MADNESS IN FRANCE! Express Mail parcel held for almost 3 weeks in customs....

[Daniel Stone]

just had to put a shout-out to any of you potentially shipping into France(in my case, Nice) from the USA:

be ready(potentially) for your parcel to be held hostage for a while! I sent a package(Manfrotto geared head I sold via ebay) to the buyer in France.... well here's a screenshot for you to see of the USPS update email I just received:

absolute madness!
http://i1286.photobucket.com/albums/a602/acreativemind88/ExpressMailFrenchMadness.jpg

this was sent EXPRESS Mail, since Priority to France has given me fits many times before.... Bullpuckey....
I requested a refund from USPS, but they said that since it was "out of our hands"... I thought I(and the buyer) were paying for EXPEDITED services...

stupid VAT, stupid customs.... Just x-ray the parcel and be on your way and deliver the darned package!

sorry, had to get this off my chest :cool:

-Dan

[Steven Tribe]

This is pretty much the case with many EC countries. Delay combined with (with the Danish authorities anyway) opened packages (almost all packages I receive are opened and resealed), incorrectly assessed Customs duties and VAT.

As a frequent buyer of equipment more than 100 years old, I should be charged the 5% VAT rather than 25%. They never do this and it takes quite a few emails and keeping them busy for hours, in order to get the release. The last item came down to a charge of $1 VAT - PLUS the standard admin fee of $23!

[jnantz]

13 years ago i had merchandise i photographed for a record company "lost" for nearly 6 months.
it was sent priority mail from RI to DC ... and was supposed to be 3 business days.

[Tin Can]

Canada,
Delivered CANADA May 22, 2013 2:28 pm
Attempted Delivery - Item being held, addressee being notified CANADA May 22, 2013 9:29 am
Attempted Delivery - Item being held, addressee being notified CANADA May 21, 2013 4:09 pm
Attempted Delivery - Item being held, addressee being notified CANADA May 21, 2013 2:34 pm
Addressee not available - Addressee advised to pick up the item CANADA May 21, 2013 12:03 pm
Arrival at Post Office CANADA May 21, 2013 9:07 am
Arrival at Post Office CANADA May 21, 2013 7:09 am
Customs clearance processing complete CANADA May 15, 2013 3:59 pm
Processed Through Sort Facility CANADA May 13, 2013 2:50 pm
Customs Clearance CANADA May 13, 2013 2:50 pm
Processed Through Sort Facility ISC CHICAGO IL (USPS) May 10, 2013 9:02 am
Arrived at Sort Facility ISC CHICAGO IL (USPS) May 10, 2013 8:49 am
Processed at USPS Origin Sort Facility CHICAGO, IL 60688 May 10, 2013 2:09 am
Dispatched to Sort Facility CHICAGO, IL 60647 May 9, 2013 2:16 pm
Acceptance CHICAGO, IL 60647 May 9, 2013 12:39 pm
Electronic Shipping Info Received May 8, 2013

[Otto Seaman]

And this is why people don't like shipping internationally....

[Emmanuel BIGLER]

And this is why people don't like shipping internationally....

.. for example, as far as I understand, never send anything to Canada from the US.
But I can tell you the true reason of those delays for clearing the customs entering Canada: it's because Canada is officially bi-lingual and contaminated in its Eastern part by some horrible French traditions, including French madness (the worse of all French traditions together with camembert and gros rouge).
Hence you may safely ship to Canada, but to Victoria, BC, only; and nowhere else located East of this westernmost city of Canada (except, may be, Prince Rupert, BC or Whitehorse, YT : both are good, rock-solid American cities free of all bad French influence)

[gth]

.. for example, as far as I understand, never send anything to Canada from the US.
But I can tell you the true reason of those delays for clearing the customs entering Canada: it's because Canada is officially bi-lingual and contaminated in its Eastern part by some horrible French traditions, including French madness (the worse of all French traditions together with camembert and gros rouge).
Hence you may safely ship to Canada, but to Victoria, BC, only; and nowhere else located East of this westernmost city of Canada (except, may be, Prince Rupert, BC or Whitehorse, YT : both are good, rock-solid American cities free of all bad French influence)

I guess you are being sarcastic or ironic or whatever it is called. Whatever.

But returning to shipments from the US to Canada..... I have routinely received MANY shipments from the US, China, South Africa etc, to Montreal Quebec. NEVER had a problem.... (shipment from China often being fastest is seems.) All brought in via regular mail. If you bring in by UPS etc you may end up in customs. Figure it out.

So I am calling BS on these supposedly bad events, based on MY experience.

I bet there are thousands of daily transactions going across the border without a hitch, but we don't know about those do we. Only the complains that are then taken as gospel. It's BS.

My advice for shipment to Canada:

SHip regular Parcel mail, don't worry about express mail and UPS and FedEX etc. REGULAR mail, relax and you will have your shipment from the US in 4-10 days max.

DONE.

[chris_4622]

I wouldn't stress too much. I sent a small package of two photographs to Sicily and it took 4 weeks.

[Daniel Stone]

I only raised my issue in this circumstance because the buyer seemed annoyed(duh... I would be too!)

Personally, this is kinda like the whole Barry Cochran Deardorff situation: stated delivery times are "stated", but not upheld...
I sent an Express Mail parcel to Hong Kong this past week, it was there in 3 days, and delivered in 5 because of a weekend ;)...go figure. And it had an insured value (9X) what this other parcel(one in question) to France had. (9) times...

[Leigh]

The French are crazy???

Who'da believed that???

- Leigh

[Daniel Stone]

well touchdown.

USPS email just said its been delivered. 3 weeks of waiting, lets just hope customs didn't decide to use my parcel as a football for the company picnic this past weekend ;)

and no Leigh, NOT ALL of the French are crazy, just a few select individuals that taint the waters. Just like here in America, we each have our "crazies" amongst us :)

-Dan

[Leigh]

and no Leigh, NOT ALL of the French are crazy...
Wow. I thought my previous statement was unbelievable. :eek: :D

It doesn't come close to this one in that regard. :D

- Leigh

[Tin Can]

btw, I was not complaining about Canadian shipping times. I always get paid first and insure. Simply an observation. The people I have shipped to outside the US have never complained about shipping times, packing, cost or damage.

Kicking and screaming we are being drawn into a global market.

I find many still want our old USA made items, all over the world.

[Valdecus]

Last year I purchased a Grafmatic holder from a photographer in the US. The parcel was sent via USPS Priority Mail. It arrived at my place in Germany a mere 4 months later. Per stamps on the parcel it was obvious that is was shipped through the harbour of Hamburg, i.e. it came by ship...

On the other hand I frequently purchase from Really Right Stuff. Their parcels are being sent by UPS and they usually take 3-4 days to deliver. YMMV.

Cheers,
Andreas

[Daniel Stone]

IIRC, UPS/Fedex/DHL offer "healthy" discounts to companies who ship lots of items on a regular basis(do you think B&H REALLY pays $8 that they charge you for shipping? I'd venture to guess they're actually paying closer to $3-5, including labor and packing materials. THEY SHIP A LOT) Maybe I'm wrong, but I choose consistently choose USPS for int'l and domestic parcels because it means I can offer a lower cost for shipping if I sell something. No one WANTS to pay more for shipping than they have too, but sometimes(like with this parcel) I find myself scratching my head in a quandary, wondering WHY USPS and foreign customs can't have a "smooth sailing" relationship...

Oh well, I'll just have to add ANOTHER line of legalese to my ebay sales "EXPRESS mail shipments may still take weeks to months to arrive, if the destination's customs department does not want to expedite the parcel through the process in a fast manner"....

Sad...

[BarryS]

...it was obvious that is was shipped through the harbour of Hamburg, i.e. it came by ship...


Aye, the stories that Grafmatic could tell--foreign ports, loose women, odd sea creatures, things that could turn your hair white and curl your toes; all nothing to a sea-faring Grafmatic.

[Jody_S]

Shipping to FRANCE: always attach, in an envelope outside the parcel, 3 COPIES of an invoice or other documentation of what's inside and what it's worth. Also, provide the telephone no# of the French recipient, and be prepared to spend a ridiculous amount of time emailing further documentation. Plus, they often don't bother notifying anyone if they think documentation is insufficient, so the recipient must take the initiative and check with customs if it's held more than a couple of days.

Don't ask me how I learned this.

[Vick Ko]

Hmm. Never had any issues with USA to Canada shipments (I live in Canada).

But had a similar issue to the OP with a camera that I sold to France. It took forever, then the buyer tells me that the camera had been sent back to Canada. So double the wait time, for the camera to get back to me. And no explanation from the French Post Office for why it was returned, only some vague mention "that the adressee was not home."

Shipping to China is often associated with long delays too.

[Daniel Stone]

....
Shipping to China is often associated with long delays too.

au contraire...
at least in my experience(using Express Mail ONLY)
Hong Kong and mainland China SPEED THINGS THROUGH, the fastest I've had an express mail parcel(with $3k worth of HB stuff inside, stated full value on the customs forms, no invoice or other documents) get to HK was 3days to the buyer's hands.
From my hands to his, 3 days. That's fast in my book!

but a few "Priority" shipments in the past, to either HK or the mainland have taken up to 1mo to get delivered.
hence why I greatly prefer USPS Express Mail ;)

-Dan

[Denis Pleic]

While taking a parcel to USA to the post office in Croatia today, I was told that Lufthansa strike earlier this month resulted in a huge backlog with international post (packages?).... Hopefully, that backlog has cleared by now (two weeks later)...

[anglophone1]

Bought an RB67 with 4 lenses two backs etc. in a Halliburton case here two years back ( from Lenser) he shipped ( can't remember how, but he may) it arrived to my French address within a week or so, no customs delay ( or charge)whatever.
It's now a much bigger outfit and for sale here http://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showthread.php?103251-Feeler-very-full-Mamiya-RB-67-kit-in-Europe at a good price, in the EU , guaranteed no customs hassle!
Mind you the Hass kit Lenser shipped to Ireland last year was another story.....

[Jim Andrada]

I sent some stuff to a member in Canada and UPS was cheaper than USPS but he insisted I use USPS. It turns out that FedEx/UPS etc want to charge an obscene amount for customs clearance on shipments of under $1600 whereas the post office charges $5 or something similar. I read up on it and it seems like something of a scam by FedEx/UPS.

[Teodor Oprean]

Yes, that's true. FedEx and UPS love to screw Canadian recipients with ridiculous bogus fees over parcels sent from the US just because the parcel has to cross an imaginary line. In my case the bogus fees amounted to $ 40 for various invented "services". And that's on top of import taxes. It's a total rip-off.

[Jim Andrada]

I believe you can "Self-Clear" packages into Canada although the express services will try to convince you that you can't.

[Drew Bedo]

Back in the 1990s I sold an obosolete 1960 vintage US Air force aerial camera to a fellow in Japan via e-bay. He and I agreed that it would go by slow-boat the least expensive way. He got it in about six weeks and said there was no problem at all.

But that was in a by-gone time in the last decade of the previous century. A lot has happened since then.

[Drew Bedo]

Is there any way to slip through the cracks by declaring the package to be "parts' or "For Repair" or something like that (Curio?).

My father inherited a pocket watch in the 1970s that caried a significant import duty (Europ to USA). He and my grand mother went to the customs office where she made a Sara Bearnhart scerne about WW-II and the quashed Hungarian Revolution, some of which was true, . . .and they waved everything. Its a much longer story, but that isn't photography!

[Tin Can]

I always list them as 'old camera' or old 'camera part' I do list actual sale price. I use USPS and have the free special Customs envelopes and 3 copies of the printed form. No troubles yet!



Is there any way to slip through the cracks by declaring the package to be "parts' or "For Repair" or something like that (Curio?).

My father inherited a pocket watch in the 1970s that caried a significant import duty (Europ to USA). He and my grand mother went to the customs office where she made a Sara Bearnhart scerne about WW-II and the quashed Hungarian Revolution, some of which was true, . . .and they waved everything. Its a much longer story, but that isn't photography!

[gleaf]

We do business with an excellent Canadian company in an Eastern Canadian Province. To solve the shipments crossing the border issue they have a building sitting astride the border with a legal address and phone number in each country. Must indicate a systemic problem of long lasting scale on both sides of the border.

[prado333]

Send to Spain is worst.

[Marc B.]

A little side note for people that are shipping internationally; from any country on the globe, to any other country.

The 'international' postal language is French; ie...Customs forms, etc...used for international parcels/shipmants.

This is somewhat similar to English being the international language for aircraft cockpit-to air traffic control tower communications.
International Postal Conventions established French as the common, international postal language many centuries ago.
Always fill-out all forms with the senders language, and also...in French.

In most cases, I wouldn't trust the translation to online translators (like Google translate).
Get help from someone who speaks French. Easiest/cheapest way is giving all the written particulars to your kids,
and have French teachers in their high school do the translation.

Marc

[RadioFreeTerry]

I think this photo of mine sums up the bureaucracy in France very well...though it could be said of many other countries too!

95828

The only thing missing is a tumbleweed drifting across the foreground : )

[Ed Bray]

The postal authorities in the EU have been told to intercept and ensure duty & vat are paid on as many imports that qualify to restrict the purchasing of cheap items purchased from outside their borders.

Once upon a time it was a lottery how much if anything was charged when something was imported from outside the UK (value, amount or size had no bearing whatsoever), some stuff got through, some did not, now everything over a certain value gets included and it is up to the recipient to claim back anything that has been charged duty/vat when it shouldn't have.

[neil poulsen]

. . . Kicking and screaming we are being drawn into a global market.

Not me.

In a recent experience, I purchased something from the UK that needed returning. To ship it insured, I had to send it express mail. (Ouch!) I will say that it arrived in about 7 days. So, that part was good.

[eddie]

1st off if u want guarenteed overseas delivery u must us the "GXG" or whatever the name is on USPS. Check those prices! They are usually 3-4 times more than express!



IIRC, UPS/Fedex/DHL offer "healthy" discounts to companies who ship lots of items on a regular basis(do you think B&H REALLY pays $8 that they charge you for shipping? I'd venture to guess they're actually paying closer to $3-5, including labor and packing materials. THEY SHIP A LOT) Maybe I'm wrong, but I choose consistently choose USPS for int'l and domestic parcels because it means I can offer a lower cost for shipping if I sell something.
...

Actually u r wrong.....my friend runs a huge omline retail store. He used a HUGE warehouse in arizona(?), they pay like $.50, yes, 50 cents to have the packaged pulled from the shelf, boxed AND shipped! No shit! I asked him like 5 times cause i did not believe it!

Anyway, uou shoild be in france when they decide they are having a strike. They just do not hg to work. It happened to me once with the french trains.

Eddie

[gliderbee]

I think this photo of mine sums up the bureaucracy in France very well...though it could be said of many other countries too!

95828

The only thing missing is a tumbleweed drifting across the foreground : )

I doubt this picture was taken in France, since the text should be: "bureau central". Maybe somewhere in one of the former french colonies?

Stefan

[Len Middleton]

I sent some stuff to a member in Canada and UPS was cheaper than USPS but he insisted I use USPS. It turns out that FedEx/UPS etc want to charge an obscene amount for customs clearance on shipments of under $1600 whereas the post office charges $5 or something similar. I read up on it and it seems like something of a scam by FedEx/UPS.

And not all times does the Queen's Couriers (aka Canada Post) collect the taxes and related handling fee (C$5). However, you can guarantee USP and likely FedEx will.

Price of that lesson: C$25 handling fee on parcel of value less than C$100.

Not using UPS / FedEx for international parcels: Priceless, or more accurately, no revenue for them...

[gth]

And not all times does the Queen's Couriers (aka Canada Post) collect the taxes and related handling fee (C$5). However, you can guarantee USP and likely FedEx will.

Price of that lesson: C$25 handling fee on parcel of value less than C$100.

Not using UPS / FedEx for international parcels: Priceless, or more accurately, no revenue for them...

Yep, I have said it before and I say it again... For shipments from US to Canada, send REGULAR parcel mail. In 9 out 10 or LESS, the parcel passes the post office with not problem, no clearance fee or duties. It just arrives at your door in few days to a week. That is my experience.

UPS and FedEX..... goes directly into the customs broker, duties, tax and time space...

[Jim Andrada]

And I believe the C$25 was IN ADDITION to the shipping cost itself

[Jody_S]

And I believe the C$25 was IN ADDITION to the shipping cost itself

In my experience, UPS will charge fees and brokerage costs amounting to roughly 40-60% of the declared value of the parcel, assuming that's over $50 or so (for lower amounts, fees may be 200% or more). Their 'brokerage fee' is not a set amount. So, basically, it's a scam. I refuse to purchase from anyone who insists on shipping UPS/Fedex, as I will not pay these fees and they generally refuse to let me clear them from customs myself.

[Jim Andrada]

Actually they CAN'T refuse to let you clear them yourself - you have a right to select your own customs broker or do it yourself at least on small (ie under $1300 or $1600 or so) shipments. They will try hard to convince you/cow you etc into believing that you can't do it but you CAN!

And you DON'T have to go to some bizarre out of the way port of entry to do it. There are some really long (but informative) threads on the subject that give all the details - there are also some discount brokers that you can use if it isn't worth the time and trouble to do it yourself.

http://trueler.com/2010/09/13/ups-brokerage-fees-total-scam-fraud-cheating-avoid-it/

[Jim Andrada]

By the way, if you can make it to near the end of that hundred page blog I linked to they mention a discount broker by name IIRC.

[Capocheny]

Emmanuel,

With all due respects... I think your comment isn't truly indicative of the situation with shipping into Canada. Like all countries, there can be snags but I think these tend to be the exception rather than the rule.

Cheers.



I guess you are being sarcastic or ironic or whatever it is called. Whatever.

But returning to shipments from the US to Canada..... I have routinely received MANY shipments from the US, China, South Africa etc, to Montreal Quebec. NEVER had a problem.... (shipment from China often being fastest is seems.) All brought in via regular mail. If you bring in by UPS etc you may end up in customs. Figure it out.

So I am calling BS on these supposedly bad events, based on MY experience.

I bet there are thousands of daily transactions going across the border without a hitch, but we don't know about those do we. Only the complains that are then taken as gospel. It's BS.

My advice for shipment to Canada:

SHip regular Parcel mail, don't worry about express mail and UPS and FedEX etc. REGULAR mail, relax and you will have your shipment from the US in 4-10 days max.

DONE.


Have to agree with you wholeheartedly... I've had items sent in from the U.S. without any issues whatsoever!

Patience is a virtue!

I sent a package over to South Adelaide, Australia filled with camera gear back about 10 years ago. Unfortunately, I used one of those ultra-sturdy "apple-box crates" and, lo and behold, it was held up in Australian customs for well over 6 weeks. The purchaser emailed me wondering where the package was.

At the end of the day, the agricultural department finally released it from quarantine!

[And, yes, the declaration form was filled out with "camera equipment" as being the content in the box. But, in this case, they were concerned with the box, which is understandable.]

The buyer, who is a great fellow with a terrific sense of humor got quite a chuckle over it. We still laugh over the incident to this day!

So, that said, I'll simply reiterate, "Patience is a virtue!" :)

Cheers

[Capocheny]

I sent some stuff to a member in Canada and UPS was cheaper than USPS but he insisted I use USPS. It turns out that FedEx/UPS etc want to charge an obscene amount for customs clearance on shipments of under $1600 whereas the post office charges $5 or something similar. I read up on it and it seems like something of a scam by FedEx/UPS.

Hi Jim,

I NEVER, EVER use UPS/FedEx, etc for delivery because they do charge an extraordinary amount for their "customs brokerage charges."

I'll stick with USPS even though they may charge a wee bit extra for their service. At the end of the day... it's still far less costly than the charges from the courier services.

Cheers

[dmulick]

Hi. How'd you deal with that? Because I sent a return package to a store with a confirmed delivery date (which was a month back) and USPS just sent me a mail saying it's held in customs- you should talk to the addressee. In this case, the addressee will not help! Why was customs holding and package and how did you free it???

[dmulick]

Any one! Please help!! My package has been with the French customs for a month- they cleared it, and then kept a hold on it (no idea why) and USPS won't help!! How do I get my package freed from customs????

[djdister]

Any one! Please help!! My package has been with the French customs for a month- they cleared it, and then kept a hold on it (no idea why) and USPS won't help!! How do I get my package freed from customs????

The recipient in the destination country (France) should contact the Customs folks to determine the reason for the hold up. Very difficult to do from the sending end...

[Steven Tribe]

Delay in Customs (basically these days just an enforcement of Value added Tax on entry to the EU) can be due to the recipient of the item in France not paying paid the release fee (tax plus admin fee).

[Regular Rod]

"One day we will rise up and kill them all..."

:(
RR

[Bill_1856]

Nothing new there. I understand that Napoleon supplied his troops in Russia with food and warm clothes via French Express Mail.

[Jody_S]

Probably missing documentation. Your recipient will need to contact Customs and supply proof of value, then pay the taxes, but it may already be on it's way back to you.

[murphy]

My exp multiple time, they are very picky, & generally want a customs fee. This is up to the buyer, who must go down & pay to pick up package. One of the harder countries to deal with, although the people are great customers.

[domaz]

I ship internationally all the time and my wife does as well for her Internet business. The only country we've had problems with is China and we suspect it was actually the receiver not picking up the package on purpose. This may sound obvious but are the people having issues filling out the custom form correctly and honestly? Sending as a gift or without a proper description is going to red flag you.

[swmcl]

I once shipped a small package the size of a letter to Perth Western Australia from Crawley West Sussex in England in about 32 hours ...

What this is like is a courier picking up the package driving it to the plane waiting on the tarmac and a courier at the other end. Absolutely unbelievable.

Shipping has changed somewhat since the early 90's ...

[JMB]

"stupid VAT"

If I were European I would revolt. This sort of government (and frequently private) theft is outrageous and totally inconsistent in my experience. I never hesitate to produce a story to avoid paying it at customs when necessary. And I never pay a private seller VAT when he adds it to a purchase price.

[Bogdan Karasek]

I guess you are being sarcastic or ironic or whatever it is called. Whatever.

But returning to shipments from the US to Canada..... I have routinely received MANY shipments from the US, China, South Africa etc, to Montreal Quebec. NEVER had a problem.... (shipment from China often being fastest is seems.) All brought in via regular mail. If you bring in by UPS etc you may end up in customs. Figure it out.

So I am calling BS on these supposedly bad events, based on MY experience.

I bet there are thousands of daily transactions going across the border without a hitch, but we don't know about those do we. Only the complains that are then taken as gospel. It's BS.

My advice for shipment to Canada:

SHip regular Parcel mail, don't worry about express mail and UPS and FedEX etc. REGULAR mail, relax and you will have your shipment from the US in 4-10 days max.

DONE.

Since I also live in Montréal, QC, I routinely deal with buying and selling on this, and on the auction site, to and from the USA, Europe, Asia, I have to agree with the fellow photographer from Montréal. Regarding shipping from the USA, USPS is still the most reliable and cheapest because they do not slap on duty, and and the item goes right through. I refuse to buy anything that will be shipped by FED EX and UPS, because they automatically slap on duty and bill you, even in cases were items are are DUTY FREE. You have to file a claim... I don't need the hassle. Like it was said, a simple parcel will do. And First Class International does exist in the USPS. Sellers in the USA keep telling me that the Post Office tells to ship Priority International...... The seller has to ask for 1st Class INternational

et le monsieur de Besançon.... MERDE!

[RSalles]

Fedex here has delivered a package with some delay, called me 3 days later of their delivery telling me they had lost the pack ( they hadn't any idea in fact where the package was).

DHL from England brought me a Norma, forwarded the package to the most cheap category of shipment in the country - the affordable option at the official mail service.
The box came like a dozen of rats have lunching for days and in a shape as if an elephant has used it as a blanket.

Renato

[gleaf]

My favorite bit of 8mm home movie film was the neighbors shots of the longshoremen in a certain European port jumping on packages to get them to fit the corners of the hold..... Surely the disgruntled employee of any organization is a random threat anyone's timely service.