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Thread: Kodak

  1. #101

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    Re: Kodak

    Quote Originally Posted by rdenney View Post
    The small Kodak digicams were actually quite excellent little cameras. But they looked like minivans and attracted customers who drove minivans. They didn't have the style of a Sony or the hipness of a Leica/Panasonic. It's all moot--I can make better images with my iPhone than my wife can with her half-decade-old Canon Elph digicam. I feel like a traditionalist because I actually use my Leica D-Lux instead of my iPhone most of the time.

    Kodak still makes the best big sensors. Their sensors are in the Leica S2, the Pentax 645D, and at least one of the Hasselblad backs that I know of (and I don't really make it my business to know--those are expensive beyond even my curiosity). I think their problem is at the retail end of digital photography. They are a strong player in the OEM market. Even their own retail-branded MFDB did not seem to establish any dominance or market buzz, but maybe it did and I just missed it.

    Rant time, of course with no more knowledge than any other person who can read a financial report. We have insiders here who perhaps know the real stories.

    Running from the retail equipment market seems to be nothing new for Kodak. They've been doing that for decades. They stopped making professional lenses 50 years ago, leaving the market (for a time) to Wollensak, Ilex and the more expensive (but at that time not necessarily better) German manufacturers. They ran from that even before the Japanese were players. They never produced a quality consumer SLR to compete against cameras like the Pentax Spotmatic, and instead bet their profits on ultra-volume consumer cameras like the Instamatic. They gleefully participated in a race to the bottom, but found out that the bottom is a lot farther down there than they imagined (cameras like the Instamatic became literally disposable what, 20 years ago?). While the Japanese were owning the quality consumer market with very good little fixed-lens rangefinder cameras and decent SLRs, Kodak was nowhere to be seen, except inside the yellow box.

    Fuji kicked their butts in the film arena. To me, this seems like the Great Battle between color and tone. Fuji went to saturation and Kodak stayed with tone. Saturation won in the consumer market, and Kodak once again had to race to the bottom to be the cheaper alternative on drug-store shelves. I don't know if Kodak has a stake in Chinese film production, but if they didn't, that wouldn't have helped in that race to the bottom, if the bottom is where they really wanted to be.

    The inevitability of digital replacing consumer and small formats has been pretty apparent for many years now. As soon as they got a whiff of that, they needed to be investing R&D into lower production business models for film. I think they did do that to some extent, from what I've read, but clearly not enough.

    When they diversified into related businesses, they did so to build a vertical production capability, and enjoyed some success with that approach for many decades. But then they sold off those supporting businesses even when they were separately profitable, and now don't have them to help fill in gaps the balance sheet while they react to the big changes in the photography market. The example I'm familiar with is the Eastman Chemical Company, founded by Kodak in 1918 and spun off in 1994. They made many, many products outside the photography industry, and they are a solid if not stellar player in the plastics industry. They are probably happy not to be under the Kodak yoke, however.

    A big part of the problem is the same problem faced by most traditional American corporations. They have forgotten that the CEO really needs to know the business the company is in, even at a technical level, and certainly at a visionary level. For a long time, Kodak has been "led" by business-school graduates and corporate committees who are part of a managerial class first instituted by the Harvard Business School. Everybody is mourning the passing of Steve Jobs, and whatever else he did, he demonstrated the importance of a CEO who knows what his business is at both a technical and visionary level.

    Rick "spouting another rant that will earn a 'Jeezum!' from Petronio" Denney
    All excellent points!
    I steal time at 1/125th of a second, so I don't consider my photography to be Fine Art as much as it is petty larceny.

  2. #102
    Dominik
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    Re: Kodak

    Quote Originally Posted by John Kasaian View Post
    All excellent points!
    wholeheartedly agree, but it's not only the US economy that is led by Harvard MBA types it's most of the civilized world and as we can see in greece and on wallstreet (Goldmann Sachs helped greece hide its debts and was one of the main contributors to the financial crisis) everything is going down the drain thanks to these types.

    Dominik

  3. #103
    Drew Wiley
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    Re: Kodak

    Story of my life. When I have the opportunity to distribute a particular mfg I try to
    get into the head of the CEO and key marketing crew. Sometimes it's real easy if a
    lot of dryrot is there. Right now my sales rising about 40% per yr even during the
    recession on my highest-priced line of equip which happens to be a German Co run like
    clockwork. The CEO is an engineer and knows his products inside out. The staff are
    well paid. And they have utterly killed off the sales of all the cheapo products run
    by the Wall St schmoozers and their dime-a-dozen MBA's. Speaking of which, gotta
    order another truckload ... bye!

  4. #104

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    Re: Kodak

    Quote Originally Posted by neil poulsen View Post
    But, they discontinued it! I don't know; maybe that was the right decision, given the situation. But, they also had an excellent sensor that they manufactured. One wonders why that didn't go anywhere?
    They didn't go anywhere because of Canon really. By the time the DCS-14n actually made it to market and into shops in any real numbers you could already buy a 1Ds and that is what most of the people who needed one and could afford one had already done.

    When it finally was released after all the delays the DCS-14n was compared to the 1Ds as that was the only other full frame DSLR at the time that was really comparable and the Canon was overall the better camera, that is why people were willing to pay so much more for it. So by the time the DCS Pro SLR/c came along, Canon was already top dog in the full frame game and if you were a Nikon person you were probably waiting for the D2X. Kodak dropped it just over a year later.

    Not that it matters now but FillFactory manufactured/designed the sensors for Kodak's DSLRs (with help from Tower Semiconductor), and not Kodak, which I always found strange given Kodak did also make sensors themselves. FillFactory was sold to Cypress in 2004 so perhaps the future supply of sensors was a concern too, who knows.

  5. #105

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    Re: Kodak

    NC2000, still have nightmares about that camera. Used one for a couple of years, great if you liked to miss most shots, and everything magenta.
    The 14n was a better camera than the 1ds in some respects, except it was unusable at anything higher than iso100, shame they didn't do a revised version.

  6. #106

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    Re: Kodak

    Quote Originally Posted by edtog View Post
    NC2000, still have nightmares about that camera.
    Me too. Imagine your first week at a new job at a major newspaper and you get assigned to cover a pro sporting event with one NC2000! At least back then, when we did deadline sports jobs we had a digital tech with us to to the transmitting.

    Good times.

  7. #107

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    Re: Kodak

    This morning when I was having coffee I saw a commercial that NBC Nightly News is going to have a segment on KODAK tonight. I believe it is on at 6:30 pm in the whole country but you may want to check your guide.

  8. #108
    Format Omnivore Brian C. Miller's Avatar
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    Re: Kodak

    Kodak has licensed laser image projection to IMAX, for "less than $50 million in upfront fees." Also, it is being sued by Fujifilm over violation of four software patents.

  9. #109
    Format Omnivore Brian C. Miller's Avatar
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    Re: Kodak

    Kodak Sells Image Sensor Business to Platinum Equity

    I heard tell that the sensor business was profitable for Kodak. If Kodak is trying to go forth into a digital future, what are they thinking? Perhaps they'll also sell off the film division, and we can all breathe a sigh of relief.

  10. #110
    Drew Wiley
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    Re: Kodak

    It's called selling your own blood, desperation, panic down at the corner loan shark's office, cooking the goose that laid the golden egg, whatever. But apparently they retained the right to use the technology on their own branded products. Now they need a fire sale on patents to raise more cash. Sounds like a fairly slow medieval style of corporate death.

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