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Thread: Profiling scanner/film?

  1. #1
    Scott --'s Avatar
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    Profiling scanner/film?

    Hi, all -

    Now that I'm getting better negatives, I need to optimize my scanner, an old Agfa Duoscan. It came with IT8 targets a-plenty, but I admit that I don't know what to do with them. The software (Agfa Colortune 1.0) is Mac only, so I'm ware-less.

    Any suggestions? I'm losing a great deal of detail from the scanning process.



    Thanks,
    Scott

  2. #2
    Whatever David A. Goldfarb's Avatar
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    Re: Profiling scanner/film?

    You're using a Mac or a PC? I use Agfa FotoLook software on the PC, the last version of which is 3.something.something or other if I remember correctly. It's a very good interface. The DuoScan also works with VueScan, but I prefer FotoLook.

    You should be able to find it out there on the internet. I make a separate tone curve for each new film/dev combo, which gives me a good starting point when I use that film again, and usually I tweak it a bit before scanning.

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    Re: Profiling scanner/film?

    I profiled my Microtek 2500 using both Microtek software and VueScan. As long as you have a target, you should be OK. The profiles are virtually indistinguishable.

  4. #4
    Scott --'s Avatar
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    Re: Profiling scanner/film?

    Fotolook 3.60.XX for PC.

    Ok, stupid question, but how do you generate the individual curves for the different film/dev combos? Based on a reference print?

    And what do I do once I scan the target?

    Stupid questions to be sure, but mine nonetheless...

  5. #5
    Scott --'s Avatar
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    Re: Profiling scanner/film?

    Ok, doing better using Fotolook instead of Vuescan:


    Still don't get generating curves and profiles, though...

  6. #6

    Re: Profiling scanner/film?

    There is nothing to profile for black and white film - saving curves as David Goldfarb wrote is helpful. You can save a curve in Fotolook (if I remember correctly) or in Photoshop. Make a scan, apply a curve that looks like what you want and save it. Next time you scan a similar negative choose that curve again. You'll be close.

    If you want to scan color transparencies and get "accurate" color in your scan then a color profile will do that for you. If you're not scanning color positive a color profile will not help you.

  7. #7
    Resident Heretic Bruce Watson's Avatar
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    Re: Profiling scanner/film?

    Quote Originally Posted by Henry Ambrose View Post
    There is nothing to profile for black and white film - saving curves as David Goldfarb wrote is helpful. You can save a curve in Fotolook (if I remember correctly) or in Photoshop. Make a scan, apply a curve that looks like what you want and save it. Next time you scan a similar negative choose that curve again. You'll be close.

    If you want to scan color transparencies and get "accurate" color in your scan then a color profile will do that for you. If you're not scanning color positive a color profile will not help you.
    What Henry said.

    My understanding is that the object in profiling a scanner is so that one can get good results from less than fully experienced operators. The way it works is you profile the scanner, then you scan using exactly the same settings. If you change a setting (say, you move a black point or a white point) you invalidate the use of the profile (typically results in a color cast of some kind).

    Clearly, this will only work with trannies. The reason it will work with trannies is the small variance of density range between individual sheets or frames. Negative film OTOH has much greater frame to frame variance in density, and greater channel to channel variance in each individual frame. To scan negative film without adjusting scan parameters typically results in the image being compressed into a small amount of the file's digital range, and usually some fairly extensive color casts as well.

    For B&W about the best one can do is to scan at 16 bits/channel and set your black and white points carefully to avoid clipping either end. The rest is best done in an image editor like Photoshop IMHO.

    Bruce Watson

  8. #8
    Whatever David A. Goldfarb's Avatar
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    Re: Profiling scanner/film?

    To make a curve in FotoLook (I have v. 3.6) for B&W, just select "Edit/Create" from the Tone Curves menu.

    Once you've saved the curve, you can call it up again from "Import" in the same menu.

    I've attached my Tone Curves in a ZIP file if you want to experiment with them. Some are for reflective scans (Azo, albumen prints, Type 809, etc.), and the rest are for neg scans. The filenames generally include the film, developer, and gamma setting in the Film Type menu in FotoLook that I usually use with this curve (usually 0.8, 1 or 1.2, but no decimal points in the filename). There are also some curves for color transparency films in there.

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    Scott --'s Avatar
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    Re: Profiling scanner/film?

    Awesome! Thanks, David, and thanks for the explanations, guys.

    Scott

  10. #10
    Scott --'s Avatar
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    Re: Profiling scanner/film?

    Aha - getting somewhere now. My N-1 developing helped, but since then, I've started using cooler water to stretch out developing time (my tapwater is 24C...).


    Woo hoo! (Ignore the tear in the emulsion, please... )

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