Just got some Adox CMS II (4 x 5 and 120)

[Jim Andrada]

I'll give it a try in the next day or so and report back. I ordered it from Freestyle a couple of weeks back and it was out of stock at the time - now they show it as "short supply"

Probably overkill considering that I scan on an Epson 750, but I really want very slow film. It's so bright around here that it's hard to wave my hands fast enough when using barrel lenses.:cool:

[RawheaD]

I went and really read up on this film for the first time and now I'm intrigued!! I think I may need to pick up a box of 4x5 and a few rolls of 120! Did you actually have to call them?

[Jim Andrada]

No, it showed as out of stock with more coming on 3/15 so I just ordered it. Then it showed as coming on 3/22. Then I got it today (although LA to Tucson is only overnight by truck, so it probably shipped yesterday.)

I got 10 rolls of 120 and a 50 sheet box of 4 x 5. I also got 5 bottles of the special developer. They say each bottle should do 6 rolls of 120. If I get a chance tomorrow I'll shoot a roll and see how it comes out and post a couple of scans.

[RawheaD]

Ah, so maybe I'll just go ahead and put my order in as well.

If you are willing, after spending all that money on the developer, to experiment a little, could you try Rodinal 1:200 15min semi-stand with one roll, preferably so that you could do a meaningful side-by-side with one that you use the Adotech?

The results here using 35mm film and that process looks quite promising:

http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=116832

[Filmnut]

I'm quite interested in how this works out for you. I'm nearly finished the old Adox CMS I have.

[C_Remington]

My 35mm will be here Wednesday.

[Jim Andrada]

By the way, I just noticed the following in the description of development in Adotech II

Comparing ADOTECH II with ADOTECH I
the characteristic curve of the films was straightened
which results especially to an improved highlight
differentiation.

I saw the APUG thread re needing to essentially needing to pull 1 stop to get good highlight separation and better shadow detail. Maybe not necessary with the newer version. I'm running a side by side test rating it at 12 and at 6 so we'll see. I'm also taking the same shots with Acros as a control. I'm doing the test with the 120 film and my Mamiya RB with the 140mm macro lens as I think it's the sharpest lens in my toolbox. I'll post the results. Will also follow up with a couple of 4 x 5 tests.

I suspect that my scanner will be the limiting factor here, but I'm planning to get a few of the negs drum scanned to complete the test.

[RawheaD]

Jim, you are our hero. Invaluable tests for sure.

[Jim Andrada]

Thanks for the kind words - but the results aren't in yet! I thought I'd get the film developed yesterday but reality set in and I got one photo on all three films before Tokyo woke up and the all night phone calls with my clients started. Hopefully will get a few more in the next hour or so. Hopefully....

[C_Remington]

Hurry up!!

;^)

Jim, what kind of work do you do?? Sounds interesting.

[Jim Andrada]

Off topic of course, but it IS interesting - at least to me.

I worked for IBM in Japan for six years (out of a total of 31 with the company) - the first few in marketing storage for the Asia Pacific region. You know the drill - 1 day in Jakarta, 2 days in Sydney, a day in Kuala Lumpur, etc etc etc. Then thanks to 20 hours a week in language school I got to where I could speak Japanese well enough that I started negotiating alliances between IBM and the Japanese computer companies. Came back to the US after 6 years married and with a Great Dane puppy, worked for IBM a couple of more years on alliances, then retired and wound up consulting for one of our Japanese partner companies. And 18 years later I'm still doing it. Basically still doing the same alliance work, joint product development, manufacturing, research, etc. all in the storage business. I think of myself as the interface between two mating elephants, so to speak. Sometimes messy, but always exciting.

[C_Remington]

Off topic of course, but it IS interesting - at least to me.

I worked for IBM in Japan for six years (out of a total of 31 with the company) - the first few in marketing storage for the Asia Pacific region. You know the drill - 1 day in Jakarta, 2 days in Sydney, a day in Kuala Lumpur, etc etc etc. Then thanks to 20 hours a week in language school I got to where I could speak Japanese well enough that I started negotiating alliances between IBM and the Japanese computer companies. Came back to the US after 6 years married and with a Great Dane puppy, worked for IBM a couple of more years on alliances, then retired and wound up consulting for one of our Japanese partner companies. And 18 years later I'm still doing it. Basically still doing the same alliance work, joint product development, manufacturing, research, etc. all in the storage business. I think of myself as the interface between two mating elephants, so to speak. Sometimes messy, but always exciting.

Wow. I really enjoy hearing about people's career paths. No two are the same. PS, we love Great Dane's!

[Jim Andrada]

Yeah, when we got married my wife wanted aa puppy for our 2nd floor downtown apartment - so we got a Dane. Lovely dog - great apartment pet in spite of the size. We brought him back to the US, but he died a couple of years later at the age of 4. Next one was a tiny puppy but wound up 4 1/2 feet tall and 225 pounds. Sweetest animal we ever had. Then a couple of years later we got his niece, a diminutive 190 pounder. Total over 400 pounds of dog. They used to get under the table and fart - talk about tear gas! You could have probably developed film in it.

Speaking of which, I did indeed shoot three rolls today and I think I'm going to go mix up some chemistry and process it.

[Jim Andrada]

OK - progress to report. I got the two rolls of CMS 20 developed tonight and the second roll is drying right now. I'll do the Acros in the morning - just running out of time. Negs look very nice to the naked eye.

Something to think about - it is an absolute BEAR trying to get the film onto my Nikor reels! It is very thin and flimsy - not at all like regular film. As soon as I peeled it off the paper in the changing tent I knew I wax in for a struggle. It is nowhere near stiff enough to push into the clip in the hub of the reel. I think it took me over an hour to get both rolls correctly loaded into the reels. If I were to use the Nikor reels again I would tape the film to the hub rather than fool with the clip.

Next time I will definitely use the Jobo reels - I think it will "walk" into the real fairly easily. Would have done it tonight but I need a plug for the tank as they are clear that it shouldn't be developed on a rotary processor. I suspect the continuous agitation will goose the contrast a lot.

I "pulled" the second roll and to the eye it looks a bit less contrasty but I won't really know until I scan the negs. Should have first pass scans up tomorrow night. I've also been talking with Lenny Eiger about having him do a drum scan for a comparison of the CMS and Acros but I'll make a first pass scan on the Epson for atarters.

Edit - just tried loading the dried roll onto a Jobo reel and it works very easily. BUT you have to be super gentle with it to avoid problems

[C_Remington]

Are u using adotech?

[Jim Andrada]

Yes, - I got the Adotech 2 that's recommended. They tell you to use 16.5ml the first time, then add back 16.5ml of water to keep the developer "fresh" for the next batch. Only problem I had was that the neck of the bottle is so small that my 25ml pipette wouldn't fit through it so I took two passes with a 10ml pipette (10ml and 6.5ml)

They suggest mixing up 500ml and using it twice with a 10% longer developing time the second time around

[Jim Andrada]

OK- here are some results. Feel free to download the scans. They're around 2400 l

All were shot within a few minutes. Exposure was varied with shutter speed only, ie constant aperture

Mamiya RB67 Pro SD w 140mm Macro lens.

Acros Developed in HC110

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/17745879/Barrel%201%20Acros%20.tif

Adox CMS 20 II @ ISO 6 & 15% less development time Adotech II

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/17745879/Barrel%201%20ISO%206.tif

Adox CMS 20 II @ ISO 12 Adotech II normal development.

All scans on an Epson 750 @3200, wet mounted.

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/17745879/Barrel%201%20ISO%2012.tif

[RawheaD]

I think I like the ISO12 normal dev. image the best. Good contrast, structure and deep blacks and fine grain for sure.

[Jim Andrada]

Yeah, fine grain it is! I think The lens resolves a lot of detail. I'm pretty sure the weak link is in the scanner. I scanned at 3200 but there's a lot of evidence that the Epson peaks out at 2000 - 2400. Some people clain better results scanning a little higher and down-rezing in Photoshop.

I'm going to get 8k drum scans of one Acros and one CMS neg - I might use the jumping cholla or maybe this barrel cactus shot, By the way if you look at the "fruity" area on the top of the chubby cactus and look carefully in the lower left quadrant at 200% you can see a little insect on one of the fruits. - from the scale of the enlargement the insect might have been 1/8 to 1/4 inch long

[RawheaD]

By the way if you look at the "fruity" area on the top of the chubby cactus and look carefully in the lower left quadrant at 200% you can see a little insect on one of the fruits. - from the scale of the enlargement the insect might have been 1/8 to 1/4 inch long

I see it. Impressive details

[Jim Andrada]

A couple of more scans of the CMS 20 II rated at ISO 12

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/17745879/Javier%202.tif

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/17745879/Jumping%20Cholla.tif

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/17745879/Prickly%20Pear%201A.tif

By the way - no real point in putting these on Flikr etc because unless you download the whole file you won't be able to see the insane level of detail

Now I have to pick the one I'll send to Lenny for drum scanning - wanna vote??? One scan of Acros, and one of CMS 20 II

[Joel Truckenbrod]

Very interesting test. Thanks for doing this, Jim.

The results are pretty close to what I expected - a very high contrast film that's virtually grainless. While I'm sure the resolution is potentially much higher than Acros, this scan is obviously not revealing it here - the detail captured with the Epson is actually very close, despite the high contrast and lack of grain in the CMS scans. The iso 6 exposure/development strikes me as significantly better in terms of both usable shadow and highlight detail. Regardless, the bright, contrasty light that you photographed in is obviously not ideal for the film - a bit of a torture test if you will. Though there is solid amount of shadow detail in the iso 6 scan that's available with a bit of curves work - more than the Acros scan actually; that may purely be a product of the exposure used with the Acros image (I suspect it is).

I've thought CMS could be a good solution for scenes where a great deal of tonal compression is desirable. It probably would do pretty well in cases where the tonal scale of Fuji Velvia would have done well - flat, low contrast scenes. I have 10 rolls of 120 showing up in the next couple days for testing. If I like it, it may find it's way in to my bag to be used with a 4x5 reducing back.

[C_Remington]

Jim, do you print in the darkroom? How large a print do you think you can reasonably print with these negatives??

[Jim Andrada]

I used to print in the darkroom, but not anymore. Probably because I don't have a darkroom anymore.

I'm sure the Epson can't really show the differences so I'm planning to get a drum scan done of the Acros and the CMS 20

[Filmnut]

I tried all the images, but could not open any of them!
Keith

[C_Remington]

I tried all the images, but could not open any of them!
Keith

It takes a long time. Best to save them to your desktop and open.