Page 3 of 22 FirstFirst 1234513 ... LastLast
Results 21 to 30 of 212

Thread: pyro developer, but which?

  1. #21
    Kirk Gittings's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Albuquerque, Nuevo Mexico
    Posts
    9,714

    Re: pyro developer, but which?

    FWIW

    Pyrocatechol is the name recommended by the International Union of Pure and Applied Chemistry (IUPAC) in its 1993 Recommendations for the Nomenclature of Organic Chemistry.[1]
    quote from:http://www.search.com/reference/Pyrocatechol
    Thanks,
    Kirk

    at age 67
    "The woods are lovely, dark and deep,
    But I have promises to keep,
    And miles to go before I sleep,
    And miles to go before I sleep"

  2. #22

    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Location
    Seattle, Washington
    Posts
    3,022

    Re: pyro developer, but which?

    Sandy,

    I'm afraid your analogy is not at all clear to me. In fact, I can't make heads or tails of most of what you've written in this thread, but that's neither here, nor there, as none of it, so far as I can tell, addresses the OP's question. I think we agree that developer choice is one factor of many that combine to determine image quality, but I can't be sure, even of this. And even if we do agree, this is not relevant to the OP's question about pyro developers, and probably best discussed elsewhere.

    Kirk,

    Thanks for the official word on the nomenclature of pyrocatechol. Still, if one is looking for the chemical at Artcraft Chemicals, or Photographers Formulary, etc., it will be found under C for Catechol, and not under P, for Pyrocatechol, for whatever reason.

  3. #23

    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Location
    South Carolina
    Posts
    5,167

    Re: pyro developer, but which?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jay DeFehr View Post
    Sandy,

    I'm afraid your analogy is not at all clear to me. \
    Since what I previously said was not clear to you, let me wrap up.

    1. The OP was interested in a pyro type developer that would fly, presumbably with him. I don't recommend this as any unusual looking chemical has a good chance of being pulled from your luggage or carry-on baggage in the current climate of terrorist threads. In the last five years or so I have lost quite a number of expensive chemicals this way so my recommendation at this point would be to have the developer shipped from a well-known supplier.

    2. All of the major pyro tanning developers, whether pyrogallol based or pyrocatechol based, have certain pros and cons and require some experience to use. While some of the formulas can be classified as general purpose developers I would never recommend one over the other without understanding the specific type of photography the person had in mind because making good images is much more about understanding how to use a developer than the technical qualities of the developer.

    3. Pyro staining and tanning developers, as I use the term, include both Pyrogallol based formulas and Pyrocatechol based formulas. Most people, in my experience, tend to lump these together in one group known as pyro staining and tanning developers. This seem reasonable to me because they all basically do the same general thing, i.e. they add a color stain to the negative, and they harden the gelatin. I use the duck analogy here. If it walks like a duck, looks like a duck, quacks like a duck, I am ok with calling it a duck.

    People who don't agree with my opinion are obviously free to use whatever nomenclature they choose. But this is where I stand, and by and large I believe my position is consistent with current practice, starting with Chapter 8 (Tanning Developers) of The Film Developing Cookbook (Anchell and Troop, 1998) where both pyrogallol and pyrocatechin are discussed together as equally effective staining and tanning developers.

    Sandy King
    http://www.sandykingphotography.com/
    For discussion and information about carbon transfer please visit the carbon group at Yahoo.
    https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/...nTransfer/info

  4. #24

    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Location
    Seattle, Washington
    Posts
    3,022

    Re: pyro developer, but which?

    Sandy,

    Thank you for the clarification, and please find mine below:

    1. I fly every three weeks, year round, and have never had a problem carrying a small bottle of 510-Pyro. Even if I did lose it, it would be more of an inconvenience than an expense, on a par with losing cheap shampoo.

    2. I wouldn't hesitate to recommend 510-Pyro to anyone interested in trying a staining developer; it's the easiest to use, works with all films and formats, and all development processes. I sincerely believe 510-Pyro is the best staining developer one can use, and particularly for a beginner. Others are free to disagree, of course, and I think the OP is looking for opinions on the pros and cons of various staining developers. I mentioned 510-Pyro because I think it's the best all around staining developer, for many reasons, and I mentioned Hypercat because I think it's the sharpest staining developer, and surely the simplest in formulation, and most economical to use. In short, unless maximum acutance is desired, I recommend 510-Pyro, and if maximum acutance is desired, I recommend Hypercat. These recommendations stand without regard to the user's experience or specific intentions. I don't mean to say there are not many other staining developers capable of excellent results;there are, but in my opinion, some are better than others, and my recommendations reflect my opinions.

    3. I think the term staining and tanning developer is more clear than pyro staining and tanning developer, but this is an insignificant issue. Ken asked why I use the terminology I do, and I did my best to explain my reasons. Others are free to use whatever terminology they choose. I don't think anyone is going to be confused when I refer to pyrogallol-based developers as pyro developers, or catechol-based developers as catechol developers, or staining developers, in general, as staining developers.

  5. #25

    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Location
    Massachusetts USA
    Posts
    7,819

    Re: pyro developer, but which?

    Thanks, fellers, for taking the time to explain these things in such detail.

    Since this thread has already had close to 1000 views, we can trust that others share an interest, but may have been reluctant to enquire.
    Last edited by Ken Lee; 6-May-2010 at 13:51.

  6. #26

    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Location
    Seattle, Washington
    Posts
    3,022

    Re: pyro developer, but which?

    Ken,

    I'm always happy to contribute where I think I can. I would like to reiterate that I think developer choice is very low on the complete image quality totem pole, as evidenced by the very fine work posted here, using a wide variety of developers and processes.

  7. #27

    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Location
    South Carolina
    Posts
    5,167

    Re: pyro developer, but which?

    I was just glancing through Steve Anchell's The Darkroom Cookbook, Third Edition. He has a chapter entitled Pyrogallol and Pyrocatechin, and within that chapter a section called Tanning Developers. In this section he lumps pyro and catechol developers together with the term "pyro/cat" developers, which he uses numerous times. However, in the same section he sometimes uses "pyro" without "cat" in situations where it is obvious that he is talking about both pyrogallol and pyrocatechin formulas.

    This is a good example of what I consider contemporary practice in the use of terminology. I did not invent this stuff, just reporting what appears to me to be the general practice.

    Obviously there are situations where one might want to be more specific as to the nature of the reducers in a staining/tanning developer as the characteristics of pyrogallol and pyrocatechol, while very similar, are not exactly the same, and a case could be made here and there that for a given objective one of the other might serve better.

    Sandy King
    http://www.sandykingphotography.com/
    For discussion and information about carbon transfer please visit the carbon group at Yahoo.
    https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/...nTransfer/info

  8. #28

    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Barcelona/Spain
    Posts
    1,363

    Re: pyro developer, but which?

    Do you guys know the Argenti Weston Pyro developer? The reason I ask is it's the only developer of this kind I've seen available in Spain (I suppose others could be found) and I'd really like to give it a go.

    BTW I am curious now as to who the known landscape photographer is

  9. #29

    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Location
    South Carolina
    Posts
    5,167

    Re: pyro developer, but which?

    Quote Originally Posted by ramiroelena View Post
    Do you guys know the Argenti Weston Pyro developer? The reason I ask is it's the only developer of this kind I've seen available in Spain (I suppose others could be found) and I'd really like to give it a go.

    BTW I am curious now as to who the known landscape photographer is
    I am not familiar with the Argenti Weston Pyro developer but if it has Weston in the name I suspect that it is similar to ABC Pyro.

    The photographer I mentioned is Jose Vazquez Caruncho, from La Coruņa. He has several published books and has done a lot of work for the Xunta de Galicia and the CGAI. You can see a fair amount about him by doing a google search. He does beautiful portrait work rather in the style of Paul Strand.

    Sandy King
    http://www.sandykingphotography.com/
    For discussion and information about carbon transfer please visit the carbon group at Yahoo.
    https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/...nTransfer/info

  10. #30
    neophyte
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    234

    Re: pyro developer, but which?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jay DeFehr View Post
    1. I fly every three weeks, year round, and have never had a problem carrying a small bottle of 510-Pyro. Even if I did lose it, it would be more of an inconvenience than an expense, on a par with losing cheap shampoo.
    I assume you are carrying the made up solution in a 100 ml bottle, not labeled with (from customs eyes) some obscure chemical name. I would expect this to be fine.

    Now, put a brown powder in a bottle with a chemical label on it that also says poisonous and have your luggage searched..............
    "In the field of observation chance favours the prepared mind" -- Pasteur

Similar Threads

  1. Bostick & Sullivan Pyro PMK developer - HELP
    By htswv in forum Darkroom: Film, Processing & Printing
    Replies: 7
    Last Post: 2-May-2010, 10:37
  2. Question concerning usage of Pyro developer
    By Kaden Kratzer in forum Darkroom: Film, Processing & Printing
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: 27-Apr-2009, 09:13
  3. Old Formulas : Film
    By Paul Fitzgerald in forum Darkroom: Film, Processing & Printing
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: 19-Mar-2005, 21:31
  4. Pyro Developer
    By Kent McClelland in forum Darkroom: Film, Processing & Printing
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 12-May-1998, 20:13

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •