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Thread: Goerz-Berlin never made "gold" lenses, did they?

  1. #1

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    Goerz-Berlin never made "gold" lenses, did they?

    This looks to me (eBay 220953604824) like somebody aftermarket anodized a gold rim, but I could be wrong ?!?
    They are ill discoverers that think there is no land, when they can see nothing but sea.
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  2. #2

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    Re: Goerz-Berlin never made "gold" lenses, did they?

    That's not a Goerz Berlin lens, it's a B&J remount. The clue is the "Series" should be "Serie".Also, if it was real, it would say "Doppel Anastigmat Dagor" or maybe just "Doppel Anastigmat", with this serial number.

    To answer your question, CPG Berlin never made a gold dot or gold rim lens.
    One man's Mede is another man's Persian.

  3. #3

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    Re: Goerz-Berlin never made "gold" lenses, did they?

    No, they didn't. Most were brass under the black paint, so most likely you're looking at a nice patina on brass.

    The seller should, and probably does know better.

    It would be a nice lens at about $200-250.

    Cheers, Steve

  4. #4
    loujon
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    Re: Goerz-Berlin never made "gold" lenses, did they?

    I'll be honest goes. I would NOT trust columbuscameragroup with much bought on their word.This is from personal experience with this used camera shop in Columbus Ohio.

    Not to be confused with the wonderful Dealings I have had with MPX Mid-West photo Exchange. They are tops.

  5. #5

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    Re: Goerz-Berlin never made "gold" lenses, did they?

    Quote Originally Posted by Louis Pacilla View Post
    I would NOT trust columbuscameragroup with much bought on their word. Not to be confused with the wonderful Dealings I have had with MPX Mid-West photo Exchange. They are tops.
    I agree on both counts. I just hadn't seen such a lens before; not that I was going to buy it at their price. I had totally forgotten about the B&J "Series" vs. "Serie", that explains a lot. Thanks all for your input!
    They are ill discoverers that think there is no land, when they can see nothing but sea.
    -Francis Bacon

  6. #6

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    Re: Goerz-Berlin never made "gold" lenses, did they?

    Quote Originally Posted by John Schneider View Post
    I agree on both counts. I just hadn't seen such a lens before; not that I was going to buy it at their price. I had totally forgotten about the B&J "Series" vs. "Serie", that explains a lot. Thanks all for your input!
    The hell of it is, those B&J remounts can be perfectly good lenses. They can also be crap, you have to check them out. I know of a 10 3/4" B&J Dagor that is just lovely.

    But I'd never buy one without testing it.
    One man's Mede is another man's Persian.

  7. #7
    Mark Sawyer's Avatar
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    Re: Goerz-Berlin never made "gold" lenses, did they?

    Quote Originally Posted by John Schneider View Post
    I just hadn't seen such a lens before; not that I was going to buy it at their price.
    But that makes it rare, and a "must have for your collection"!

    I'm not completely familiar with all the different incarnations of Goerz, so educate me if I'm wrong... The 130xxx seial number would indicate it's an early uncoated Dagor, but the gold rims/dotd were a marketing ploy for later coated Dagors in the 700xxx serial numbers and later. B&J may have coated it and polished the brass rim, though. But unscrupulouis buyers will sometimes polish the black finish off a front rim to have a "Gold Rim Dagor".

    Am I right is assuming the only difference between the Gold Rim/Dot Dagors and the non-Gold 700xxx+ Dagors is cosmetic?

    And my personal experience is that early Dagors are not as sharp in the corners as later Dagors, so even coated and mounted in a modern shutter, this one would probably not perform as well as a later version.
    "I love my Verito lens, but I always have to sharpen everything in Photoshop..."

  8. #8
    8x10, 5x7, 4x5, et al Leigh's Avatar
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    Re: Goerz-Berlin never made "gold" lenses, did they?

    Mark,

    Don't confuse the gold dot and gold rim Dagors.

    I have a Made-in-Switzerland Gold Dot Dagor with s/n 20024xx. The dot is engraved in the bezel, then filled with gold paint.
    The dot location, between the f/f6,8 and the serial number, indicate that it's factory-original, just like the Red-Dot Artars.


    It seems the "gold rim" version was just a marketing ploy by the US importer.

    - Leigh
    If you believe you can, or you believe you can't... you're right.

  9. #9

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    Re: Goerz-Berlin never made "gold" lenses, did they?

    Quote Originally Posted by Leigh View Post
    Mark,

    Don't confuse the gold rim and gold dot Dagors.

    I have a Made-in-Switzerland Gold Dot Dagor with s/n 20024xx.

    It seems the "gold rim" version was just a marketing ploy by the US importer.

    - Leigh
    Leigh, there was no US importer for the gold rim Dagors. They were made on Long Island. Supposedly, they had new glass and better collimation. But that is anecdotal info, I have no idea if it's true/accurate.
    One man's Mede is another man's Persian.

  10. #10

    Re: Goerz-Berlin never made "gold" lenses, did they?

    So are you saying B&J actually made up counterfeit front rings with Goerz name on them? I've read vague things of B&J making up lenses from various parts, but didn't realize they went to that much trouble.

    I have the same opinion as Louis regarding Columbus Camera. I had a bad experience way back in the days when I was buying through ads in "Shutterbug". Likely none of the people involved are still working there, but the company name is still the same. When I click on an eBay auction and see their name, I automatically click off the page. From their feedback, I guess they are doing a decent job as far as most buyers are concerned, though.

    Len

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