Selecting a 4X5 View Camera for the First Time...

[Al D]

I'm looking to get into Large Format with a 4x5 camera in the coming several months.

Even though I have not used a View Camera before I have read about some basic view camera concepts (i.e. about camera movements, bellows extenion, and the like). At least to the extent that I believe I can articulate what it is I consider essential and what is just a nice-to-have.

Here's what I consider essential:
- I'll probably be using lens focal lengths from 90 mm to 250 or 270 mm. The latter would be used for portraiture and I would expect to need to focus down to about 6 or 7 feet for head & shoulder shots. I expect that means I'm going to need close to about 400 mm of bellows to be available (even if only through a purchased bellows extension).

- Portability is fairly important. I will walk around with this thing, perhaps 2 or 3 miles in a day when I'm shooting monuments. A weight up to or around 7 lbs is acceptable but at the very least it needs to be able to fit in a reasonably deep backpack. I can live with requiring a few minutes of setup or teardown time (this is, after all, LF so that's part of the fun).

- Rigidity. Fairly important here as I will need to rack out the bellows a fair distance (see above). However, that's more than likely to be for inside portrait work. I'd also be interested in hearing what tripod/head combination can help mitigate camera shake concerns. Plus, assuming I've done everything by the book I don't want a gentle breeze ruining a sharp photo in as much as I can prevent it.

- Availability of bag bellows (or similar) is a nice to have. If it isn't, the camera should allow at least a bit of movement with a 75 mm lens with the available bellows (yeah, *that's* probably asking for a alot).

- Ability to mount a 6x9 or 6x12 roll film back. I expect that I will, especially initially, do a fair bit of shooting with 6x9 because it's a hell of a lot less expensive to make mistakes on that stuff than 80 cents/sheet sheet film. Of course, I've already figured out that roll film backs are, by far, the most ridiculously expensive accessyories in the LF world.

Except for the absurd 4" bellows extension that ToyoView sells for $500 or thereabouts.

Given the above it looks like I'm on the cusp of crossover between Field Cameras and Monorail Cameras (well, isn't everybody?) With a very little bit of research I'm sort of sizing up the following as the leading candidates:

- Walker SF 4X5: Ugly as sin, yes, but verything about the spec. sheet looks really good except the absence of a Fresnel focusing lens. BUT they are a bit pricey new ($1,750 or so), aren't available on the used market, have questionable resale because of same, and with very limited distribution I'd be plenty worried if a problem surfaced...

-Tachihara 4X5: It has the needed bellows extension and the light weight is nice BUT many have commented it's degree of available movement is not as good as advertised, and it lacks rigidity.

- Shen Hao 4x5: This looks really good on paper. Both wide angle bellows and a recessed lens board are available, I *might* be able to get by with 360mm of bellows, and they even have a 6x12 roll film back that costs $100 less than the Calumet C2N and an available Fresnel lens. I've heard the rigidity isn't bad for a "woodie" either and the fit and finish is actually pretty good.

- Zone VI: Good bellows length but I've heard it doesn't fare well with WA lenses. Fit and finish tends to vary a lot by sample or so I'm told. Rigidity isn't considered to be very good either.

- Toyo 45CF: Light and rigid. Just a shade too little bellows extension (without buying an absolutely absurdly expensive 4 " bellows inser) , no real rear movements, can barely use a 90 mm on it, and no bag bellows.

I've heard very good things about Canham field cameras but unless used samples are readily available for $1,500 or slightly less - I won't be considering them.

Very few monorail candidates. None, actually, unless a Sinar A1, F, or F1 can be made to fit in a backpack or one can assemble/disassemble them in under 10 minutes.

I'm willing to buy used. I'm not at all a brand snob. Having said that, I do want a product that the manufacturer (or at least the distributor) is willing to stand behind if I have questions or need a reference for a repair. This eliminates Wisner (too many horror stories) I expect.

My apologies for a lengthy post. Any help is appreciated.

-Al

[Bobby Sandstrom]

I own the Tachihara. I owned an arca swiss. I LOVE the Tachihara. It packs a lot of punch for very little money. It is NOT lacking in rigidity and has more movements than most will ever use. I love it so much I bought the 8x10 too! I'm selling my wehman 8x10 because of it. I use an arca b1 ball head on a gitzo tripod. All the support you need even with my 8x10. It's fast, flexible, easy to setup quickly. Hope this helps.

[Scott Fleming]

http://www.largeformatphotography.info/vx125.html

http://largeformatphotography.info/lfforum/topic/504488.html

[Scott Fleming]

Good pictures:

http://www.toyoview.co.jp/vx125.htm

[Brian Vuillemenot]

My vote would be for the Shen-Hao. I recently picked one up as a backup camera, and am very impressed with the rigidity, finish, and workmanship. I'd have to say it's as good as (if not better than) that of several American made wood field cameras I've used, for about a third of the price. A big advantage is the availability of the low cost multi-format panoramic back for the Shen-Hao which can shoot 6X17, 6X12, or 6X9. Although the overall apearance of this accessory is somewhat crude, it works fine and lets you shoot several different formats on roll film, which you indicated was how you wanted to start out. A bag bellows is available for the Shen-Hao, although it can handle a 75 mm lens without this accessory and still get some movements. The main limitation of the Shen-Hao is that the bellows only extends enough to use up to about a 300 mm lens. Of course, you can always get a telephoto design if you want to shoot in the 400-450 mm range. If you need a lens to go with it, Badger Graphics sells a LF photography start up kit with the Shen-Hao, a 150 mm Rodenstock Apo-Sironar lens, and several film holders and accessories (no, I don't work for Badger, I'm simply a satisfied customer). Best of luck with you LF expereince, and let us know what you decide on!

[Emmanuel BIGLER]

Very few monorail candidates. None, actually, unless a Sinar A1, F, or F1 can be made to fit in a backpack or one can assemble/disassemble them in under 10 minutes.

None, really ?
Have you ever heard about the new Arca Swiss 4x5" line of view cameras with 141mm standards ?
For example the 4x5" F-line 'field' compact, tapered bellows 110mm->141mm, with the folding rail, no need to disassemble the camera.

[Ole Tjugen]

Another monorail candidate is the old Linhof Color. Mine fits nicely in a small Lowepro S&F Rover Lite, along with 5 lenses, 10 holders and all the little extra bits&pieces like light meters, dark cloth, changing bag, coffee thermos and so on. A 42cm rail is plenty for me.
I have no 75mm lens, but I use a 90mm on a flat lensboard.

[Emmanuel BIGLER]

Another monorail candidate is the old Linhof Color.
Agreed with Ole. Those view camera defined as a Linhof-Technika-on-a-monorail, are very affordable on the used market. In the same spirit we could add its successor, the Kardan-color, very similar, but with a rail that splits into two parts and some additional features like vertical shift at the back.
Information here :www.largeformatphotography.info/linhof/kardan-color.html

[Ole Tjugen]

After having recommended thinking about the Linhof Color, I have to admit that if I were to buy a 4x5" camera today, it would probably be the same as my 5x7" camera: Gandolfi Traditional. Or maybe I would just buy a reducing back for the 5x7"...

[Phong]

Just a couple of comments:

With a focal length of 270 mm and object distance of 7 feet (21333 mm), you don't need anywhere near 400 mm of bellows. The math works out to 309 mm (about 12 ") of bellows.

I would not buy a roll film back just to learn shooting 4x5, especially if you shoot black and white and process your own film. For the price of a roll film back, you a "waste" a lot of film and I bet that when you are done with that amount of film, you will have learned quite a bit about 4x5 photography, including 4x5 specific stuff like sheet film handling and developing, and composing in the 4x5 format which you would not if you use a roll film back.

While you don't see too many Walker 4x5 on the used market, I would not worry about resale value. The few that I have seen get sold pretty fast and for very good prices. Walker actually has an excellent reputation for support. Long-term support is more of an issue, as with any very small shop.



Given your stated goals and implied budget of $1500, the Shen Hao would be my pick from your camera list, though I would also look more closely at the Toho FC-45X, for which the most serious hold back for me is the way you switch the back between vertical and horizontal orientations.

Those are just my opinions. Good luck and have fun,