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Thread: Purple Sky and Green Ground ~ Portra 400 and Epson 700 workflow

  1. #11

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    Re: Purple Sky and Green Ground ~ Portra 400 and Epson 700 workflow

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter York View Post
    Is C-41 amenable to profiling with an iT8 target? I thought this process only worked with E-6 films.
    C-41 (or any color negative film) and E-6 (or any slide film) use the same lens and same data to produce the image. The software will invert that image from a negative, but the premise is the same. Get your spectrum of colors to match the correct spectrum of colors and you'll have the correct spectrum of colors. If your color spectrum is correct, then you invert, you'll have correct spectrum for the inverted colors.

  2. #12

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    Re: Purple Sky and Green Ground ~ Portra 400 and Epson 700 workflow

    I've had a lot of sucess by scanning the neg as a raw DNG without any adjustments from the scanner at all. Then I open the scan in CS4 invert, select curves, select white black and grey points and normally I'm pretty much there. There's lot's about this method online.

  3. #13

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    Re: Purple Sky and Green Ground ~ Portra 400 and Epson 700 workflow

    I have not been able to find a defiitive answer on this, but I have read that color negative is, at best, a PIA to profile. All explanations seem to point to the characteristics of the orange mask - i.e., that it is not constant due to the scene shot, variances in development, or other factors.

    If anyone has a deeper understanding of this, please chime in.

    At the beginning of each photo session, if you photograph an iT8 target with color negative, then you can profile the film for each session, but not across all sessions.

    It may be the case that a general profile will get Frank in the ballpark.
    Peter Y.

  4. #14

    Re: Purple Sky and Green Ground ~ Portra 400 and Epson 700 workflow

    I've found one of the main issues in scanning color negatives is getting enough exposure on the film.
    Color neg goes funky when it does not get enough light.

    There is no profiling of a scanner for color negative film.
    The standard Epson software should work just fine for color negatives.
    Fiddle around with setting good grey/neutral points using the eye dropper.

    I used to think of color negative as an "interpretive" material - you make it look like what you want it to look like.

  5. #15

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    Re: Purple Sky and Green Ground ~ Portra 400 and Epson 700 workflow

    I'm with Henry - you have to make a choice with C41 on colour. This can either be viewed as a PITA or as a great creative tool. Quick and dirty - use PS to choose the white and black points - that get's me 90% of the way. The other 10 % is down to selective colour balance changes - as usual there are a number of ways in PS to do the same thing, and I'm sure Frank knows his way around this.
    I've had zero success profiling film as changing light seems to change colour balance so much that unless you shoot a test target for each scene it's pretty much pointless. I also find you have to get creative with contrast curves as C41 tends to come out flat on scans for obvious reasons.
    It's a bit fiddly, but the latitude and ease of processing and ease of scanning make it worth it.

  6. #16

    Re: Purple Sky and Green Ground ~ Portra 400 and Epson 700 workflow

    To clarify, I refer above to using the eyedropper tools in the Epson software for setting grey or neutral at the scanning stage.
    You'll have to futz with it a bit, but before too long you'll get a feel for it.

    As David mentions above, changing light conditions make it impossible to come up with a fixed setting. You are dealing with both the various color layers of the emulsion and how they react to varying intensities and color of light - AND- the relationship between the orange mask and those color layers. Different processing regimes change this relationship as well. Mix all that up and you need a human in charge to make it work. Once you "get it" you'll never want to go back to transparencies.

  7. #17

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    Re: Purple Sky and Green Ground ~ Portra 400 and Epson 700 workflow

    Well that is the way I've been scanning color neg since the 90s with a LeafScan 45. I am wondering if this cross-curve is built into the film itself?

  8. #18

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    Re: Purple Sky and Green Ground ~ Portra 400 and Epson 700 workflow

    1) try color perfect. Here's a tutorial that shows Vuescan at the beginning but the rest is ColorPerfect. http://benneh.net/blog/2010/09/25/vu...uide/?goal=yes This is by an 8x10 and 4x5 shooter with an Epson V700.
    Color Perfect's plugin page http://www.c-f-systems.com/Plug-ins.html (click the Download for PC or Mac about a third of the way down the page)
    Links to tutorials on settings for other software http://www.c-f-systems.com/Scanners.html

    2) when I say that I profile my scanner I'm talking about the scanner itself, not the film. I never bother profiling the film, there's no real point as has been pointed out by a few here. But if your scanner's colors are off won't that throw the rest of the process off? If it's spot on won't that help (within the confines of the d-max of the scanner)? I scan with a Nikon LS-2000, Canon FS4000US, and an HP Scanjet G4050. While you can tell a slight difference between the three it's not like one jumps out as the worst of them all colorwise (sharpness is a different story). You couldn't say that before I profiled the scanners. With the HP it was heroics indeed for every single shot.

  9. #19

    Re: Purple Sky and Green Ground ~ Portra 400 and Epson 700 workflow

    I use Colorperfect, seems to help a lot for accuracy and especially repeatability.
    I have found the phenomenon you describe often occurs for example in bright sunlight, closeish to midday, and when the negative is a bit overexposed...
    Just my findings.

  10. #20

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    Jun 2002
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    Re: Purple Sky and Green Ground ~ Portra 400 and Epson 700 workflow

    Yeah exactly, I do shoot in "bad" and extreme light sometimes and this was mid-afternoon in the Utah desert.

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