around saying they are not worth anything when I didn't ask you what they were worth.

You don't know where the market is geographically and you don't know where the market is in terms of prices. eBay and eBay. I don't set prices. I observe prices lenses bring at auction.

If you think that people here will buy lenses that are hard to put to use, you're an uniformed dreamer or you think we're ignorant fools. For nearly all of us -- the exceptions have cameras with focal plane or behind-the-lens shutters, e.g., Speed Graphics and cameras with Sinar or Packard shutters, respectively -- a free Apo-Gerogon is a worse deal than a similar Sironar in shutter at market price. And I say this even though I have a nice 210/9 Apo Gerogon in the drawer that I really should try to sell.

Ian Greenhalgh
8-Jul-2013, 04:02
I have to agree with Dan, an APO-Gerogon is not a very good thing to have if using it for shooting large format is the goal, as Dan says, they require machine work to go into a shutter. That means a substantial cost to pay a skilled machinist to do the work. There are several other ranges of similar process lenses such as the Konica Hexanon GRIIs, the Minolta P.Rokkors, the Staeble/Agfa/Eskofot/Helioprint Ultragons and others. None of them fit a shutter without machine work to adapt them, that is why they are worth little. For instance, 150 and 300mm Hexanons went for about 20ukp each on ebay UK last week. I have a 240mm Ultragon I bought a few weeks ago, it cost me less than 10ukp inc postage. I also have an APO-Gerogon 150mm, if memory serves me right, I paid 8ukp inc postage. The cells unscrew but the diameter is nowhere near any standard shutter, it would have to be mounted in a Compur/Copal #1 using adapter rings and it would cost many times the cost of the lens to have those adapters made, plus the cost of a shutter.

All this is why Schneider G-Clarons are so sought after - they do fit directly into standard shutters.

So Dan's original advice about check out ebay for pricing is valid. You must remember that your target market is large format shooters and LF shooters are, by and large, well-informed about process lenses, so they will only pay small sums for the ones that don't fit shutters because the cost of mounting into a shutter makes them more expensive than other lenses already in a shutter. No-on is going to pay a lot of money for an APO-Gerogon that cost a lot of money to make usable when they could buy a Symmar or Sironar in shutter for less than the cost of APO-Gerogon+shutter+machine work. I paid 30ukp for a Symmar 5.6/150 a couple of months ago, in a Synchro-Compur #1, cheap because it has one single small scratch on the rear element and people are afraid of scratches, but after thorough testing, it doesn't affect the image, same as 90% of other scratched lenses I've owned have been. So why would I spend a load of money getting my APO-Gerogon 150mm mounted in a shutter when I can buy a Symmar 150mm in shutter for much less.

This all reminds me of the TV show 'Pawn Stars' where someone comes in with something they think is worth a few thousand and Rick tells them it's worth 50 bucks because, as he is fond of saying 'just cos it's old, doesn't mean it's valuable'.

rbailey23
9-Jul-2013, 00:54
Once again. I didn't ask for the price. Yes, I ended up selling them. But it's not what I asked about.

Ian Greenhalgh
9-Jul-2013, 07:32
Well, sorry for trying to be helpful. In future, try to be less deceptive, your PM to Dan was rather illuminating about your motivations.

rbailey23
9-Jul-2013, 21:36
Obviously, I will have to sell lenses that I can't use. Does that mean that I have come to this site to deceive and betray? I've been treated like a villain just for showing up here.

Ian Greenhalgh
10-Jul-2013, 01:06
No you haven't, people tried to be helpful, you got snippy, now you're feeling victimised, the issue lies with you I'm afraid.