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Thread: Use of coloured filters with zone system

  1. #21
    kev curry's Avatar
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    Re: Use of coloured filters with zone system

    According to Hutching's, filter manufacturers dont take into account the altitude, colour temperature or the colour of the subject. Cant say I know anything much about all that but I use his method and his compensations and they work consistently.

    For an example Hutchings recommends adding a two stop exposure increase when using a #25 medium Red Filter, that is after metering the important shadow areas through the filter. Metering the shadow areas though the filter is an important part of his method.

    In my experience this method would provide me with detailed printable shadows.
    Without the 2 stop compensation the zone III shadows would be lost in zone I.

  2. #22

    Re: Use of coloured filters with zone system

    Thanks for all the replies, lots of useful info to read over now.

  3. #23

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    Re: Use of coloured filters with zone system

    The Zone VI modified meter is marketing hype:

    http://www.butzi.net/articles/zone%20VI%20reprise.htm

    "Not everything that counts can be measured. Not everything that can be measured counts."
    ~Albert Einstein

  4. #24

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    Re: Use of coloured filters with zone system

    Hi Robert,

    I read that article. I feel Paul Butzi went a bit over the top trying to "disprove" Zone VI.

    I suggest there is a problem using a Macbeth color checker (or even a gray fence or gray card) because I think the problematic subjects are foliage (for their excess IR) and sky / shadow illuminated by sky at high elevation (for their excessive UV).

    Fred Picker did his original research on a Soligor II. Paul Butzi might have pegged it when he suggests Pentax selected better cells for later models and certainly by the time of the digital spot they would be using the best available. So would Sekonic today.

    I do wonder about IR though. My quick test proved there is some detection in IR and that could over-rate foliage, leading to underexposure. I have at least one meter that exactly matches my visual response (the SEI).

    I think its time for me to try a test. I'll see if I can find a green ink sample held against a green foliage subject, matched in visual brightness by SEI but reading differently by an electronic meter. I'll have to wait 'til tomorrow for the IR.

  5. #25

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    Re: Use of coloured filters with zone system

    I just aimed my Zone VI Modified Pentax spot meter at the sending end of my ATN Viper Infra Red viewing device.

    It didn't register any reading whatsoever. I tried this in a well-lit room, and in the darkroom.

    That's reassuring, since the "Panchromatic" films I use, can't see Infra Red anyhow. This graphic is taken from http://www.infraredphoto.co.uk/guide/



    The Viper emits light in the range of 850-890nm.

    HP5+, according to the official Ilford HP5+ tech sheet, is insensitive to light at those wavelengths.

    FP4+ is also insensitive at that portion of the spectrum, according to the Ilford FP4+ tech sheet.

    According to the Kodak tech sheet, TMY and TMX are also insensitive to that spectral range.
    Last edited by Ken Lee; 20-Nov-2010 at 11:05.

  6. #26
    http://www.spiritsofsilver.com tgtaylor's Avatar
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    Re: Use of coloured filters with zone system

    When metering thru my filters (Lee, Hi-tech, B&W and Cokin) I always get the same reading as stated by the manufacturer. But it is extremely important that the filter is perpendicular to the axis thru spot meter's lens/cell. If the angle is off by even a small amount you will get a bogus reading.

  7. #27

    Re: Use of coloured filters with zone system

    Quote Originally Posted by tgtaylor View Post
    When metering thru my filters (Lee, Hi-tech, B&W and Cokin) I always get the same reading as stated by the manufacturer.
    Do you mean you get the same reading after applying the manufacturer's filter factor?

  8. #28

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    Re: Use of coloured filters with zone system

    Quote Originally Posted by Curtis Lowe View Post
    Do you mean you get the same reading after applying the manufacturer's filter factor?
    He probably means that if he takes a reading without the filter and then through the filter he gets the same exposure adjustment as the manufacturer's filter factor would call for.
    Brian Ellis
    Before you criticize someone, walk a mile in their shoes. That way when you do criticize them you'll be
    a mile away and you'll have their shoes.

  9. #29

    Re: Use of coloured filters with zone system

    I have been reading up on Hutchings method and I'm not sure if I follow it correctly. Am I right in saying I meter the important shadow area through the filter, reduce the reading by two stops to go from zone V to zone III, and then add the filter factor as per Hutchings table?

  10. #30
    kev curry's Avatar
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    Re: Use of coloured filters with zone system

    Yes thats it...right on!

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