Wisner Manufacturing

[Robert McClure]

Any new information on Wisner Manufacturing above and beyond the Wisner web site info?

My impression has been that other manufacturers have seemed to offer fewer lines, or at least manufacture one line at a time. Sort of like biting off no more than they could chew at one time.

Mr. Wisner seemed to offer quite a number of different lines (twenty-something, wasn't it?), models, etc. I cannot imagine what it would have been like to manage all of that and try to still still do it well. Geezz!

My further impression was that the company moved to a smaller, less expensive facility, settled all current/in-house obligations and probably tried to improve its cash picture.

Next, if I were involved (thankfully, I 'm not), I'd change some business practices - like not taking big deposits, and promising only what I could deliver within a certain time. Like the other folks seem to do.

Did Mr. Wisner fall victim to trying to be all things to all LF photographers? Try to get too big?
Try to be "Mr. Everything?"

I don't really know the answers and was curious about who knew what.

[Brian Ellis]

Mr. Wisner is putting on a large format workshop here in the Tampa-St. Petersburg area, some time in November I think. That would indicate to me that he perhaps isn't devoting full time to getting the company back on its feet. I don't know anything beyond that. I don't plan to attend the workshop but if anyone is interested let me know and I'll provide detailed information, it's about $350 for a weekend so it isn't cheap.

[Oren Grad]

The Wisner website was updated within the past week to push the earliest date for new orders back to Dec 1. No other changes, but at least it indicates that somebody is still at least semi-conscious there.

[Donald Brewster]

z-z-z-z-z-z-z-z-z-z. Either the Wisner camera works for you or it doesn't. If it does, buy it. If it doesn't, buy someone else's camera. I use a camera made by a company that went out of business. It is called a Deardorff. It doesn't make the camera any less useful, and there isn't any Deardorff factory service either.

[Michael Kadillak]

Michael:

Not a silly question at all. The reason that your time talking to Wisner directly is energy questionably spent is because three people independently asking the same question within days of each other will get three different answers. Analogistically like pulling the handle on a slot machine. This is not the case with folks like Dick Phillips or Keith Canham who are truthful and as honest as one could possibly ask for.

However, getting the answer to your question is a rather simple task. First, the right person needs to have a direct conversation with the former shop manager that is supposed to take over the new operations and see if they worked out a "deal" for her continued commitment to the new venue. If she is not on board or has pursued other employment opportunities a remake of the company is not going to happen and the lid to the coffin needs to be nailed on and the organ player needs to get to the church. Secondly a simple amount of private investigation is in order by those nearby that may be dealers and have an incentive to know what is the plan. One could easily check out in person the new building that is supposd to house the new operation in MA. Is it completed and what size is it? Talk to the neighbors about what went into the building - woodworking equipment or antique organs or furniture? Then let us know.

The longer the period of uncertainty as to kick starting the potential business plan for the new Wisner company, the less likely it will matter as Shen Hao will be hitting the market shortly with a ULF camera that will sequester a good portion of the current demand with a tremendous price point in the business and no funny stuff.

Should be interesting how this plays out.

Cheers!

[Eric Rose]

I'm so tired of this.

[steve simmons]

There are several new cameras, from 4x5 up, that will be hitting the market in the next few months. Richard Ritter has a new 7x17 and there are others in the pipeline.

steve simmons

[Kerry L. Thalmann]

The longer the period of uncertainty as to kick starting the potential business plan for the new Wisner company, the less likely it will matter as Shen Hao will be hitting the market shortly with a ULF camera that will sequester a good portion of the current demand with a tremendous price point in the business and no funny stuff.

Michael,

There have been rumors circulating for almost a year that a 7x17 Shen Hao will be hitting the market "any day now". Nobody has yet seen such a camera and there are no specs on the Shen Hao web site. Do you have any up-to-date information on the expected dates when the Shen-Hao ULF cameras will actually be available? Any specs on their ULF cameras?

As far as the price goes, don't look for the Shen Hao ULF cameras to be priced as attractively as originally indicated. Early price quotes from the factory listed a price of the 7x17 Shen Hao as $2700. Emile de Leon provided an updated price of $3700 about a month and a half ago. That's about $200 higher than the most recent price shown on the Wisner web site for a 7x17 Technical (although the Wisner prices will probably go up if/when they start taking new orders) . It's also more than the expected prices for both Jim Chinn's and Richard Ritter's soon to be released 7x17 models. It appears there are several manufacturers poised to fill any void in the ULF market created by Wisner's prolonged absence. Shen Hao may indeed be one of the companies entering the ULF market, but they do not appear to be the price leader (like they are in the 4x5 field camera market). How much of the ULF market share they garner is yet to be seen. With other Shen Hao products, their primary appeal is the low prices. If they lack that advantage in the ULF market, they may have a tough time competing with the other new manufacturers. If their ULF cameras are built using the same materials as their smaller format models, they will also be very significantly heavier than the competition. While a lot of folks will tolerate the extra weight if the price is attractive, far fewer will pay more money for a heavier camera with a shorter bellows (again, assuming their ULF models will be similar in design and materials to their 5x12 and other current cameras).

I'm not trying to bash Shen Hao here - just pointing out that it's far from foregone conclusion that they will "own" the ULF market if Wisner falters. They are just one of several who will be vying for that market share. The more the merrier. Such competition is good for us all.

Kerry

[Michael Kadillak]

I understand completely Kerry. All I was wanting to convey is that the fact that other camera makers are attempting to find a way to enter this domain and supplant or compete with suppliers and that is as you said a very good thing. Where Shen Hao balances weight, bellows length and price are yet to be determined. Emile indicated that at the end of the month more information should be available, but we will have to wait and see. I believe that Sandy King has provided some recommendations to Shen Hao on the 5x12 camera and it sounds like they are receptive to advice they feel comes from respectable sources.

From my personal point of view, anything that tips the scale under the weight of my 35# Wisner 11x14 Tech Field would be a good thing. Two days in the field with this camera is equal to one day at the gym. At least it feels like it.

If Wisner did come back I feel that he would price his cameras just slightly below Canham and that would diminish his lower priced incentive that got him to this point. I personally think that the door is already closed and I wish Ron the best in his future sailing, writing books or lecturing.

Onward!

[Ted Harris]

Richard Ritter's 7x17 weighs around 10 pounds. The 'chasis' can esily be converted to 11x14 too and it will also be very light.