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Thread: Ebay extends refund period for buyers

  1. #21

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    Re: Ebay extends refund period for buyers

    My problem, or "the big deal" is that Ebay is forcing their policies to more and more encourage, solicit, expect people to return, complain, hold funds, etc.

    No, it's not happened to me much at all in 14 years of selling on Ebay. What I don't want is for the likelihood to increase.

    Yes, I would and do return anything for any reason. In my auctions I say, "your satisfaction is my goal, contact me if you have concerns or want to discuss a full refund." I've just seen a lot of good sellers, people I have bought from, suddenly get slammed with a bad feedback after years of 100% good. Does a poor feedback score affect future sales? Is paying shipping for a confused or clueless buyer part of business? Yes and yes. But Ebay is making sellers bend over backwards. A 14 day inspection for a 100 year old, used antique? The above post about expecting the ability do a return anywhere you buy, like at Walmart, doesn't apply. Walmart doesn't sell antique, used items. Goodwill does, and you get no returns there - walk out the door with it and it's yours.

    CASE STUDY: I bought some mint looking wooden plate holders on ebay recently. The seller knew nothing, but had good pictures and was nice and responsive. I bought them, they arrived, I took a look and set them aside. They looked great, for 100 year old holders. A couple weeks later I picked one up by grabbing the center, and the darkslide cracked. Actually it broke into 5 pieces like eggshell. I chalked it up to "oh well, I better be more careful with the others." Another buyer might whine and complain and try to get a refund. See my point about Ebay making it too easy for buyers to get new manufacturing expectations out of used antiques?

  2. #22

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    Re: Ebay extends refund period for buyers

    ' i bet i could have "forced" him to pay the shipping.....but:'


    ....You don't have that option, you have to eat the shipping one way no matter what.



    'Does the seller still have the option of a return with full refund or will eBay just do the partial as they see fit?'


    As I have read it you have no option other than grab your ankles or rest your palms on your knees. Ebay allows the buyer to return anything for just about any reason that can come under the heading 'not as described'. In addition its at bay's discretion whether to allow a repair to be charged back to your account as well.




    I got into it with one of the paypal phone reps a couple of years ago and they told me that ebay were trying to make a 'buying experience' like any other and a payment/return like a 'credit card experience' where you can return anything for any reason. Thats OK if 'you' are the seller who sells brand new- from-the-manufacturer items by the container-load but to hammer a seller who sells almost unique items sometimes over 100 years old? The day you see Walmart/Target selling 12" Goerz Dagors, Deardorffs and 8x10 film then we know we've reached parity.(oops, just read the above post and somewhat repeated).

  3. #23

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    Re: Ebay extends refund period for buyers

    I still maintain that there should be a return policy on ebay even for 100 year old antiques. The difference between a Goodwill item and an ebay item is a buyer can look over an item at the goodwill. On so with ebay, no matter how good the pictures were, things are not always apparent until close inspection can be done. If a buyer buys something on ebay and the item is delivered while the buyer is unable to immediately look it over, the buyer needs time.

    My case study; I buy an antique Korona 5x7 a few weeks ago. When it arrives I find it is in-fact a 4x5 camera, and worse it's missing several parts. Without a return policy I would have had much more trouble than I did. Even after I returned the item my seller attempted to keep the money I paid for the item.

    I know my case falls under buyer protection, however a less extreme case may have fit into return category.

    Regardless of this case or that, ebay is for buyers. Sellers on ebay take all of the risk and ebay needs happy buyers. If buyers don't buy on ebay, sellers wont list. If sellers don't list, ebay fails and goes out of business. If ebay keeps buyers there will always be sellers.

    Again, I leave it at this; don't like it, don't use it. Its a free market.

  4. #24

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    Re: Ebay extends refund period for buyers

    If we are going to compare apples to apples then we can have a look at another online site like Goodwill. I don't know too many folk that regularly cruise by camera stores to see what they have and can handle in person, we all buy online so we really can't compare the two. Here is Goodwill Online's return policy....


    Each shopgoodwill.com seller is an autonomous Goodwill member organization. Seller return/refund policies may vary from seller-to-seller.

    The seller's return policy is posted on each individual item's description page. By placing a bid, you are acknowledging the seller's return policy.

  5. #25

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    Re: Ebay extends refund period for buyers

    Quote Originally Posted by CP Goerz View Post
    If we are going to compare apples to apples then we can have a look at another online site like Goodwill. I don't know too many folk that regularly cruise by camera stores to see what they have and can handle in person, we all buy online so we really can't compare the two. Here is Goodwill Online's return policy....


    Each shopgoodwill.com seller is an autonomous Goodwill member organization. Seller return/refund policies may vary from seller-to-seller.

    The seller's return policy is posted on each individual item's description page. By placing a bid, you are acknowledging the seller's return policy.

    I used to frequent the Goodwill site a lot...pretty sure most of them don't take returns and specifically state that it's untested and sold as-is. I've gotten a couple of good deals there, but the crazy thing is most camera gear seems to sell for more than what it would on ebay...it's really weird. Maybe people are convinced that since it's Goodwill, it HAS to be a deal? I don't know. I do know that about 8 years ago I found an old beat up leather case at the local Goodwill for $4.99...hiding inside was a very clean Leica M3 . It's all right...you guys can hate me. I've actually hardly used it because Leicas are kind of a pain to load and I hardly ever shoot 35mm. Nice camera though.
    Back to ebay...as of right now, you can offer a "no return" policy, in which case you don't have to take it back. You can also list an item as for "parts or repair", in which case they can't return if it doesn't work IIRC...don't know if they can say it was "not as described". As I understand it, the downside to having a no return policy is that it affects how it shows up in searches...priority is given to sellers with the most generous return policy. If you're the only one selling something, it may not matter much if at all I suppose. Calling something parts or repair will scare off everyone but the die hard DIY types, or people willing to take a chance.
    On a positive note, today ebay said they would remove the one negative feedback I've had in the past 10 years...a guy in Russia bought a lens from me, I shipped it out, and then it disappeared. Paypal gave him his money back, then he left a negative feedback for me. I'm still out the money and the lens, but at least his negative feedback will disappear. It was $50...these things happen periodically, and I just chock them up to the cost of doing business. I had a rash of returns last year too (I think it was just buyers remorse). Everything sold again to people who were happy to have it (I think I listed them for more money just to help cover it if I remember correctly...)

  6. #26

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    Re: Ebay extends refund period for buyers

    Once eBay's draconian mandatory 14 day return and forced partial refund are widely known by unscrupulous buyers many will definitely abuse those. Some will exchange worn or broken parts and demand a return. Others will enjoy 2 week "free rentals". Still others will buy something just try so they can decide if they really want it... no loss to them so why not?

    If I have the option of a return with full refund vs. a forced partial refund then fine. I'd offer that anyway. But the 14 day inspection period is over the top. I'm perfectly fine with, and would offer, 5 days to give the buyer a chance to inspect, test shoot, and have film processed.

  7. #27

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    Re: Ebay extends refund period for buyers

    '...as of right now, you can offer a "no return" policy, in which case you don't have to take it back.'

    Trust me on this(having fought ebay about it numerous times)...there is NO such thing as 'no return'..period. All a buyer has to say is 'not as described' and they are off to the races returning the item for a full refund and shipping for good measure. Are there bad sellers who lie...of course, are there good sellers who get ripped, you bet.


    The new sting in the tail is that Ebay will decide(who knows how) how much you as a seller now have to pay for the repair of the item sold to the buyer who happens to know a guy at a camera repair place willing to make a fake invoice up.



    100% agree on the sold prices on Goodwill, what are those folks thinking??? I haven't scored in a Goodwill in ten years of looking! When did you buy the camera, was it before they went online?

  8. #28

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    Re: Ebay extends refund period for buyers

    Quote Originally Posted by goamules View Post
    No, it's not happened to me much at all in 14 years of selling on Ebay. What I don't want is for the likelihood to increase.
    95 percent of what you worry about you have no control over, and can not change. this is with everything in life. worry about it when/if it happens.

    again. it is NO BIG DEAL. you get your shit back they get their money.

    i still do not see the issue here.

    Quote Originally Posted by CP Goerz View Post

    I got into it with one of the paypal phone reps a couple of years ago .
    lets stick with apple and apples. what e bays said several years ago is outdated and useless info. lets talk about what they do NOW.

    Quote Originally Posted by CP Goerz View Post
    ....You don't have that option, you have to eat the shipping one way no matter what.

    as i said above....ebay did not force me to refund the shipping...so it was no big deal. i am not mad or overly upset about the whole issue.......AND it ACTUALLY happened to me....unlike most of this thread about theoretical possibilities!
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  9. #29

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    Re: Ebay extends refund period for buyers

    Quote Originally Posted by CP Goerz View Post
    '...as of right now, you can offer a "no return" policy, in which case you don't have to take it back.'

    Trust me on this(having fought ebay about it numerous times)...there is NO such thing as 'no return'..period. All a buyer has to say is 'not as described' and they are off to the races returning the item for a full refund and shipping for good measure. Are there bad sellers who lie...of course, are there good sellers who get ripped, you bet.


    The new sting in the tail is that Ebay will decide(who knows how) how much you as a seller now have to pay for the repair of the item sold to the buyer who happens to know a guy at a camera repair place willing to make a fake invoice up.



    100% agree on the sold prices on Goodwill, what are those folks thinking??? I haven't scored in a Goodwill in ten years of looking! When did you buy the camera, was it before they went online?
    I'll take your word for it...I searched ebay help before, and they said it's up to you to decide if you want to do returns or not. If they open a paypal case for "not as described", there's probably nothing you can do... And there are going to be people who abuse it, no doubt. My own experience has been that most buyers are honest people who are just looking for whatever. I've sold a ton of stuff there...occasionally something goes haywire because someone has to be the turd in the punchbowl, but for the most part people are honest. I guess it's a reflection of what people are like in the rest of society...most are good most of the time, some are bad some of the time.
    On Goodwill, I've had a few good deals there, but the Leica was before they went online. These days it would probably end up there and sell for $3000 or something silly. It's probably actually worth somewhere around $800...it's a DS made in 1957 with a 50mm Summerit on it. The vast majority of deals I've gotten there were things like my Bamboo Steamer that was a dollar...love it! Don't love the way it makes the whole neighborhood smell like broccoli though...

  10. #30

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    Re: Ebay extends refund period for buyers

    'lets stick with apple and apples. what e bays said several years ago is outdated and useless info. lets talk about what they do NOW.'


    What they did then is what they do now...have you seen a change in policy I'm unaware of?




    'ebay did not force me to refund the shipping.'


    But they can, will and have done. Clearly the situation you had was where you and the buyer came to an agreement, ebay wasn't involved. If you disagreed with the buyer and didn't offer the refund what would have happened? I'll tell you so you know for the future...buyer is unhappy with item/opens case with ebay, ebay suggests you refund the buyer, buyer escalates case, paypal puts the funds on hold, two weeks pass and the buyer returns the item and has tracking to prove you got it, refund given.


    Where was your 'choice' in there?



    I regularly hand out refunds, I don't like it, especially since a number of buyers clearly didn't understand what they were buying but that is just the way it is. The only 'theoretical' I have brought up is the 'repair' issue which isn't widely known or practiced at this point but you can bet that ebay WILL tell buyers that this is another option for them. Besides that the return issue is one I HAVE dealt with numerous times so on that I can speak with experience and not just theoretically.
    Last edited by CP Goerz; 18-May-2012 at 10:41. Reason: bad grammar as always :-)

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