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Thread: Uh, ok I know this goes against everything but . . .

  1. #11
    Roger Cole's Avatar
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    Re: Uh, ok I know this goes against everything but . . .

    The suggestion you got on APUG to try Fomapan 400 in Rodinal might be worthwhile. I've shot a few sheets of Foma 400 in 4x5. Tonality looks good, and grain is still invisible at 11x14, but if you developed it in Rodinal or, maybe better yet, Dektol or other print developer, you might get some visible grain. You'd certainly get more than with Tri-X in X-tol. For that matter, Tri-X in HC-110 will give you noticeably more grain than in Xtol, noticeable with a grain magnifier anyway, probably not in a 16x20 print from 5x7.

    You could also just use a shorter lens and crop a lot when you print!
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  2. #12
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    Re: Uh, ok I know this goes against everything but . . .

    try processing your film in caffenol c .. don't measure,
    it is about 1/4 ( or 1/8 if your jar is small ) of cheap instant coffee
    a baby food container ( 3oz? ) of washing soda +/- and 2/3 that much powdered vit c. ( 2oz ? )
    add in a couple splashes of ansco 130 if you have it, stock ... dektol is similar so it might work to .. straight/stock.

    stand develop your film for about 25-30mins.
    your film will print beautifully and scan beautifully
    and you will have nice grain ...

  3. #13

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    Re: Uh, ok I know this goes against everything but . . .

    I always loved Tri-X in Rodinal when I shot 35mm and wanted a grainy look. The grain is very well-defined and sharp. It's a nice look with larger formats since the grain will add texture without getting out of control.

    It's also a really easy developer to deal with, so I'd definitely suggest giving it a try with Tri-X or HP5.

  4. #14

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    Re: Uh, ok I know this goes against everything but . . .

    Quote Originally Posted by Roger Cole View Post
    I was going to say - Lith printing.

    But that's a rather different effect and may be more "grain" than you want.

    In 5x7 it's not going to be easy and maybe not even possible to get visible grain in a 16x20 (from the negative, rather than by printing with lith or a texture screen or the like) with conventional materials.

    I'd just suggest shooting Delta 3200 in 120, with a roll film back on a 4x5 camera if you must use a view camera, but that may not be what you're looking for. But if I wanted more visible grain from a camera with movements, that's what I'd do, because I have the 4x5 and roll film back. If I didn't - shit or tilt/shift lens on a 35mm and use Delta 3200 or TMZ and you should get all the grain you want.

    I understand liking the look. I like fairly grainy 35mm for some things, but for those images I shoot 35mm (and TMZ) and use the view camera when I want grainless appearance and smooth tonality.
    I agree that these grains are different than the grains found in film... But I found two really heavy grained images - Stine can controll the amount of grain a lot...

    :::::::

    Back in the days I heard about something called "russian grain"... apparently you could get big grain if adding a small amount of fix in the developer...... Actually never tried that mt self, but it might be worth a test...

    (I love grain too so I totally understand the OP's question)

  5. #15
    indecent exposure cosmicexplosion's Avatar
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    Re: Uh, ok I know this goes against everything but . . .

    Fast film is grainy. Just use the right format to get the true grit you want, not that I know much but it seems simPlest.

    I am totally interested in all those wired techniques of cofee and what not.
    We could almost use a thread on alt dev
    through a glass darkly...

  6. #16
    Forever Beardless Ari's Avatar
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    Re: Uh, ok I know this goes against everything but . . .

    Quote Originally Posted by cosmicexplosion View Post
    We could almost use a thread on alt dev
    No, not almost...that's a great idea.

  7. #17
    jp's Avatar
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    Re: Uh, ok I know this goes against everything but . . .

    Maybe it's a bit of texture you want rather than grain, in which case, an alt process print on textured paper would do. The ilford art mg300 sometimes appears to look like wet sandpaper too (very fine grained paper)

    Caffenol-C can bring pretty big grain too.... Check this 4x5 efke50 film scan and closeup:
    http://www.f64.nu/photo/tmp/lff/img194.jpg
    http://www.f64.nu/photo/tmp/lff/img194c.jpg
    Caffenol-C isn't suitable for 400 speed film, but there are variants that are made for it. Dektol would probably do something similar but with more contrast.

  8. #18
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    Re: Uh, ok I know this goes against everything but . . .

    Quote Originally Posted by jp498 View Post
    Maybe it's a bit of texture you want rather than grain, in which case, an alt process print on textured paper would do. The ilford art mg300 sometimes appears to look like wet sandpaper too (very fine grained paper)

    Caffenol-C can bring pretty big grain too.... Check this 4x5 efke50 film scan and closeup:
    http://www.f64.nu/photo/tmp/lff/img194.jpg
    http://www.f64.nu/photo/tmp/lff/img194c.jpg
    Caffenol-C isn't suitable for 400 speed film, but there are variants that are made for it. Dektol would probably do something similar but with more contrast.
    i use the same caffenol c developer for everything iso 25, 50, 100, 200, 400 and even 800 ...
    black/white and even color (c41 + e6 ) produces a b/w negative ...
    and as a paper developer paired with spent ( black) ansco 130 and a water bath...

  9. #19

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    Re: Uh, ok I know this goes against everything but . . .

    The O.P shoots 5x7 format. Cannot see the graphic grain effect he wants coming from Rodinal.
    If some use it for 35mm,it is not going to be perceptible on 5x7.
    Why not make a "distressed" negative and sandwich it for printing ?
    With the added advantage of ,reversability.

  10. #20

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    Re: Uh, ok I know this goes against everything but . . .

    I've never tried it with large format, but using chemicals that are of different temperature sure ups the grain on roll film negatives.
    I steal time at 1/125th of a second, so I don't consider my photography to be Fine Art as much as it is petty larceny.

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