Hypercat vs Pyrocat MC

[Don Hutton]

"It is in no one's interst to post faulty data for their own developer".

"Sandy has made a lot of theoretical claims for my developer that are not borne out in testing, or in actual use."

Strange: I know of not one single person - apart obviously from yourself Jay - who uses Hypercat, yet I personally have met many (in excess of 20) and know of many, many more people who use Pyrocat HD and are very satisfied with it. If both of your claims above are true, Jay, then the only conlusion that one could draw from the widespread traction of Pyrocat HD and the lack of traction for Hypercat is that in fact you have published faulty data about Hypercat!

[Jay DeFehr]

Brian,

do you mean D-76, D-76H, Divided D-76, or how about E-76?

Jay

[Don Hutton]

Actually Jay, I know that my testing using Pyrocat HD does give me slightly differenty results to Sandy's testing - although I am still 100% satisfied. I am not stupid enough to expect my results to be identical to his, because I know that out test process is significantly different - I use a Jobo and he uses tubes which are rotated considerably slower than the slowest setting on any Jobo.

Our processes are a little different: I therefore accept slight differences in results to be largely attributable to these differences which is why I made the suggestion that what you published here is without merit unless you simply do identical testing. To refute any claims about your "process" you could instead have simply published that data which you claimed you had. Instead you launch into your usual low-level tirade...

And please don't bother with your data now thanks - I know enough to not waste my own time thanks.

[Jay DeFehr]

"It is in no one's interst to post faulty data for their own developer".

"Sandy has made a lot of theoretical claims for my developer that are not borne out in testing, or in actual use."

Strange: I know of not one single person - apart obviously from yourself Jay - who uses Hypercat, yet I personally have met many (in excess of 20) and know of many, many more people who use Pyrocat HD and are very satisfied with it. If both of your claims above are true, Jay, then the only conlusion that one could draw from the widespread traction of Pyrocat HD and the lack of traction for Hypercat is that in fact you have published faulty data about Hypercat!

Don,

unfortunately, both your information and logic are flawed. I'll concede that there are many more users of Pyrocat HD than of Hypercat, but by your logic, Sandy must have published faulty data about Pyrocat HD or there would be more users of his developer than D-76. the formula for Pyrocat HD was published about a decade ago, while the new Hypercat formula was published a few months ago. Give it time.

Jay

[Jay DeFehr]

And please don't bother with your data now thanks - I know enough to not waste my own time thanks.

That's what I thought.

Jay

[Kirk Keyes]

IWhat About Intellectual Property Right
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Sandy - Doesn't fair use come into play here? Afterall, Jay credits you as the originator of the graph.

Anyway, Jay, you really should do side by side testing yourself when trying to make comparisons.

[Jay DeFehr]

Sandy - Doesn't fair use come into play here? Afterall, Jay credits you as the originator of the graph.

Anyway, Jay, you really should do side by side testing yourself when trying to make comparisons.

I have done side-by-side testing. I'll post that info in a new thread.

Jay

[Don Hutton]

"unfortunately, both your information and logic are flawed."

!!!!! Yes Jay - I know the information is flawed - they are direct quotes from you! Actually, if you understood logic and English, you'd realise that there is no flaw in the inference. The fact that the logic makes no sense to you proves that one or both of your statements are simply untrue.

[Jay DeFehr]

Don,

your flawed information was in regard to the number of Hypercat users. Your flawed logic was in your conclusions. You suggested that the only reason for one developer to have fewer users than another is that the formulator published faulty data for his own developer. I made no such claim. I said that Sandy had made faulty claims about Hypercat, which is a much different thing. It is no one's interest to post faulty data for their own developer, but if one wants to dissuade others from using another's developer, making false claims, or posting faulty data for the other's developer might do the trick. Get it? I didn't think it was a difficult concept to grasp, but perhaps I've overestimated you. Better luck next time.

Jay

[Don Hutton]

Here's my closing tip Jay:

From your reply to Jorge:
"I'm not sure how the BTZS softwatre calculates B+F"

It doesn't - you measure it. Your grasp of what you are doing with your BTZS testing does not seem convincing to me that I should put any faith in any of the "numbers" you produce from your testing!