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Thread: Lightweight 54 vs panoramic 612

  1. #1

    Lightweight 54 vs panoramic 612

    Backround: I currently use a Mamiya7(11) and prior to that a Pentax67. I am based in the UK. I walk and climb in Mountain ranges; sometimes for 1-2 months at a time (Pyrenee s traverse this summer) and sometimes for one day stints. Intention: I want to move up to a larger neg, having been impressed by LF prints wealth of detail and depth of field. I want to use one lens of medium wi de angle (say 90mm/110mm) but may well be interested in a wider angle lens later on. I would like to create high quality negs. I would like to use roll film for the long mountain traverses/expeditions. I want to increase depth of field beyo nd that possible with stopping down with my MF camera. Issues: My main criteria is weight. I would like the whole package (camer a, lens ...)to be no more than 2kg (about 4 lbs) so a camera of approx 1.5kg (3l bs) or less would be ideal. Speed of setup would be important to me as well. Durability will also be a requi rement. I like the compactness of the Linhoff/Horseman 6x12's but I assume that I will lose out on my depth of field issue and obviously wouldn't have the optio n to use 5x4 for my shorter mountain trips. Do I have to use a tripod? I have be en used to balancing my Mamiya on rocks, ground etc. Are there viewfinders that can be used prior to setting up the camera? <b> Any comments, suggestions, criticisms ?

  2. #2

    Lightweight 54 vs panoramic 612

    </b>You might look into a Cambo Wide or a Silvestri camera, although I'm not sure of the weight or "tiltability" of either.

  3. #3

    Lightweight 54 vs panoramic 612

    Have you considered using a Ebony SW45 or RSW? I use an SW45 and use it a lot for hiking. They weigh 1.5kg without lens and have an international back so you can use a 6 x 12 roll film back or 5 x 4 sheet film holders. Robert White has good deals on the RSW.

    There is not a viewfinder as with the Horseman but the ground glass has a fresnel screen and is very easy to use.

    The camera is a non folding design so is quick to set up. I havn't had any problems with durability.

    You would definately need a tripod but not a heavy one. I use a Gitzo carbon fibre 1227 which only weighs 1.5kg and a giotto ball head when going up mountains.

    Best Wishes

  4. #4

    Join Date
    Jan 2001
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    4,589

    Lightweight 54 vs panoramic 612

    Unless you're planning to go to 8x10 and make contact prints, I don't think that you're going to do any better than the mamiya 7.
    Wilhelm (Sarasota)

  5. #5

    Lightweight 54 vs panoramic 612

    Just to inform you, the difference in between MF and LF in terms of image quality is not that great. (At least not compared to the difference in between 35mm and MF.) At normal print sizes (say 11X14") it is very hard to tell if it is MF or LF. Now some clever guesses about what makes the difference. First, even with a quick LF camera, e.g. a Linhof Technika using rangefinder focusing, getting ready for the shot takes considerably longer time than with your Mamaya 7. This time required slows you down to being able to look at the scene with a different "attitude". Second, the possiblility of processing each and every sheet of film in a unique way. With this comes the choice of film etc. Third, and this is a real time comsumer, the ability to tilt, swing, shift etc. which makes you able to get "everything" sharp without resorting to f/90. Fourth. Yes, a good tripod is very much part of a sharp picture, no matter what format used. I don't intend to chop your head of here, but unless you are willing to sacrifice something in terms of weight (i.e. tripod) and time (i.e. setup) you will not gain anything by moving up to LF. The Mamaya is a great camera, knowing its pros and cons. And if you are careful in the setup of the Mamaya it is tough to beat, even with a the best of 4X5" cameras. As I implied above, LF does have a "different tempo".

  6. #6

    Join Date
    Dec 2000
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    Tonopah, Nevada, USA
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    Lightweight 54 vs panoramic 612

    Remember that with 5X4 any negative can become 6X12 with a pair of shears. With 6X12 you'll never have any more than 6X12. Alas, yes, tripod.

  7. #7

    Join Date
    Nov 1999
    Posts
    740

    Lightweight 54 vs panoramic 612

    An Ebony RSW, 75mm lens and a 6x12 Horseman roll film back mounted on a Gitzo CF tripod. All your requirements answered!!

  8. #8

    Lightweight 54 vs panoramic 612

    Dear Neil

    I have shot for some years with the Fuji 617 (older version without the interchangeable lenses). This is a marvelous camera and accepts both 120 and 220 film. They are a bit more difficult to find an image with since you are using a view finder and not through the lens or a ground glass (the newer verision you can use a ground glass), but the images make it all worthwhile! Often, I use mine handheld and do not find any issues with doing so. If you can use a tripod, better yet, or at least a bean bag. I am always amazed at how many of my photos are the 617 versions-once you get used to thinking in that format you just seem to shoot more and more! The Fuji 617 is a bit bulky, but I can pack it in one of my backpacks. It has been with me through Europe, urban situations in the US and lots of backcountry in our Western states. I have even taken it while skiing - ok, groomed, easy slopes, and I worried about falling and having an imprint in my back!

    Another camera which I have been recommending has been the Hasselblad Xpan which gives a nice image size and is certainly small enough to carry on long journeys. It gives very nice panoramic images and there are three lens choices available.

    Regards,

    John Bailey

  9. #9

    Lightweight 54 vs panoramic 612

    Neil,

    I just spent the weekend in Northern Spain trying out my new gear - Ebony SW23 (1300g), Horseman angle viewer (320g) & 6x9 RFH (350g), Gitzo G1128 (1150g) with Linhof Profi I ballhead (270g), plus lens. Using an angle viewer means shorter and thinner tripod legs are OK - I often find myself using only 1 or 2 leg sections - 1 or 2 feet tripod height, which is not really a problem since I am looking down into the viewer. This combination is extremely lightweight - carrying the camera + viewer + lens + tripod singlehanded while negotiating rough terrain is no problem at all, as well as handheld composition work. An angle viewer forces/helps me to rethink composition, bringing me closer to the ground, allowing for near/far compositions with WA and extreme front tilts. The downside is cost. Most of the above applies to the SW45 as well, but sheet film and holders is heavier to carry and a larger angle viewer required by 6x12 RFH will be a little heavier and bulkier. Check out Australian photographer Nick Rains' review of the RSW45 for some insights: http://www.nickrains.com/info/camera/ebony.html

    As an experiment, I am trying stitched panoramas using shift (rear shift plus opposite camera shift to keep the lens fixed) which should yield 56x160mm format, but this technique is quite limited for moving subjects like clouds.

    Last summer I bought a used Fuji GSW690 rangefinder which has great optics, but I am so used to front tilts that I found the lack of DOF unbearable in many cases, so I can see why you feel that you need an alternative to the Mamiya.

  10. #10

    Join Date
    Mar 1998
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    1,972

    Lightweight 54 vs panoramic 612

    Canham DLC.

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