View Full Version : Minimum vol of HC110B in Epert 3010

Ron Bose
30-May-2004, 12:39
I've finally cleaned up my CPP processor and have film to develop, but I have one question:

The Expert 3010 tank recommends a minimum of 500 mL of developer.

Is this enough HC110B to process ten sheets of 4x5 ? If not what is the correct volume ?

Can I use 500mL of Stop, Fixer and hypo-clearing ??

I'll use photo-flo in a tray after washing.

Thanks ! Ron

Ron Bose
30-May-2004, 13:34
At the risk of answering my own question ...

If Jobo say that for 10 sheets of 4x5 500mL of developer is needed (for B&W film), then presumably this applies to all B&W developers.

It's only the processing time that is affected by the developer type.

Therefore, for HC-110 dil B, I need 500 mL for ten sheets and I need a development time of 2m30s at 22 deg C. Right ?

Andre Noble
30-May-2004, 13:34
Ron, have you searched for the pdf file for H110B from the Kodak web site? They usually give that info in the tech sheet pdf.

10 sheets of 4x5 film equates to appx 200 sq. feet of film. (Kodak often gives capacities for 80 sq. inches of film, if I recall correctly).

30-May-2004, 14:58
"If Jobo say that for 10 sheets of 4x5 500mL of developer is needed"

They mean use no less then 500ml. I don't know about the Expert drums but the 2500 type drums won't be hurt by using more developer. OTOH the processor has it's own limits to worry about. I'd rather run less film then skimp on developer volume.

Ron Bose
30-May-2004, 16:18

I checked the Kodak tech datasheet and it talks about dev times but not volumes.

I saw a note that I wrote down when I last spoke to Jobo and it states:

200 mL of developer per 80 sq.in. of film.

80 sq.in. is equivalent to 1x 135-36 or 1x 120 or 4x sheets of 4x5 or 1x sheet of 8x10.

Therefore 10 sheets, 500 mL ...

Bruce Watson
30-May-2004, 16:42
I've done 10 sheets of Tri-X in a 3010 drum on a Jobo CPP-2, using 500 ml of HC 110B (and 500ml of stop, fix, etc.) may times. Worked quite well for me from a processing perspective. I found that 5 minutes at 20C was too much developing for my negatives though - my CI was too steep.

My next steps lead me to 1000ml of HC 110H (aka "twice B") for 5 minutes at 20C which was still too much (CI still too steep), even after I cut rotation down the the minimum the CPP-2 would do.

Now I'm using 1000ml of XTOL 1:3 for 7.5 minutes at 20C, using the same 3010 and CPP-2 (about 30 rpm). This gives me results which are just right, for me. YMMV of course.

tim atherton
30-May-2004, 16:43
kodak lists 2.5 8x10 sheets per litre for trays and 5 8x10 sheets per litre for tanks - not sure where rotary tanks would fit into that

but the latter is the same as Ron gives - 400sq in per litre or 200sq in for 500ml = 10 sheets of 4x5

tim atherton
30-May-2004, 16:45
there is a table aton page 7


Ron Bose
30-May-2004, 17:10

The numbers I have for TXP320 is 3 minutes at 20 deg C ...


I did see those numbers but I thought they were more to do with the capacity limits for dip and dunk developer quantities and use of the replenisher.

I'm glad that the quantity per sq.in. number is the same.

Well, the CPP is settling out, all the fluids are in the bath and I'm waiting for the temperatures to settle out, I'll leave it for an hour.

We'll see how it goes with 3 mins of development.

Ron Bose
30-May-2004, 20:53
I did the pre-soak stage for five-minutes and when I dumped the liquid it was an ink-like dark blue. Now did this come from the film or was it likely to be contaminant from the JOBO's lift unit ??

The negs look fine, I'll wait until they're dry then look at them under a loupe.

tim atherton
30-May-2004, 21:16
I think that's the anti-halation coating - it's normal

tim atherton
30-May-2004, 21:17
and on Forte films it comes out a deep emerald green....

Bruce Watson
31-May-2004, 10:42

Kodak gives different times for the new Tri-X vs. the old Tri-X. I'm still using the old Tri-X, but found my processes required that I pull my times down considerably from Kodak's recommended start times. Kodak also recommends at least 5 minutes for development times, IIRC, to minimize the risk of uneven development. How they expect you to reconcile a 3 minute recommended development time with a 5 minute recommended minimum time is another discussion.

I wasn't willing to go much below 5 minutes and I couldn't find a dilution of HC 110 that would give me acceptable densities within that constraint. That's why I moved to XTOL.

Henry Ambrose
31-May-2004, 12:07
Be careful when you quote or read developer amounts. Be sure all involved understand whether its "stock" or "working" Usually minimum amounts are given as "stock". How you dilute it is your choice, just make sure you have enough "stock" in the "working" solution. And use plenty of developer! Its cheap! And if you use five cents more developer each time, who cares? Are your photos worth an extra nickel?

I stay with longer development times for several reasons. First is timing error, 30 seconds more or less is a much smaller error with longer times - as times approach twelve minutes this kind of error becomes almost negligible - you could probably not see a difference between 11:30 and 12:00. With a three minute time, 30 seconds is not negligible! Fumble your pour in or out and you will get inconsistencies.

Compounding the problem is the diffculty of plus or minus development using a short normal time. At three minutes you will have a tough time doing repeatable adjustments. At ten - twelve minutes you will actually have a chance to get what you want each time. Plus development of 20 percent is 2 minutes based on a ten minutes dev. time. With 3 minute development time you have only 36 seconds - so don't bumble it!

I have owned a Jobo with lift and processed C-41 which has a developer time of 3 minutes, 15 seconds and my results were excellent. But thats a different process. I think lots of dilute developer and a longish development time is better for B&W.