Vintage Glass for 8x20

[Juan V.]

I've gone through all of the archives looking at the 8x20 lens discussions and can't figure out what lenses the photographers contemporary to the Korona/Folmer&Schwing cameras when new (1910's and 1920's,etc) would have used. The cameras have short rails, 20" for the Korona I measured, and would have been used at close distances for banquets. I know the front tilt buys you some depth, but even for the older 14" Dagor there isn't much extension. I'm interested in shooting 8x20 (old Korona), and have a 19" Artar, but would like some other choices that [A] allow closer focusing [B] can use the existing rail length, and [C] won't bankrupt me. I don't have a set price range, but new would probably not be an option, hence the question about vintage optics. Were Dagors the only option?

[David du Busc]

I believe the FSs were designed with only a front rail. The Koronas were, I think, designed with a rear rail allowing greater bellows extension. My 7x17 Korona has a rear rail and about 30 inches of bellows . You may have some extra bellows length to use.

You might not need a shorter lens [which could give you distortion at closer distances], but a rear rail to use with the Artar. This doesn't address B but does cover A & C . Good luck,

David

[sanking]

Extension tracks were available for Korona 8X20 and 7X12 cameras, but very rarely for the 12X20.

No extension was available for the F&S cameras so far as I know.

Many wide angle lenses were available for the banquet cameras. The most popular were the Protar Series IV, and f/12.5 medium wide angle lenses and the Series V extreme wide angle lenses, an f/18 lens. These lenses were made Protars by both Bausch & Lomb in the US and by Zeiss in Germany. Lenses similar to the Protar IV and V were made under license by other lens manufacturers, including Ross in England and perhaps Cooke as well. In addition, the design was copied without license widely.

Since these vintage wide angle lenses offer performance sometimes not available in modern optics people who own and use the banquet cameras are always on look out for them and you will not find many bargains in the area of wide angle lenses made by Cooke, Ross, Bausch and Lomb and Zeiss, certainly not on ebay and most certainly not if they are called Protars.

However, for your 8X20 camera there are some fairly inexpensive option in both modern and vintage optics in the 12" to 16" range, of which the least expensive would probably be a 12" or 14" Dagors. Another good lens that can usually be found for not a lot of money is the 355 f/5.6 convertible Symmar. This is a big piece of glass but covers 12X20 so should give you some room for movements on 8X20. The 450mm Nikkor M is also a good lens for 8X20 and is not very expensive. The 270mm f/9 Computar would also cover 8X20 in the area of extreme wide angle.

[Jim Galli]

The other day I picked up an "8X10 Plastigmat" on Ebay for $58. It seems to be a Protar VII type from the reflections. 2 brights and 3 ghosts in each cell. No stated focal length but educated guess is 15" with both cells and 28" with just the rear cell. Didn't try the front by itself but it looks to be symmetrical. Anyways I was so tickled with the 810 pics I did over Memorial day in the Bristlecones that I hung it on the front of the 820. It covers. I haven't made any 820 images with it but my guess is the corners would suffer pushing it that much. It's 100 years old, and all the Volute needed was to clean both pistons and cylinders. Checked it with a tester after the cleaning and it was dead on. Even at the 3 second setting. Neat stuff.

[sanking]

Jim,

Great story, and wonderful that the lens wound up the hands of someone who could appreciate it. Proves that there are still bargains out there, if you know how to look.

But here is the thing. The qualities of the most useful wide angle lenses (in particular the extreme wide angle specimens of the Protar f/12.5 and f/18 type) are very well known, and one would have to be very lucky or very persistent to find a Vintage lens of this type in good condition of less than 10" focal length capable of covering 8X20.

No question, if your needs can be satisfied with slightly wide angle and normal coverage lenses (and a 15" lens for 8X20 fits into that cateory, in my opinion) there are quite a number of Vintage lenses that might satisfy your requirements.