Photos at Occupying Wall Street

[MIke Sherck]

Love your portraits, Brian! Sensitive and interesting. Thanks for sharing!

Mike

[redrockcoulee]

On this thread and else where on the net there has been not only photos showing the diversity of the people at those occupy sites but a great diversity of styles of photography as well. I thank those who have posted their images. I live in a small city that does not have as much diversity of people as the larger centres as well does not have the diversity of ilks that plague other places.

[Edwin Beckenbach]

A few from last week. All from 4x5 Portra 160.

[onnect17]

Back from "Occupy Boston". Got the digital to take a couple of images. Nothing worth turning the camera on. Not even a small British flag (ironic) or the "FU Bitch" graffiti style written on one of the tents.

[jb7]

Some more good pictures going on there- particularly like those dangerous looking socialists in the 'Global Revolution' one... and the family too. Happy thanksgiving...

I would contrast John Sexton's Places of Power photographs with the street photos of the pierced, tattooed, unkempt, idle "occupiers" with incoherent personal statements that l loosely translate as socialist/anarchist nonsense. Sexton's photos depict the greatness of man, the photos on the link depict the baseness and regression of man. I suspect the the linked occupy photos won't result in many coffee table books. But maybe they could be burned in trash cans for heat.

Why would you do that? So now you're a book burner too? Figures...

That Sexton thing, a non sequitur, apropos of nothing.
Photography can do more than glorify achievement, and its end result does not have to be as part of a stack of books on a coffee table, no matter how comforting that world might be for you. Aspirational fairy tale books have their place, but having a place to put a coffee table might be equally aspirational. Regarding the baseness of man, aren't the majority of people only one paycheck away from the streets? Just what is capitalism doing for those that have no capital? How can you expect people with no capital to stand up for the system that makes you rich? Do you also think they should put your self interest in front of their own?

There are no people in that book you mentioned. Rather, they've all moved aside so the picture can be taken. Tidier like that, I suppose.

I was referring to the apparent failure of deinstitutionalization given that many of the photos could just as easily depict the homeless mentally ill crowd as they could an "occupy" protest if not labelled as such.

Is there something in your training that provides you with the insight to be able to identify, from a photograph, a homeless mentally ill person? Or is it just innate prejudice, because it's quicker? I'd love to be able to catch a glimpse of the results of your Rorschach test, maybe they would flag a few more of your time savers. By the way, are the conditions mutually inclusive? That is, if you saw someone from one of those photographs, would you make the double assumption that they were both homeless and mentally ill?

I don't know if you have visited many of our large cities lately, but the downtowns are filled with homeless mentally ill people. These are the same people who would have been hospitalized years ago when treatments were not very effective or well tolerated. But commitment laws and resources are different now, so they wander aimlessly or mischievously around our cities. …

Just read anything that the Occupy crowd writes or says. They are anti-capitalist, socialist, anarchist revolutionaries at heart. It would appear that most are unemployed or else comfortable enough under the currently "unfair system" to take large amounts of time off of from their exploitative jobs to protest.

Just what are you trying to say? Now you have me confused. First you say "the downtowns are filled with homeless mentally ill people" and you go to a lot of trouble to depict photographs of the protesters as being of garbage, freak shows- impossible to distinguish from evictees from asylums- (no, you don't need to legally occupy to be evicted from somewhere). Then, in your very next thought, you decide that they're "anti-capitalist, socialist, anarchist revolutionaries at heart." So which is it, or is that less important than spreading the fear and the hatred?
How about joining up all your thoughts, and calling them homeless, mentally ill, anti-capitalist, socialist, anarchist revolutionary, pierced, tattooed, unkempt, idle "occupiers" with incoherent personal statements? Except now I feel more sorry for them than scared…

I did make it over to America in the summer, but had to leave after a couple of days, due to a bereavement. I had been scheduled to visit NYC, Austin TX, Albuquerque NM, as well as touring NY and New England. Next time. I've previously visited NYC, Chicago, LA and Vegas. And Mexico City, but that was a few years ago now. So I have an idea what a big city is.

As a tourist, I can't say what my reaction would have been, but we have the obscenity of homelessness here too- in Ireland of all places- an obscenity because the Irish people now own all the properties that those giants of Capitalism, the Speculators and the Banks, used to bankrupt the country. Billions locked up in buildings and on deposit, and people sleeping on the street.

We're still being shafted by the EU, they'll get their money back, with interest, and our own government will collaborate by facilitating the smooth transfer of funds from the austerity imposed on the people (who didn't cause this problem, didn't gamble or piss it away) into the coffers of the Banks and Big Business. The Ratings agencies, the same ones who gave us a clean bill of health at the height of the bubble, those gangsters and crooks, are still there, creaming off the same vig. The Markets, that playground of capitalism, are always the winners, taking the cut, going up or going down.

Those homeless mentally ill people? They have as much right as anyone to be on the streets protesting, maybe more- not that I want to over-simplify, but the anti-psychotics sold by 'Big Pharma' don't really do them much good, they're more about controlling the patient than curing- not that those in the caring professions care much about those with no means to pay. Psychiatry doesn't need to find a cure, after all. On the contrary, it probably contributes to the problem, to mentalism, probably always has.

Your comments on the photographs, to give you the benefit of the doubt, are ambiguous- less charitably, careless. In my gut I can't help but feel that it is the people you regard as the garbage, the freak show. Having an alternative view leaves me open to being loudly rubbished as that most base animal, a liberal. Naive, at that. Fill your boots. I would hate to have someone sneer at the subject of a picture that I posted on the internet, I'd feel that I'd failed the subject- unless I'd obviously expected to elicit such a reaction, for some reason- I'd feel I'd let them down.

So, what would you call someone who is 'obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices, especially one exhibiting intolerance, and animosity toward those of differing beliefs'? Might it be a psychiatric disorder? Or is it just normative behaviour...


Apologies for the lengthy post- next time i'll just post a picture.


joseph

[jeroldharter]

That was a bit long...

"What is capitalism doing for people with no capital?" People with no capital? Is that not the goal of the occupiers anyway? The assumption that any private property is an ill-gotten gain at the expense of another. If they have no capital they should rejoice in their achievement rather than clamoring to take the capital of others. Interesting that you ask if they should subjugate their self interest to that of another. Of course not, but the basis of their ideology is that self interest is inherently wrong. I am not sure why you think I am rich. I am not, but have worked to save money, invest in free markets, and made short term sacrifices for long term gains. Certainly not "occupy" ideals but traditional American values. I don't know why you imply that I don't care about poor mentally I'll people. I spent all Thanksgving day doing just that.

I guess there is something in my training that I can identify hopelessly mentally I'll people with some reliability. For example, a man covered in filth, shirtless, unshaven, mumbling to a garbage can while digging for cigarette butts next to his shopping cart filled with random junk are subtle clues. Similar to the stigmata of liver failure. Does not take much to pick an end stage alcoholic out of a crowd.

I can't say much about the Irish economy except that the E.U. has always been a bad idea. If your banks are like ours, they are not exactly doing well. If you think they are then invest in them.

Your understanding of psychiatry appears limited. Say what you want about "big Pharma" ( should we aspire to little Pharma?). They are responsible for huge improvements in the treatment of mental illness, especially psychosis. The homeless psychotic people you see are rarely medication failures. They are the consequences of strict commitment limitations and the patient's own refusal to accept treatment and/or persuit of drug abuse. You might be surprised how many people accept disability payments for psychiatric disability while refusing to treat it, and then accept public assistance to pay for their inevitable hospitalization and sundry life travesties.

Just to be clear, again. I was not commenting on any of the photos posted here. I was referring to the photos in the links. But I am surprised that you are offended by my "protest" of those photos! I thought protesting was all the rage.

[redrockcoulee]

I was referring to the apparent failure of deinstitutionalization given that many of the photos could just as easily depict the homeless mentally ill crowd as they could an "occupy" protest if not labelled as such.

I don't know if you have visited many of our large cities lately, but the downtowns are filled with homeless mentally ill people. These are the same people who would have been hospitalized years ago when treatments were not very effective or well tolerated. But commitment laws and resources are different now, so they wander aimlessly or mischievously around our cities.

I am not sure you understand our current commitment laws. No person can be committed on another's whim. Commitments, unlike occupy protestors, are governed by laws and always subject to judicial review. Full commitments are relatively rare, uncommonly exceed 6 months, and are mostly out-patient.

And those photos could have just as easily been of the tradespeople and research scientists or even soldiers where I work. They are truly lovely portraits, I wished mine turned out as well but then I am more of a landscape photographer with no people in them. But that does not mean I cannot appreciate other types of images, especially ones of what I hope turns to be an important time.

But you are right, we do not have the resources anymore for the mentally ill or anyone else who needs them now a days. Nor the tolerance for them either.

[kev curry]

Great post Joseph, very clear. It was transparent from the start that deep ideological opposition to the Occupy movement lay behind the attack on the work of Bradley.

[jb7]

I guess there is something in my training that I can identify hopelessly mentally I'll people with some reliability. For example, a man covered in filth, shirtless, unshaven, mumbling to a garbage can while digging for cigarette butts next to his shopping cart filled with random junk are subtle clues. Similar to the stigmata of liver failure. Does not take much to pick an end stage alcoholic out of a crowd.

[...]


Just to be clear, again. I was not commenting on any of the photos posted here. I was referring to the photos in the links. But I am surprised that you are offended by my "protest" of those photos! I thought protesting was all the rage.

No, still can't find those pictures, here or in the links. Guess your special training is quite 'special'. Strange, because your comments read like you're talking about a whole swathe of people in the photographs. Care to point them out for us?

Right, I'm done here. You're right, my knowledge of psychiatry is quite limited, thank god. I'm confident of one important fact, however, the knowledge that someone like you is writing psychiatric reports on people makes my blood run cold.


joseph

[Rick Tardiff]

people are scarce around rural Maine, I did manage to find two people. I used my ebony rw45, 150mm lens, tmax400 processed in ilford chemicals. Scanned with epson V700.