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Thread: Jack Dykinga: another one bites the d

  1. #21
    Drew Wiley
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    Re: Jack Dykinga: another one bites the d

    Oren - (being Devil's advocate again - don't take it personally) - would YOU actually
    carry a 24,000 dollar back very far off the road? Stuff happens in the mtns. Really.

  2. #22

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    Re: Jack Dykinga: another one bites the d

    Quote Originally Posted by Ed Richards View Post
    You should think of this as a fetish site.:-)
    That is precisely what this forum has resisted in the past, and what it needs to resist now.

    Not so many years ago, there were people on this site who were vehemently opposed to discussion about scanning and digital printing.

    Had those people prevailed, this forum would now be a small subset of APUG.

    Now there are new developments, and this forum can either embrace them or get left in the ditch.

    What does embrace them mean? it means giving people a place to talk about them, and all of us a chance to learn new things. Why is that a threat?

    Ed, I've restricted myself to talking about people like Wall and Burtynsky and Jordan (and should add people like Greg Miller) for a reason. They are conservative. I saw an exhibit at the Victoria and Albert Museum last month (yes, the V&A) on bleeding edge digital developments that showcased technology that has huge ramifications for large format imagery, but we can't talk about techniques that are now mainstream, let alone what the V&A was showing. This is crazy and counterproductive. At least, it's counterproductive if this is supposed to be a serious forum, maybe even for some people a professional one, instead of a stagnant backwater.
    Arca-Swiss 8x10/4x5 | Mamiya 6x7 | Leica 35mm | Blackmagic Ultra HD Video
    Sound Devices audio recorder, Schoeps & DPA mikes
    Mac Studio/Eizo with Capture One, Final Cut, DaVinci Resolve, Logic

  3. #23
    Cooke, Heliar, Petzval...yeah
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    Re: Jack Dykinga: another one bites the d

    let them go to digital, they will have to sell their good stuff to us. Less LF shooters, more good stuf for us.

    I have no problem with people go to digital. Keep your stuff posted on Ebay. I take'em all!!! 30 years later when eveyone will try to come backto LF, they would end up paying ten times more!!!
    Peter Hruby
    www.peterhruby.ca

  4. #24

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    Re: Jack Dykinga: another one bites the d

    Large Format Photography isn't about film or camera size, it's a state of mind.
    Wilhelm (Sarasota)

  5. #25
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    Re: Jack Dykinga: another one bites the d

    Quote Originally Posted by r.e. View Post
    ...Meanwhile, the Royal Academy in London currently has an interesting show about geography and climate, running alongside their major exhibit on Van Gogh, that contains photographs by Burtynsky and Jordan, neither of which can be talked about because the capture medium isn't big enough to be discussed on this forum....
    There are many photographic topics I would like to bring up here, but I don't because they don't involve large-format photography. When I want to talk about ex-Communist cameras and lenses, I do that on the Kiev Report. When I want to talk about digital Canons, I do that on Photography on the Net. When I want to talk about manual-focus lenses, I do that on a forum just for that. If I was anti-digital, there is APUG. I don't mind that the Pentax Discuss Mail List doesn't want to hear me talk about my Sinar (or my Kievs, or my Canons). The Internet is a big place, with room for groups of people to specialize however they want. I have never been able to get much into Photo.net because it's just too general.

    Rick "respecting the specializations, however arbitrary they may seem, of groups of fellow enthusiasts" Denney

  6. #26

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    Re: Jack Dykinga: another one bites the d

    heard from Joe a few minutes ago.. He's shooting Mamiya and Phase One P45+

    Quote Originally Posted by Drew Wiley View Post
    QT - you're taking this from Joe's website. I honestly don't know what he's doing at
    the moment, but I've spoken with him since he posted that. I'm in an analogous
    situation. Certain equipment mfgs send me prototypes to solicit my opinion or obtain advance goodwill. I get in on focus groups with engineers. Sometimes I get to keep the stuff, sometimes I don't; sometimes I get to keep a little but have to purchase the balance. It's no different if you have an inside track with the digital photo industry. Joe does a lot of spin, like saying he has a background in carbon printing. Actually, to my knowledge, he only farmed out a couple trans to Evercolor which turned out terrible. The rest of his info he got from chatting, but that doesn't make
    it bad info, because he's really into detail. I'd imagine at this point info is a bigger part of his income than prints. He's infectiously curious about everything. If Carr
    Clifton actually has gone MF digital, I wouldn't be surprised if Joe does too, because they are friends and quite similar in outlook. But anyone who thinks MF digital can begin to approach LF, especially 8x10, in print quality, is putting a very unrealistic spin on it. Joe's own old Cibas from 4x5 absolutely blow away anything he's printed in inkjet, and he's one of the best inkjet printers I know. And he claims to spend over 40 hours per image doing digital corrections after the scan. Not exactly a labor saver. Of course, I'm not going to drag this into all the other pros and cons, especially since this is a moving target with the technology steadily improving. For anyone taking a lot of images, I can see the cost advantage of digital, especially if you're trying to avoid a scan. But to me Low-Tech offers many advantages. A fifty
    year old stainless darkroom tray works as good today as it did new. How much of
    this digital gear will be worth anything in ten years? If you can amortize it in the
    interim, great. But I can't personally risk the investment for a step backward in
    print quality. I'd love to get away from the odor of color chemicals, but that's another story. Maybe someday. But each of us makes our own rules, and that's the
    way it should be.

  7. #27

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    Re: Jack Dykinga: another one bites the d

    Quote Originally Posted by Drew Wiley View Post
    Oren - (being Devil's advocate again - don't take it personally) - would YOU actually
    carry a 24,000 dollar back very far off the road? Stuff happens in the mtns. Really.
    I've carried it through homeless camps, in ruins in Cambodia and Thailand, and backwoods. never thought twice about it, and have never felt unsafe

  8. #28
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    Re: Jack Dykinga: another one bites the d

    Quote Originally Posted by Drew Wiley View Post
    Oren - (being Devil's advocate again - don't take it personally) - would YOU actually
    carry a 24,000 dollar back very far off the road? Stuff happens in the mtns. Really.
    No, quite the contrary. I can't afford to buy one, let alone run the risk of carrying it into the rough. And even if I could, I still like film better anyway, even after having used a 24MP DSLR for several months and also having tested a couple of (much less expensive) medium format digital cameras.

    So far as I'm concerned, any photographer is welcome to use whatever materials and methods they want. What's best for them is their decision to make, not mine. From a purely economic perspective, though, I think it's fair to say that the kinds of outfits being chosen by these big-name professionals who are substituting for 4x5 are still not realistically within the reach of most amateurs. That was my point.

  9. #29
    Drew Wiley
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    Re: Jack Dykinga: another one bites the d

    I am not personally anti-digital at all. Perhaps it will suit me someday. I have a friend who does all studio work digital Sinar for publications. He easily has a two
    million dollar investment in it, but for him it pays. There are folks around here like
    Stephen Johnson, Charlie Cramer, Joe Holmes, and Ctein whose techno-talk is either subsidized or incentified; in other words, it's part of how they make a living. Makes
    sense. Other folks are just attracted to this end of the spectrum and do their best
    work in this manner. Great. Maybe a few folks are independently weathly and can do
    anything they want anytime; I'm not one of them. And the thirty or forty grand it
    takes to get serious digital camera gear would buy most of us a lifetime supply of
    film, even 8X10! Just in the past three years I've three accidents with my view
    camera gear. Total repair bill - $90. Everything else I fixed in my shop. Maybe by
    the time I'm too old to care there will be something more practical in the digital
    realm and film will disappear. Or I'll just be printing the hundreds of negs and chromes I already have on hand. Who knows. I applaud anyone who can make a great image in any manner they prefer. But for me, the apogee of relevance is someone like Atget who could take virtually obsolete equipment and a nearly antiquated printing technique and make something enduring out of it. If the latest
    and greatest allow you to do this, by all means go for it. I'm perfectly happy with my Phillips 8x10 and my all-mechanical Nikon. And as long as we're all having a fun
    snowball fight over this, wonderful. It's good to get the pros and cons out there.

  10. #30
    Drew Wiley
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    Re: Jack Dykinga: another one bites the d

    Jim - thanks for updating me. Be interesting to see how this is working out for him.

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