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Thread: Recent problem with Bob Salomon on photo.net / ebay

  1. #21

    Join Date
    Sep 1998
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    Recent problem with Bob Salomon on photo.net / ebay

    "Furthermore, the fact that a blatantly specific query has been asked twice ["If HP Marketing knew for a fact that he was selling a personal possession, would he be violating our laws by bypassing Trademark rules and regulations?"]

    But I have.

    Ebay has specific guidelines about this. Just check them.

    However if you feel you don't have to here is a statement. If it has the Heliopan logo this statement applies. In case there is any confusion, if Heliopan is on the product it is of foreign origin. Nothing Heliopan sells is made in the U.S.

    Heliopan Trademark Information

    Please read the following before listing an item with the name "Heliopan" This message provides awareness of the USA Trademark Laws applying to Heliopan's trademark registered in the United States.

    Trademark and Gray Market Warning Notice HP Marketing Corporation, an American-owned company not related to the Heliopan factory in Germany, has registered the Heliopan Trademark with the U.S. Patent and Trademark Office (PTO), and has recorded these marks with the United States Customs Service for legal import restrictions in accordance with 19 C.F.R. Part 133. Under Section 526 (a) of the US Tariff Act of 1930, the importation of any foreign-origin merchandise bearing the Heliopan trademark, without the written consent of HP Marketing Corporation, is unlawful and prohibited. Unauthorized importations are subject to possible seizure and forfeiture by the United States Customs Service. HP Marketing Corporation is actively working with Customs to enforce these trademarks aggressively. HP Marketing Corporation will also pursue all of its available remedies for injunctive relief and damages against any companies or persons who import, distribute, sell or otherwise deal in gray market merchandise bearing these trademarks.

  2. #22

    Recent problem with Bob Salomon on photo.net / ebay

    Some times good people can make silly mistakes. I think this is the case in this instance with Bob. As I understand it the guy bought the hood in the US, probably to avoid paying VAT taxes in Canada. Nothing wrong with that, how many of us have bought equipment out of state to avoid paying state sales tax?

    He used it, decided he wanted to sell the lens he bought the hood for, and probably thought he had a better chance on selling the lens with the hood than without.

    In his zealousness to protect his trademark, Bob decided to make life difficult for this guy and effectively stopped his auction. My questions are:

    Did HP Marketing know that this item was going to be for resale or was it sold to an individual for personal use? If they knew it was going to be for resale, did they warn him it cannot be resold in the US?

    In his response Bob implies the guy is an "out of the car trunk reseler" does he know this for a fact or is it just speculation?

    If it turns out that this guy bought the hood for persoanl use and he was prevented from reselling for some perceived trade infraction, then I think it was a bad move on his part, after all he already got his FULL price for the item with warranty and all. OTOH if it turns out he was a reseller trying to circumvent trade laws, then he was/is in his right to prevent this sale.

    If these questions can be answered then I think it would go a long way to explain the motivation Bob had for his actions.

    As to the insults, specially in PN, I think they are out of bounds. No doubt, Bob can be opinionated, and sometimes an all around PITA. But I think nobody here can deny that he has taken the time to answer our questions, even those that we have sent privately. In his answers he is always very thorough and does not hesitate to follow up if there are more questions. IMO he is a valuable asset to this forum and just because he is human and makes a bad move now and then it is no reason to crucify him.

  3. #23

    Join Date
    Mar 1999
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    Recent problem with Bob Salomon on photo.net / ebay

    This all reminds me of Garth Brooks' miserable campaign against selling used CDs. Come on, big companies, stop sweatin' the small stuff that only serves to infuriate your customer base.

  4. #24

    Join Date
    Jan 2001
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    Recent problem with Bob Salomon on photo.net / ebay

    "That individual may be simply what he seems - a person who wants to sell a personal possession. However we have no way of knowing if that, in fact, is true or if he is using this as a means to bypass the Trademark rules and regulations."

    Yes, you have no way of knowing if that is true, but, without full investigation of the situation, you have no way of knowing that it is false. That being the case, Bob, it seems that you do not have adequate evidence to justify the actions that were taken against the individual in question. There are those on this forum as well as the photo.net forum who will never do business with HP Marketing again because of the poor image you have presented. That is not good business practice. HP Marketing needs to reevaluate their policies concerning such situations. Failure to do so, will, in the end, result in the loss of customer loyalty.

  5. #25

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    Recent problem with Bob Salomon on photo.net / ebay

    Jorge,

    "Did HP Marketing know that this item was going to be for resale or was it sold to an individual for personal use? If they knew it was going to be for resale, did they warn him it cannot be resold in the US? "

    Of course not. He did not buy anything from HP Marketing Corp., he has no bill of sale from HP Marketing Corp.

    We are not a retailer. We sell to camera stores.

    He bought this from a camera store. What may have been asked or what may have been answered in his transaction between the store and he only they know.

    If, when he called us he told us he was in Canada we would have referred him to the Canadian distributor.

    But just like Richard, who is in the UK, we have no way of knowing - unless one tells us - that he is in or out of the country. So John was given answers and service the same as anyone calling from the U.S.

  6. #26

    Recent problem with Bob Salomon on photo.net / ebay

    Bob did seem to answer my question. Unless I am wrong, the issue only concerns Heliopan because HP Marketing owns the trademark. They do not own the trademarks of Linhof, Rodenstock, etc. Thus any item, new or used bearing the Heliopan logo can not be imported into the US without HP Marketing's permission. This situation doesn't pertain to most other if not all products marketed by HP Marketing.

  7. #27

    Recent problem with Bob Salomon on photo.net / ebay

    Of course not. He did not buy anything from HP Marketing Corp., he has no bill of sale from HP Marketing Corp.



    We are not a retailer. We sell to camera stores.



    He bought this from a camera store




    Thanks for answering Bob, unfortunately I have to side with the guys who think you went a bit too far in this instance. If the guy bought it from a store, he paid full retail price, so you have effectively gotten your money and compensation for the marketing, taxes etc. What he does with the hood afterwards is his business. Even if he bought 10 hoods for resale, if he bought them from an authorized US retailer and paid full price, then they are his to do what he likes with them, you have effectively gotten your moneys worth. If OTOH he bought them from a gray market reseller like B&H then perhaps you should go after B&H, not the guy who bought the hoods from them..no?

  8. #28
    Founder QT Luong's Avatar
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    Aug 1997
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    Recent problem with Bob Salomon on photo.net / ebay

    Bob, please clarify whether your policy applies to everything that HP markets
    in the US, or just to the brand Heliopan.

    Richard, this is the internet, where any advice has to be
    double checked. As long as the advice is relevant and not unsollicited,
    I have no problem with whatever motives the poster has.
    It is up to the readers to figure it out that Bob markets the
    products he recommends. Most of the regulars are aware of that, and from time
    to time if they feel that Bob has been too blatant will post a rebuttal. IMO, this
    works fine, and there is no need to change that or discuss that any further.

  9. #29

    Recent problem with Bob Salomon on photo.net / ebay

    Here's something to keep Bob Salomon awake nights. Nefarious U.S. photographers right this minute could be unloading on eBay Heliopan filters that they picked up while travelling abroad! Yikes, there goes at least five or six HP Heliopan filter sales a year.

  10. #30

    Join Date
    Dec 2001
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    105

    Recent problem with Bob Salomon on photo.net / ebay

    I just want to qualify my statements above, as being from the narrow perspective of an end-user, who acts only as a private individual, not as someone who is a "gray market" or re-seller. If this is a case of someone who simply bought, tried, and decided to get rid of this hood, then I think the company went way overboard on this one. If he turned out to be doing this as a business, then he should 1) have known better and 2) get his hand slapped. So again, as an "end user" who would have no commercial interest, I still would have to stand by what I already said about private property that has been bought and paid for in good faith. That would include keeping it, or selling it off. I am not a lawyer, but I could see the difficulties of getting rid of it, if not allowed to tell people what the heck it is I want to sell. Other than that, I could not care less if Bob markets the items he recommends, so long as he is honest. All I can say is, he hasn't lied to me (shrug). I just don't care for the idea of someone deciding what I can do with anything I bought and paid for after the fact. I better stop now, I'm beginning to repeat myself.

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