Lenses "in barrel" - how do you typically use these?

[Oren Grad]

If it is usable. Two limitations. First, the lens has to be mounted on the board so that it won't protrude so far behind the board that it interferes with the shutter.

This can be handled by putting the shutter in an intermediate standard. The front standard with rear-protruding barrel lens can be positioned so that the rear of the lens just clears the shutter, then all focusing and movements are done with the rear standard so as not to disturb this alignment. A bag bellows between the intermediate and front standards will allow sufficiently close positioning. A bit Rube Goldberg-ish and not appropriate for all situations, but it's an option worth keeping in mind.

[Cletus]

I've been reading through all the comments here re: the 'barrel lens solution' and I really appreciate hearing from all of you for the diverse ways you've handled this common problem. And thank you, too, Mr. Fromm, for you input. You are not on my ignore list, nor anyone. I don't know about you, but I'd always rather get my hatchets quickly into the ground, so's not to present an impediment to hearing other's views on stuff like this. Clearly you are as well rounded as anyone on this subject and between you, Rick Denny and several others, I think I can petty clearly see the way forward with this now.

It looks like for me it will mean staying out of the LF classifieds for awhile (to staunch the $$$ hemorraging) and acquiring a proper Sinar shutter. I've briefly looked at these before and I guess it hadn't occurred to me that these would be useful for anything other than those DB mounted lenses. Sounds more like the Sinar shutter is the big solution for any shutter-less lens with the proper diameter rear element (lest I accept the limit to my maximum aperture - if the lens is larger than the shutter opening?) I sent a message to SKG asking about mounting some of the longer Ronars in Copal and their answer was, you typically can't mount them in any shutter. At least not easily.

- Would anyone recommend the 480/9 (or 450/9?) Ronar, which are often already mounted in C3 shutters, as a good alternative to the 450 Fujinon C? Off topic, I know, but looks like an interesting lens that can be found already shuttered.

And so now I understand what these fairly large "iris clamps" are for as well. I admit, I thought they were some kind of outboard f-stop/aperture diaphragm device for some huge, antique lens! Sounds more like a way to have a universal lensboard of sorts, to mount all those odd sized Petzvals and other old lenses without needing an expensive, individual custom mounting job for each one.

Oh, and I also like Oren Grad's suggestion of using an intermediate standard and bag bellows to support a Packard or Luc(?) shutter assembly. Since I seem to own some of these intermediate components, could be a viable, lower cost way of doing this. Thanks Oren.

[Merg Ross]

From an earlier thread (2008), my adaptation of the Luc Shutter is attached.

http://www.largeformatphotography.in...er-Alternative

[Dan Fromm]

Apo Ronars are very competitive with all other apo process lenses, including the Fuji C. If you look at the Department of asleep at the switch thread in the lounge, you'll find references to recent sales of ARs in shutter at surprisingly low prices. Finding one at a good price will take patience, looking on ebay.de as well as on ebay.com, and some losing bids. They're going for a lot less than they used to.

If you follow Oren's advice, make sure to set the camera up with the shutter as close as possible to the back of the lens. Otherwise you'll risk vignetting problems. The longest focal length that can be used on my little tandem Graphic (two Graphics on a rail, with a coupler between them) is limited by the rear camera's front standard's lens throat. This is the same problem.

Re Oren's advice, putting anything but a Sinar shutter [If I've got it right, could be the other 'way round but that changes nothing. Its made to attach to a Sinar standard, accepts a Sinar bellows behind it] will require adapters for attaching at both ends.

I wasn't clear. What's limiting isn't the lens barrel's OD, it is the diameter of the lens' exit pupil. The barrel's OD is typically much larger.

[Cletus]

Dan - I know this question is probably getting a little far into the nitty-gritty, but how does one determine the size / diameter of the exit pupil of the lens? Would that just be the same as the rearmost element diameter? Doesn't the "light rays" go through mostly the central part of the lens itself, or am I way off on this? (I'm certainly way off in my terminology!)

I'm trying to figure out, if I fianlly manage to identify my 'target lens', which is probably a ~600 APO Ronar or similar, what dimension of the lens would I need to look at to determine the minimum size of the shutter opening? Oh, and I do understand about locating the shutter ACAP to the rear of the lens to avoid vignette. Appreciate the heads-up on that.

[Ken Lee]

Sinars are cheap these days. Purchasing a Sinar Shutter, you'll save money that would otherwise go to (redundant) shutters and their installation.

The Sinar Shutter operates a bit like a modern SLR camera: you can squeeze the cable release to determine depth of field as you stop down the lens. You also get to operate the camera from the rear, where the film is, etc.

The Sinar Shutter has precisely timed exposures from 1/60 to 8 seconds. Whoever invented it, did a great job. I have several of my shutter-mounted lenses adapted to Sinar db boards, so I can use them that way.

Here is a gallery of photos made with a 210mm Macro Sinaron mounted on a Sinar Shutter: some indoors, others outdoors.

[William Whitaker]

...how does one determine the size / diameter of the exit pupil of the lens? Would that just be the same as the rearmost element diameter?

Look through the lens from the rear with the aperture wide open. The diameter of the illuminated area is (or is very close to) the exit pupil diameter. It helps to point the lens toward an evenly illuminated surface.

[Cletus]

Ken - yeah, that's a pretty compelling argument for the Sinar shutter! I'm bettin' there's no shutter - or lens - out there that'd let me make pictures like that, though. Now I'm just a little jealous.

[Cletus]

Will, I'm looking at - through- a lens right now and I see exactly what your talking about. Thank you for clarifying that!

[Armin Seeholzer]

There is not any doubt about it for a Sinar its a Sinar shutter, and I'm living in Sinar land
The name Sinar comes from:
S: Studio
I: Industry
N: Nature
A: Architecture
R: Reproduction

The cameras was made from a professional photographer for them and the whole thing with Swiss accuracy and business cleverness!
But since the digital revolution they lost a bit the focus and did similar mistakes like Kodak!

Cheers Armin