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Thread: Pyocat-HD/-MC 2 Bath Developing...

  1. #1
    Wayne venchka's Avatar
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    Cool Pyocat-HD/-MC 2 Bath Developing...

    ...for the technically challenged.

    Sandy, Ken, etc.,

    I think that I have read all of the threads on the subject. Would it be possible to state the procedure for using and relative merits of both developers in a divided, two bath scenario?
    I am beating my head against a wall fighting summer heat here in Houston. I love Xtol 1:3, but the temperature variations between summer and winter are killing me. I want simple. Temperature independant. One soup fits all of my eclectic hodge podge of emulsions and formats.
    My hardware setup is a Jobo 3010 Expert drum and 2553 tank and reels. These rotate in a single direction on either a Beseler or Uniroller motor base at 30-32 rpm. Ambient summer room temperture is 78°F to 80°F. Tap water is close 85°F. I prewash in tap water.
    Please advise a starting point for the 2 bath method and which developer is correct for my current method. I am not a high volume user so long stock solution shelf life is important. Example: It took me 13 1/2 months to use up my last 5 liter batch of Xtol.
    Dilution, prewash or not, wetting agent or not, time in each solution, type of fixer, etc. would help me a lot. Subject to my own testing of course.
    Thanks for all of your help, past and future. I wouldn't be where I am today (still slightly dazed and a little confused) without your help.
    Wayne
    Deep in the darkest heart of the North Carolina rainforest.

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  2. #2

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    Re: Pyocat-HD/-MC 2 Bath Developing...

    Is this procedure can help to hanlde the high temp.? A lot of places in the world has this summer of 25c to 35c (77-95f or higher even in LA just recently). What is the limit of temp?

  3. #3

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    Re: Pyocat-HD/-MC 2 Bath Developing...

    Quote Originally Posted by venchka View Post
    ...for the technically challenged.

    Sandy, Ken, etc.,

    I think that I have read all of the threads on the subject. Would it be possible to state the procedure for using and relative merits of both developers in a divided, two bath scenario?
    I am beating my head against a wall fighting summer heat here in Houston. I love Xtol 1:3, but the temperature variations between summer and winter are killing me. I want simple. Temperature independant. One soup fits all of my eclectic hodge podge of emulsions and formats..
    To address your questions.

    1. If you compare Xtol 1:3 with two-bath pyrocat this is what you would find, IMO. Grain is slightly finer with Xtol, film speed is slightly greater with Xtol, and sharpness is higher with two-bath Pyrocat.

    2. Temperature control is less important with two-bath Pyrocat than with Xtol. Film will absorb more of the reducer at 85º F than at 75º F, and this will increase contrast slightly. But the mechanism of development still limits the development of highlight density.

    3. I personally use two bath development with roll film that I expose when traveling. This allows me to expose film in a variety of subject brightness conditions and not have to worry about how long to develop the film. The other thing is that this method produces very high sharpness.

    4. For development in Jobo with constant rotation I would recommend the following protocol.

    a. Use a 1:15 or 1:20 dilution of Pyrocat Stock A and Stock B for most films. Add a few grams of PhotoFlo to the solution.
    b. Pre-soak the film for two or three minutes in water at 75º F.
    c. Develop for five minutes in working Solution A, at 75º F. Then drain the film for 15 seconds.
    d. Develop for five minutes in working Solution B, at 75º F.
    e. Use a 1/2 strength acetic acid stop bath for 10 seconds.
    f. Fix in any standard fixer. I use an alkaline fixer (TF-3) but the use of a slightly acidic fixer is ok.
    f. Wash the film for 10-15 minutes, drain and dry.

    Bear in mind that I develop film for scanning, not for printing in the wet darkroom. This means I place more importance on limiting highlight contrast than on developing film to a given CI to match a certain paper or process.

    Hope this information is useful.

    Sandy King
    For discussion and information about carbon transfer please visit the carbon group at groups.io
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  4. #4
    Joe Mace
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    Re: Pyocat-HD/-MC 2 Bath Developing...

    Quick question: Why 75ºF for 2-bath Pyrocat, as opposed to the 68ºF that I use for 'standard' Pyrocat rotary development?

    I really want to give 2-bath Pyrocat a try, but am going to be challenged trying to maintain 75º F solutions in my plumbing-less basement darkroom up here in NH.

    To use lower development temps, is it is simple as extending the time the film develops in both Solutions A and B? If so, I'm willing to experiment a bit to get the right times for 68º F. I use Pyrocat-MC.

    Joe

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    Re: Pyocat-HD/-MC 2 Bath Developing...

    Quote Originally Posted by anotherJoe View Post
    Quick question: Why 75ºF for 2-bath Pyrocat, as opposed to the 68ºF that I use for 'standard' Pyrocat rotary development?

    I really want to give 2-bath Pyrocat a try, but am going to be challenged trying to maintain 75º F solutions in my plumbing-less basement darkroom up here in NH.

    To use lower development temps, is it is simple as extending the time the film develops in both Solutions A and B? If so, I'm willing to experiment a bit to get the right times for 68º F. I use Pyrocat-MC.

    Joe
    The warmer the solution the more the gelatin can swell. The more the gelatin swells the more the more reducer can be absorbed. Yes, this is time dependent so the film might absorb as much reducer in ten minutes at 70º F as at 80º F in five minutes.

    You might find that 70º F at five minutes will give you the right amount of contrast, but if it does not either extend development time or increase the temperature of the solution. Increasing the strength of the dilution from 1:15 or 1:20 to 1:10 will also result in more reducer being absorbed, assuming you maintain the same time and temperature.

    Sandy
    For discussion and information about carbon transfer please visit the carbon group at groups.io
    [url]https://groups.io/g/carbon

  6. #6
    Joe Mace
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    Re: Pyocat-HD/-MC 2 Bath Developing...

    Your explanation makes perfect sense!

    Gracias.

    Joe

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    Re: Pyocat-HD/-MC 2 Bath Developing...

    A bit worry about the amount of photo flo in job drum. Is that ok? I was kept on being told, in this forum in fact, that it would affect the reel and in fact the drum.

    If that is ok, how much as I am not sure the gram part. Also, is that go to solution A and by the way why?

    Thanks in advance for any further advice.

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    Re: Pyocat-HD/-MC 2 Bath Developing...

    Quote Originally Posted by dng88 View Post
    A bit worry about the amount of photo flo in job drum. Is that ok? I was kept on being told, in this forum in fact, that it would affect the reel and in fact the drum.

    If that is ok, how much as I am not sure the gram part. Also, is that go to solution A and by the way why?

    Thanks in advance for any further advice.
    Someone else will have to address the issue of Photoflo affecting the reel.

    However, the reason for the Photoflo is that development of the film is almost instantaneous in Solution B. If the film does not drain evenly after removing it from Solution A you may get uneven development marks. Adding a few drops of PhotoFlo will optimize draining flow, and minimize or eliminate the risk of uneven development marks.

    Sandy King
    For discussion and information about carbon transfer please visit the carbon group at groups.io
    [url]https://groups.io/g/carbon

  9. #9

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    Re: Pyocat-HD/-MC 2 Bath Developing...

    Thanks. May I assume to add to both solution A and B for the few drop of photoFlo?

  10. #10

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    Re: Pyocat-HD/-MC 2 Bath Developing...

    Quote Originally Posted by dng88 View Post
    Thanks. May I assume to add to both solution A and B for the few drop of photoFlo?
    There is no need to add Photoflo to Solution B.

    Sandy
    For discussion and information about carbon transfer please visit the carbon group at groups.io
    [url]https://groups.io/g/carbon

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