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Thread: Novice 4x5 question

  1. #1

    Novice 4x5 question

    I would love to hear any and all opinions on the following:

    I work in the department that does photography for the company. Our photography is used for CD-ROM, Internet, Print Media (brochures) and wall graphics. I assist my manager who does the majority of the shooting.

    We use a Cambo 4x5 camera for most photo shoots where we know the end use is a brochure or wall graphic. We also have a digital FUGIFILM FinePix S2 pro that we hoped would give us similar quality to our 4x5 shots – It hasn’t. What I would like to know is:

    1. Are there any digital alternatives that anyone has had success with to our 4x5 camera that will give us comparable results? If so -- examples.

    2. Our subjects are things like sterilizers (which are large metal boxes), surgical lights, operating tables etc. Is there a type of camera that is specifically good at shooting stainless steel and detailed machinery type shots?

    3. Is 4x5 photography a dying art?

    4. Does anyone know of any good resources on 4x5 photography? Websites, Books etc.

    You can probably tell I am no expert. On photography, that is true. I am the poor sod who spends hours scanning, touching up in Photoshop, loading and unloading film etc. There has to be a better way!

    Any responses are greatly appreciated.

    Regards,

    Greg

  2. #2
    matthew blais's Avatar
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    Novice 4x5 question

    Greg, I use a Fuji S2 for most my brochure and design work which I think is just fine (Full page magazine ads, annual reports and rack cards, etc.). I've seen large (30 x 48 inch) promo posters from Kodak taken with their pro 14N digital which are quite sharp, and that can now be purchased for under $4k. Check out their website to download some high res samples. A higher end digital may be what you're looking for, but a 4x5 tranny is hard to beat.

    As far as machinery and metal objects, most highly reflective objetcs are difficult to shoot no matter what camera, as lighting is so critical.

    This site is an excellent resource, but I'm sure others can steer you to other sources, as I'm a 4x5 novice as well.

    Happy scanning!
    "I invent nothing, I rediscover"
    August Rodin

    My Now old Photo Site

  3. #3

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    Novice 4x5 question

    Here are some resources

    Using the View Camera that I wrote

    User's Guide to the View Camera by Jim Stone

    either/both books should be available from Amazon.com

    View Camera magazine www.viewcamera.com

    www.betterlight.com a high end scanning back for the 4x5 camera

    The large format photo conference April 23-25, 2004 in Monterey, CA - Better Light will be an exhibitor

    steve simmons

  4. #4

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    Novice 4x5 question

    1. Your digital SLR is one of the higher quality digital cameras, and you are unlikely to do much better. Whether it will deliver equivalent results in terms of image resolution as your 4 x 5, after scanning, would depend on the quality of your film scanner. A high quality drum scanner or Imacon would provide you with more detail, but also with enormous files that might be hard to process. If you rely on camera movements with your 4 x 5, then your digital SLR of course won't be able to do that.

    2. My guess is that with sufficient resolution, that might be more a matter of proper lighting than the camera you use.

    3. NO!

    4. The website where you found this forum: www.largeformatphotography.com. The standard reference is Stroebel's View Camera Technique. Steve Simmons's Using the View Camera is a good source for beginners. Also, View Camera Magazine often contains interesting articles.

  5. #5

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    Novice 4x5 question

    Assuming that you want your sterilizer pictures to look like the boxes they are, a digital camera won't do the job. To keep the vertical lines straight up and down you need the movements you have in your Cambo. A digital back for a view camera would work, but they are very expensive and I don't think they yet have enough advantages over film to justify the expense unless very high continuous use is expected.

  6. #6
    Moderator Ralph Barker's Avatar
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    Novice 4x5 question

    Leonard pretty much "nailed" it, but let me add a couple of thoughts.

    There are digital solutions for view camera photography, but they are still rather expensive. The Sinar digital, for example, produces excellent work, but the sensor is more medium-format size than LF. Proper studio use of the Sinar also requires that it be tethered to a fairly high-end desktop computer. There are also several digital backs that can be used with conventional view cameras, but generally in the same manner as the Sinar. Remember, a 4,000 DPI drum scan of a 4x5 is about 320 megapixels. So, it should be no surprize that a 12 megapixel camera might not produce the same detail. ;-)

    The biggest issue with digital, I think, is the relatively limited dynamic range - it's very easy to blow out highlights with digital, particularly spectral highlights from subject matter such as that you're working with. Keeping the lighting within 3 1/2 to 4 stops is essential. But, that's the case with work destined to be printed anyway, so it's more a matter of watching the highlights with digital rather than the shadows, as one would do with film.

  7. #7

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    Novice 4x5 question

    With respect to resources for large format photography, I'll echo Leonard in recommending Leslie Stroebel's book as the definitive resource. It isn't the most exciting book to read and certainly not something you'd casually read in one sitting but it's an extremely useful learning tool and also a valuable reference. I've been involved with large format photography for about ten years and I still occasionally check out something in that book. Other good resources include Ansel Adams' book "The Camera," Harvey Shaman's book "The View Camera," the Kodak publication "Book of Large Format Photography," and Jack Dykinga's book "Large Format Nature Photography."

    I own these and have owned others in the past that I've since sold. The problem with buying anything other than Stroebel's book and possibly Adams' is that they are good at teaching you the basic techniques but not very useful after that. So rather than spending $30 or $40 on any book other than Stroebel and maybe Adams I'd suggest seeing what large format books you can check out of the library, read them, practice the techniques, then return them to the library. But Stroebel and maybe Adams you want to keep on your shelf for a long time so they're well worth buying IMHO.
    Brian Ellis
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    a mile away and you'll have their shoes.

  8. #8

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    Novice 4x5 question

    There is one more online forum that deals exclusively with large format photography - appropriately named f32: www.f32.net. The members of that forum have a wealth of knowledge and will certainly be able to help you out - also for future questions you might have.

    I do agree with all the others who have already responded that you will not get the same results with any non-LF camera (digital or not) because of the lack of movements. I guess it is back to the Cambo and scanning those slides:-)

    Juergen
    Juergen

  9. #9

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    Novice 4x5 question

    So rather than spending $30 or $40 on any book other than Stroebel

    this was from Brian Ellis

    >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

    Correction

    Using the View Camera costs only 20-25.00. Whether or not spending 2+ hours going to and from the library to borrow and return this book it might be more efficient to buy it for your library. It is a personal call but I wanted to correct the inaccurate info posted about the cost of alternatives to Stroebel's book.

    steve simmons

  10. #10

    Novice 4x5 question

    Assuming you've spent the time and effort to light your product shots so that they're a shining, glimmering sight to behold, why don't you try a digital scanning back in your existing 4x5? I think for static product shots a Better Light Scanning Back will give you results beyond what 4x5 film is capable of yielding.

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