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Thread: Screen Cezanne Users Unite

  1. #351

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    Re: Screen Cezanne Users Unite

    Thank you for the polite reply. Gratefully noted.

    I did think we were discussing large format. I have found many of the Epson folks scanning large format at 4000 and downsampling to 2000 spi, silk purse from a pigs ear sort of thing. Sorry I assumed that was your basis, apparently incorrectly.

    Optically when one is at the limit of resolution the contrast (MTF..) drops so much that its all about making line pairs out of the fuzzies. I just believe its good practice to back away a little where your defination contrast wise, is more robust. To me it makes for a better scan. Opinion not fact I suppose. Drum scanners just work differently, no lens, more of a aperture I believe. Not an expert so I need to stop here before I jump in too deep.

    4000 spi is quite nice with the Cezanne.

    I made an assumption that you may have been pixel peeping (ie. Photoshop at 300%) in determining if your machine was focusing correctly. Based upon your resolution charts (is the resolution scale-spi or line pairs???), it didnt look bad at all.

    When you get up to 5000-6000 dpi, a sota drum is just superior with small negatives. Cezanne cant compete for best of the best quality when scanning ie. 35mm.. But for larger negatives it's the bomb, imo.

    bob

    Quote Originally Posted by mdala View Post
    Hi Bob,

    thanks for taking the time to write.



    I regularly drum scan medium format at 6000 spi and that resolution isn't "so high in the rarified air to be almost unworkable". Films like Ektar 100 produce beautiful 50 inches prints when scanned at that resolution. I don't see how 5300 spi from the Cezanne would be an issue. The only issue I'm having now is that the Cezanne doesn't seem to focus properly..



    The earlier comparison scans I made between the drum scanner and the Cezanne show that, resolution wise, the Cezanne holds very well at 5300. Dynamic range is where it is lacking.



    You must have assumed I was scanning large format at 5300spi on the cezanne. That's not the case. I would scan at a lower resolution if the originals were 4x5 or larger.

    MD
    Last edited by Bob McCarthy; 15-Nov-2011 at 09:22.

  2. #352

    Re: Screen Cezanne Users Unite

    Here's an update to the setup I've been trying:


    IMG_0412[1] by photosmart42, on Flickr

    I used a couple of layers of foam core to keep the new platen stiff, and I'm weighing it all down with a large floor tile (yea, I'm cheap) to emulate the weight of the original platen. After experimenting a bit with a few different setups I settled on using the glass from my betterscanning large holder as the new platen. It's large enough to scan 4 strips of 35mm or one 4x5 (and everything else in between). For now I'm using the medium format betterscanning glass pieces as my 35/120 holders, but I'm looking to get a couple additional large glass pieces to use as holders.

    As for my workflow with the negatives, I've been using the SilverFast HDR/DCPro to open up the negatives (scanned as positives) and applying the film modes they have built in. Works very well. They also have a demo of the HDR 8, which looks a lot more user-friendly.

    Peter - one thing I've discovered by accident after following your excellent blog on using the Cezanne software: you can crank up the SD setting all the way to 6.94, not the 4 you mention in your blog. I end up with significantly more depth that way. Try it and let me know if it works for you also.

    Anyway, I welcome your feedback. Cheers!
    -Dragos

  3. #353
    Peter De Smidt's Avatar
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    Re: Screen Cezanne Users Unite

    Quote Originally Posted by photoSmart42 View Post
    Peter - one thing I've discovered by accident after following your excellent blog on using the Cezanne software: you can crank up the SD setting all the way to 6.94, not the 4 you mention in your blog. I end up with significantly more depth that way.
    -Dragos
    I haven't been doing any scanning lately. For me, it's mostly a winter activity. All of my "serious" film work is black and white. I'm assuming that you're using the high SD setting for color? In any case, I'll be happy to give it a try when I fire up the scanner again.

    -Peter
    “You often feel tired, not because you've done too much, but because you've done too little of what sparks a light in you.”
    ― Alexander Den Heijer, Nothing You Don't Already Know

  4. #354

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    Re: Screen Cezanne Users Unite

    After storing the scanner for over a year due to renovations and moving home, I just got mine back. And scanning slides or color film worked fine. However, I cannot get a good scan of B&W film. It is always far too dark and muddy. I have followed advice to scan in RGB as a negative and select a channel afterwards in photoshop (6), but whatever I do it does not turn out OK.
    I do not have the manual of ColorGenius (1), that may not help of course. (It would be useful to have that manual in digital form). But any ideas? I've been tankering with settings to no avail.

  5. #355
    Peter De Smidt's Avatar
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    Re: Screen Cezanne Users Unite

    Willem, by any chance do you have a step-wedge? Scanning it can be very helpful for figuring out bw settings.

    When I scan, I always go into the Manual Fine Adjust dialogue. I put read-out points on the clear film base, a dark shadow, a mid point, and a highlight. With a negative, these will ultimately be inverted in Photoshop, so you take 255 minus the read-out numbers. I like a highlight to be about 230 when the file is brought into Photoshop and inverted, and the film base to be near 0. Use the hd and sd settings to get the sampled-points where you'd like them. (I always aim for a low contrast scan with no clipping.)

    Try a scan at fairly low res. Bring it into photoshop. Invert it. Take some readings. Is it close to what you'd like? If yes, then you're ok. If not, used curves to get the right tonal values. Take a note of what the tonal values should be. Now go back an scan again, using the desired values as a guide. After a few scans, you'll get a good feel for what the values should be.
    “You often feel tired, not because you've done too much, but because you've done too little of what sparks a light in you.”
    ― Alexander Den Heijer, Nothing You Don't Already Know

  6. #356

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    Re: Screen Cezanne Users Unite

    I have no experience with a step-wedge, but I'll seek it out.
    Strangely (and linking to another forum post), I cannot set the SD/HD in negative scanning. But apart from that, how do you put read-out points on the film? I've moved the cursor over the screen and get different values in the small RGB window, but these vaues are in the thousands and tenthousands.
    However, I just experimented with the RGB-curve, along the lines you suggested (230 for high), and I suddenly got something much more like the result I'm looking for. Too blown out in this case, but a huge advance. So I'll experiment a bit more.

  7. #357
    Peter De Smidt's Avatar
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    Re: Screen Cezanne Users Unite

    I scan bw negs as a positive. If you don't, you'll be limited to 8-bit-per-channel scans.

    When I select the area to work with, I get a palette to pop up with space for about 8 sample points. I haven't done any scanning for a bit. I'll check into it tomorrow.
    “You often feel tired, not because you've done too much, but because you've done too little of what sparks a light in you.”
    ― Alexander Den Heijer, Nothing You Don't Already Know

  8. #358

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    Re: Screen Cezanne Users Unite

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter J. De Smidt View Post
    When I select the area to work with, I get a palette to pop up with space for about 8 sample points.
    This I cannot reproduce, while it sounds very good—exacty what you need to fine adjust for individual frames.
    I do have ClorGenius 1, but I think the difference between 1 and 2 is merely compatability with OSX.

  9. #359

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    Re: Screen Cezanne Users Unite

    I hope someone will be able to confirm where these sample points are, and how to enter a value between 0 and 255 at these points.

    Meanwhile, I was wondering whether scanning as a colour positive actually means we can as well use colour negative/positive film rather than B&W, or does B&W film, even when scanned as colour, still retain different values? Just wondering.

  10. #360
    Peter De Smidt's Avatar
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    Re: Screen Cezanne Users Unite

    Hi Willem,

    I'm powering up the scanner system to take some screen shots for you.

    I'm unclear as to what your asking in you are second point. Could you clarify it a bit for me? I scan everything as a color positive, as this is the only way to get 16-bit scans with a Cezanne.

    Steps:
    1 preview.
    2 seclect scan area.
    3 confirm selection
    4 enter Manual Fine Adjustment

    As soon as I do 4, the sample point panel pops up as you can see in the attachments.
    “You often feel tired, not because you've done too much, but because you've done too little of what sparks a light in you.”
    ― Alexander Den Heijer, Nothing You Don't Already Know

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