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Thread: 210mm Heliar or....

  1. #11

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    Re: 210mm Heliar or....

    Compared with? I find f/4.5 plenty fast and very bright on the groundglass. But with depth of field a serious challenge at that aperture when doing portraits.

    Certainly, for soft soft images, something like a Imagon or Fuji SF or one of the Galli Specials would do the trick.

    Regarding Heliar "softness", my 21cm Heliar shows a very clear lack of contrast (perceived softness) when shot head to head against a modern multicoated 210mm plasmat, or even my ultra-sharp single coated 210mm Xenar f/6.1. In fact, the Heliar has visibly less contrast than the modern optics from f/4.5 through f/11 and maybe even f/16.

    Alternatively, thinking of 210mm's as a portrait focal length could lead a person to an inexpensive Schneider Symmar Convertible f/5.6. The reason I bring this up is that ultimately it is final print quality that will win the day.

    Some people find it easy to start with something nice and contrasty and then find a pleasing way to mute the tones. Other folks like starting with a less contrasty portrait. I think you can end up with what you are looking for by taking either approach. You'd just need to "work at it" a bit.

    One last monkey wrench in your portrait plans: A friend doesn't like 210mm for portraits. He say's it's too flat. He likes 180mm instead. He says it's a nice tradeoff between the "roundness" of 150mm and the "flatness" of 210mm. YMMWV.



    Quote Originally Posted by Thomas Vaehrmann
    ...the Heliar is a fine lens not only for portrait. But it isn't very soft nor very fast...

  2. #12
    Sheldon N's Avatar
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    Re: 210mm Heliar or....

    So was there ever a Heliar made in the 180-190mm range?

  3. #13

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    Re: 210mm Heliar or....

    Yes. 18cm Heliars were built.

    If you really want to go nuts, get one each 15cm, 18cm, 21cm, 24cm, and 30cm. There were, of course, other focal lengths made. But we're talking fun lenses in shutters that work on 4x5... and have plenty of "voodoo".

    Quote Originally Posted by Sheldon N
    So was there ever a Heliar made in the 180-190mm range?
    Last edited by Christopher Perez; 11-Aug-2006 at 10:15.

  4. #14
    All metric sizes to 24x30 Ole Tjugen's Avatar
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    Re: 210mm Heliar or....

    Even the 12cm on my 6.5x9 Bergheil can be used on 4x5" - the corners go soft, but sometimes that can be used to advantage.

  5. #15
    the Docter is in Arne Croell's Avatar
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    Re: 210mm Heliar or....

    Quote Originally Posted by Sheldon N
    So was there ever a Heliar made in the 180-190mm range?
    Yes, as Christopher said. It came in a Compur 2 shutter. The range he quotes are the Heliars that were available coated and in shutter after WWII. There were 3 more available only in barrel (360, 420 and 480mm) and coated, plus the Universal-Heliars. The uncoated pre-WWII line of Heliars had even more models and included an f/3.5 series.

  6. #16

    Re: 210mm Heliar or....

    Quote Originally Posted by Sheldon N
    So was there ever a Heliar made in the 180-190mm range?
    I have an early (serial no. 109605) uncoated 7-inch f/4.5 Heliar set in a barrel and mounted on a 3x4 Graflex D lensboard. Here's a scan from a photo shot with the lens:

    http://www.pbase.com/sandersm/image/28572673

    I'm not shooting in medium format any more. If someone needs this lens, drop me a note and make me an offer.

    Sanders McNew
    sanders@mcnew.net

  7. #17
    Sheldon N's Avatar
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    Re: 210mm Heliar or....

    The more I think about this, the more I'm begining to believe that it may be a little bit of a strain on my poor Wista to mount a lens large/long enough to do what I want. I'm considering adding an 8x10 with a packard shutter to use for portaiture, especially tempting since I've got the possibility of acquiring a 14" f/4.5 Heliar in barrel for $130.

    Hmmm, decisions, decisions. Maybe I could stick the Heliar and Packard on a cheapo 4x5 monorail...

  8. #18
    All metric sizes to 24x30 Ole Tjugen's Avatar
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    Re: 210mm Heliar or....

    Quote Originally Posted by Sheldon N
    Hmmm, decisions, decisions. Maybe I could stick the Heliar and Packard on a cheapo 4x5 monorail...
    My solution to the same quandary was to buy a pre-anniversary Speed Graphic with working shutter. It cost only $56, since there was no lens.

    By a slight stroke of luck I had an iris lensmount, which barely fit on the lensboard. So now that camera can use any barrel lens uo to about 280mm focal length and 6cm diameter.

    I also happened to have a box full of lensboards, most of which are now redundant.

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