suggestions for affordable portable 8x10 camera

[dimento]

Hi guys,

I mostly shoot portraits & some landscape work. I use a Sinar F1, Super Graphic and a Cambo SCX 8x10. Although I love the movements and precision of the Cambo, it weighs a ton and is really awkward to transport.

I used the 8x10 on the street a few days ago for portraits and it was hellish.I'm looking for suggestions for a lighter 8x10, maybe field or folder, pretty sure I can't afford a Deardorff even if I sell the cambo, any suggestions for options much appreciated.

Thanks

D

[Andrew Plume]

yes, an 8 x 10 monorail out on the streets, surely is as you say hellish, has to be used out of the back of a vehicle and with a minimum distrance from that, which limits your options

new or used..................?

a Field will be a folder, unelss it's the Walker

Chamonix, perhaps?

Dorff's are pretty heavy..............you could get by with this if you used a small trolley type effort

G Tice uses a Dorff, of course

it depends also on the weight of the lenses that you're intending to use and the weight/features of the Camera that you will need for that - how about working back from the lens(es) and see what you reach

just my few Euros worth

regards

andrew

[Nicolasllasera]

Im exactly in the same problem but my 8x10 is a Cambo Legend. I went hiking yesterday for around 4 hours and it was really hard. I've been wanting a Chamonix but need to save.

Good luck.

[Brian Ellis]

If you're looking for something around $1,000 or less you probably should be looking at one of the older 8x10s such as Burke & James, Agfa Ansco, Korona, et al. The newer "light" 8x10s (e.g. Wehman, which is no longer made, Ritter, et al) will cost more than the Deardorff you say you can't afford. But as I'm sure you know, these older 8x10s aren't all that light though likely less than the Cambo you're using now.

[unixrevolution]

I have an 8x10 Korona, and though I certainly wouldn't say it's light, I would say that if I could get mine into a backpack I'd have a good time of taking it far afield.

Unfortunately, I can't seem to find a backpack that fits the bloody thing. I need a main chamber of at least 6x15x16.

[Jody_S]

My late 1880s folder (ROC Universal) weighs in at about half a Deardorff, is smaller, much cheaper, and does most of what I need in a field camera (movements are limited). I use standard holders in the back, with a spacer. Plus, it's a bit of a conversation piece when I tell people how old it is, and how I restored it from a box of unglued pieces.

[Ari]

I briefly owned a B&J Commercial View.
Light for an 8x10, full movements, and pretty cheap (it was in very good condition).
Folded up nicely, too.

[John Kasaian]

I'd look for a Century Universal or Agfa Ansco, but keep my eyes open for a Deardorff V8 with NFS or Kodak Master View that might fit into the ol' budget.

[Jim Noel]

My choices in order are:
Century Universal -more movements than many monrails and very light. They often sell at give away prices. It is th one camera I have owned that Iwish I still had.
Tachihara - still available used. A good field camera although the bellows is a bit short for my tastes.
Kodak 2D - Ample movement, weighs about the same as the Tachihara, but more than the Universal, easy to find for decent prices.

The Agfa Ansco weighs considerably more than any of these.

[Alan Gales]

I paid $1,500,00 for my used Wehman. When you can find one for sale they usually go for that or a little more.

When I bought my camera I was wanting to spend about $1,000.00 and all I could find were the cameras that Brian mentioned plus the 2D. What I really wanted was a Wehman, Kodak Master or Deardorff. The Kodak Master's I found were all around $2,000.00 and Dorf's that were $1,000.00 or less looked worn out. When a nice Wehman came up on Ebay for $1,500.00 I stepped up to the plate and bought it. It was more than I wanted to spend so I sold some of my medium format gear to make up the difference.

Good luck in your search.

[dimento]

wow thanks for all the suggestions, Ansco or B&J prob most likely to fit in the budget, temporary revision of shooting plans needed until a large enough war chest can be accumulated, thanks again, D

[barnninny]

affordable portable 8x10

Sorry. I just wanted to see those words side-by-side again. :)

[Bob Salomon]

First, how much is affordable?
A Linhof Kardan Standard 810 was light and used should be in the affordable range. Note that that is the name of the camera. Any other Kardan 810 will heavy and expensive.
Wista 810 can also be "affordable used, and it folds.

[Leonard Robertson]

A couple of 8X10 camera weights to compare with your Cambo - 8X10 Ansco grey painted with front tilt 13 1/4 pounds. 8X10 Eastman 2D without extension rail 10 3/4 pounds. The extension rail weighs another 1 1/4 pounds, so if you carry the rail, the Eastman is only a little lighter than the Ansco (with the extension built into the bed). These weights were done on a kitchen scale so aren't accurate to the ounce, but will give you an idea. If you have a means to weigh your Cambo, I'm curious what it weighs in at.

I have a vague memory of an 8X10 Deardorff weighing about 12 pounds or a bit more, but I don't know where I got that idea. Maybe someone can weight one and post an accurate weight.

Len

[dimento]

Thanks for replies, I should have been more specific, perhaps my question should have been is there a field/folding/flatbed 8x10 out there for a max of $600-$1000 I was just wondering what other people had or have used, whet they recommended based on personal experience and what they paid, thanks

The Cambo, for what it's worth, with lens attached feels like about 10-12 kg (22.5-26ish lbs)

[Alan Gales]

If you don't mind it being ugly you can advertise that you are looking for an older "user" Deardorff on the forum here. Maybe someone has a camera to sell you for $1.000.00 or less. The oldest models don't have front swing and go for less money.

[Jon Shiu]

The magnesium Calumet C1 is also around 13 lbs. as I recall, and folds up fairly compact.

Jon

[gliderbee]

Bulldog?

[cuypers1807]

Sorry. I just wanted to see those words side-by-side again. :)

Ha! If the OP wasn't already an 8x10 shooter I would have compared shooting 8x10 to owning a horse. The initial price is not the problem. It is when you feed them that the over all price becomes apparent. :)

[Jim Noel]

Try 16 lbs for the C1

[Jim Noel]

I have a Wehman. It weighs almost exactly the same as the 2D. With the plastic viewing screen, and the lightened bed it loses about 2-3 lbs. My choice for a lightweignt and less costly 8x10 has to be the Universal at around 7 1/2 lbs,

[Carl J]

D., I personally would try not to settle for anything more than, say, 13lbs. with extension. That's still pretty hefty but manageable within your budget (most Deardorff's excepted, although one did go for around your upper limit not that long ago). Not sure how many lenses or holders, or what tripod/head you carry but you know the drill. That Century Universal sounds like a great option if you can find one. At the very least, just about whatever you find will be more portable than the Cambo. Will keep you posted if I see anything.

[Greg Y]

In defense of the 'Dorff, they're great cameras. Before I trimmed the 8x10 & 4x10 & settled on the 5x7 Deardorff, I backpacked with the 810. The total weight, as suggested depends on the lenses & holders. I could happily live with an 8x10 and a 14" Commercial Ektar. If you buy a camera in good working order...there is no need to ever replace it. A hundred sheets of 8x10 Tri-X is about $750....so personally I wouldn't be looking for a cheap camera, but a good one....Wehmann, Deardorff, Chamonix...KMV

[Vascilli]

Try 16 lbs for the C1

The C1 is a brute, magnesium or not. A magnesium Eastman Commercial View (Pretty much the Kodak 2D in metal) is much lighter at the cost of most front movements. It also folds up much better.

[welly]

Ilford 8x10 pinhole? It's both affordable and portable!

[gliderbee]

Have a look here: www.bulldogcameras.com

Stefan

[goamules]

Yes, 8x10s are big and heavy. And need a tripod and big holders. Exactly what are we trying to solve here? Carrying one from your car to the setup site? From the car into the woods a quarter mile? On a month long hike along the Appalachian trail? This thread sounds a lot like solutions looking for problems.

The first two scenarios are easy, I could carry ANY field camera that far. The latter, I'd pick a smaller format. Use the right tool for the right job.

[anglophone1]

Op specifically talks about " street portraiture" with 8x10 ( something that also interests me) however is this actually being adressed in many replies-I think not!

[dimento]

Thanks for all the replies, it seems like no matter how you describe the issue it's not specific enough for some people. So to be as forthright as possible, I did a shoot last week where I carried a Cambo scx with lens in a reinforced shopping bag about 1/4 mile, I carried 7 loaded holders in a shoulder bag along with a single digital body as polaroid, I don't consider myself a weakling, I go to the gym 2-3 times a week, but I struggled, I had a friend helping who carried the tripod ( a heavy duty manfrotto) and roll of white paper. I had to stop every 20 yards with the cambo to change hands, the monorail was awkward to use on the street, I suspect I need a larger plate on my tripod as it didn't seem very stable and every move of camera position was precarious, I awoke the following day with the beginnings of recurrence of my tendonitis in both arms, so to reiterate my original and subsequently modified question


Has anyone found a (lighter and less awkward than cambo) solution in 8x10 that can be purchased used in the approx price range of $600-$1000 that weighs less than the cambo (and it's not just the weight-it's the lack of foldability/portability)

Thanks to all who have made helpful suggestions and given specific experiences, and to those who feel the need to be pedantic and tell me what I already know please post your un-helpfulness elsewhere. If I have made the decision to shoot portraits on the street with 8x10 it's because I want to use that format, I already know that it would be easier with my Sinar F or Super Graphic or DSLR for that matter.

[dimento]

Op specifically talks about " street portraiture" with 8x10 ( something that also interests me) however is this actually being adressed in many replies-I think not!

Thanks Clive, when are you up in Cork next so we can meet for that coffee

[Brian C. Miller]

dimento, I have a 8x10 Cambo too, and IIRC the weight is about 18 pounds, or 8kg. Yes, it's a beastly monorail. There are various threads on packing cameras, and your best options are a baby stroller or a good backpack frame, the kind that comes without the pack on it.

The old Kodak cameras fold up nicely, but what I'd recommend is that you build a camera for what you want to do. The Bulldog only has 360mm of extension, so you'd be using a "wide" lens with it for focusing closely enough to make a portrait.

There's two parts to your question. First, pack weight. Second, using the camera. You don't need movements, and you need the camera to only be as long as the front and rear standards.

Oh, I figured it out! Keep your camera, just build a different lower frame for it. The front and rear lensboard carriers are on those rods, so to take it apart just slide them up off the rods. Make a sliding bed frame from hollow aluminum, with rods for the lensboard carriers (or whatever they're actually called). That will save a lot of weight, and the camera will be useable enough for street portraits.

[Jon Shiu]

I have used the green magnesium Calumet C1. Folded up it is compact and has a handle at the top for easy carrying (top handles are great for handling). I carried the camera in one hand and the tripod with a shoulder strap. Shoulder bag with 3 holders, meter etc. It can be unfolded and set up in couple of minutes.

I have also hiked with the C1 in a backpack up and down steep trails etc. One time I slipped and fell backwards onto it and it didn't hurt it a bit.

Jon

[Peter York]

http://www.largeformatphotography.info/century/century_universal_8x10.html

[dimento]

again thanks, excellent suggestions and plenty food for thought, thanks to Brian for an innovative solution, the fabrication gene skipped this generation I'm afraid, now my dad or uncle they could have fashioned something like you suggest, all appreciated, thank you kindly

[Jac@stafford.net]

the fabrication gene skipped this generation

Good realization. Each generation is changed. Makers (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maker_culture) are not really going away. They are simply not well recognized. There is a powerful revival, and it will return. Hop in the train. Here is just start (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mlrB6npbwVQ). Welcome~!

[AuditorOne]

Ok, I realize this is quite late but this is what I do right now. I backpack an 8x10 Deardorff V8with 4 film holders in a large, frame style, backpack. There is a company that will custom build you a set of bags that will attach to a backpack frame for just about any type of camera you can think of. On a good, balanced, frame style backpack my Deardorff is not hard at all to carry. I usually carry a loupe, a dark cloth, a changing tent, extra film, a Pentax Spotmeter, my lunch, and a rain suit/jacket for unexpected showers. I also carry a Carbon Fiber Gitzo Series 3 Tripod equipped with a nice, Majestic, geared Pan/Tilt head. The tripod and head is the heaviest thing I carry but again, when strapped to the backpack frame, it does not feel bad to carry it.

Now, I do not go very far. I have been known to pack this load around 4 miles into the mountains, but that is a very long hike for me. Typically it is no more than a mile round trip. I also own a monstrous big Cambo Legend as well, and I love it. I suspect that if I bought the right gear to pack it in I could carry it around as well. However, it is used primarily in the house for still lifes, etc. Since the Deardorff folds up it is a whole lot easier to get it packed up, and then unpacked for use, then packed up again to go back to the car, or go to another location. So for me, the real benefit of the folding field camera is not so much the weight, it is being able to fold it into a relatively (for 8x10) compact package.

Finally, I could not agree more that you should be looking for a good camera you can work with. The weight is not as much of an issue (within reason) as your comfort in working with it and the ability to use it for great images. I could not imagine how much frustration I would feel if I had just packed my gear 3 miles into the mountains, got it all set up for a stunning, once in a lifetime image, and then have something break, or not work as it should because I had skimped on the camera. It is not the price of the camera that will break you, most of us can save enough to afford a decent camera, it is the cost of all the accessories and film that will make you wonder if you really wanted to shoot 8x10 or not.

Of course, one stunning image where the detail and tonality goes on forever and ever, and you will suddenly remember exactly why you are doing it.

[dimento]

again, kind thanks for your suggestions and personal experiences, maybe I am a wimp after all! a good weekend to all

[Ari]

Thanks for all the replies, it seems like no matter how you describe the issue it's not specific enough for some people. So to be as forthright as possible, I did a shoot last week where I carried a Cambo scx with lens in a reinforced shopping bag about 1/4 mile, I carried 7 loaded holders in a shoulder bag along with a single digital body as polaroid, I don't consider myself a weakling, I go to the gym 2-3 times a week, but I struggled, I had a friend helping who carried the tripod ( a heavy duty manfrotto) and roll of white paper. I had to stop every 20 yards with the cambo to change hands, the monorail was awkward to use on the street, I suspect I need a larger plate on my tripod as it didn't seem very stable and every move of camera position was precarious, I awoke the following day with the beginnings of recurrence of my tendonitis in both arms, so to reiterate my original and subsequently modified question


Has anyone found a (lighter and less awkward than cambo) solution in 8x10 that can be purchased used in the approx price range of $600-$1000 that weighs less than the cambo (and it's not just the weight-it's the lack of foldability/portability)

Thanks to all who have made helpful suggestions and given specific experiences, and to those who feel the need to be pedantic and tell me what I already know please post your un-helpfulness elsewhere. If I have made the decision to shoot portraits on the street with 8x10 it's because I want to use that format, I already know that it would be easier with my Sinar F or Super Graphic or DSLR for that matter.

The only piece of equipment that I still have from before 2001 is the older version of this: http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/43600-REG/Remin_S600_Super_600_Cart.html

That handcart cost me $100 at the time, and each time I used it, I said to myself "This is the best photo accessory I've ever bought."; that's still true today.

Consider getting one of these; I've loaded a large monorail case, case full of film holders, case of grip stuff, heavy-duty tripod, and a 5' roll of seamless and rolled it around town all by myself without breaking a sweat.

After using a proper cart, what size/weight camera you bring and how much gear you use won't be so important.