Alternative Center Filters for Rodenstock 75/4.5 Grandagon N?

[Drew Wiley]

I was told Rodenstock never made their own center filters, and that they are (or were) private-labeled Schneider. That would certainly explain their relatively high mark-up pricing. Some of these lenses were very similarly designed. For example, the same CF I once use for a Schneider 120 SA also works perfectly (fit as well as falloff correction) for my Nikon 90/4.5. But I don't have any experience with the newer Heliopan CF's.

[Bob Salomon]

I was told Rodenstock never made their own center filters, and that they are (or were) private-labeled Schneider. That would certainly explain their relatively high mark-up pricing. Some of these lenses were very similarly designed. For example, the same CF I once use for a Schneider 120 SA also works perfectly (fit as well as falloff correction) for my Nikon 90/4.5. But I don't have any experience with the newer Heliopan CF's.

You were told wrong. Rodenstock does make their own center filters so stop spreading false information.

Here is the latest information on Rodenstock’s current technology for making center filters that work by absorption rather then reflection thus eliminating strange color cast effects fro other types with shiny buildings in the sun. They have been making these for 3 or 4 years.

[Drew Wiley]

I didn't say "does" Bob. I said "did" and made it perfectly clear this was something I was told with reference to a particular era. And by informing me that a new method has been in use only a few years, you yourself are implying it highly likely that most of the Rodenstock center filters already out there are something else other than the latest and greatest. Subcontracting specific products to competitive manufacturers who can do a particular task better is rather common among German manufacturers in particular, though certainly not limited to them. And other than the brand label on the rim or box, would it even be possible to distinguish between a past Schneider and Rodenstock center filter engineered for an equivalent specification? Even Fuji and Nikon didn't make their own center filters, though there is obviously vast lens and filter manufacturing capacity in Japan. You tell me, Bob. I've been in retail stores with huge large format and filter inventories during the heyday of such gear, and why would I spend a couple hundreds dollars more for a filter under one brand name that looked identical in every respect to another? I'm not saying that's the case now.

[Bob Salomon]

I didn't say "does" Bob. I said "did" and made it perfectly clear this was something I was told with reference to a particular era. And by informing me that a new method has been in use only a few years, you yourself are implying it highly likely that most of the Rodenstock center filters already out there are something else other than the latest and greatest. Subcontracting specific products to competitive manufacturers who can do a particular task better is rather common among German manufacturers in particular, though certainly not limited to them. And other than the brand label on the rim or box, would it even be possible to distinguish between a past Schneider and Rodenstock center filter engineered for an equivalent specification? Even Fuji and Nikon didn't make their own center filters, though there is obviously vast lens and filter manufacturing capacity in Japan. You tell me, Bob. I've been in retail stores with huge large format and filter inventories during the heyday of such gear, and why would I spend a couple hundreds dollars more for a filter under one brand name that looked identical in every respect to another? I'm not saying that's the case now.

Drew, Rodenstock has been making their center filters for decades. Even during the period of time in the 80s when Schneider went into bankruptcy and the successor company, under Mandermann, liquidated whole divisions of the company. You were told incorrectly!

[Dan Fromm]

Longer than that, Bob. Rodenstock made their first center filter before WW I.

[Bob Salomon]

Longer than that, Bob. Rodenstock made their first center filter before WW I.

I believe that that one used a similar technology to their latest ones, a sandwich of a concave and convex glasses. Except that one was colored on one glass and the current ones are grey on one glass.

[Drew Wiley]

I'll take your word for it, Bob. I was merely implying that for a given generation, there might not be a helluva lot of difference between brands. Nobody would ever know that I use an 82mm Schneider CF on a Nikon, for instance. It works perfectly. Color neutrality, complete transparency, resistance to flare, and proper correction of falloff are what count. Any improvement beyond, like the one you cite relative to specular highlights, would indeed be a newer innovation. But I have no functional interest in primitive versions, though this might be interesting from a historical perspective. In fact, I rarely shoot true wide angle lenses at all any more. They were nice for architectural interiors. But that kind of work is now mostly being done digitally. Everyone wants their pictures delivered yesterday - perhaps the only redeeming quality of digital except a tad more portability.

[Bob Salomon]

I'll take your word for it, Bob. I was merely implying that for a given generation, there might not be a helluva lot of difference between brands. Nobody would ever know that I use an 82mm Schneider CF on a Nikon, for instance. It works perfectly. Color neutrality, complete transparency, resistance to flare, and proper correction of falloff are what count. Any improvement beyond, like the one you cite relative to specular highlights, would indeed be a newer innovation. But I have no functional interest in primitive versions, though this might be interesting from a historical perspective. In fact, I rarely shoot true wide angle lenses at all any more. They were nice for architectural interiors. But that kind of work is now mostly being done digitally. Everyone wants their pictures delivered yesterday - perhaps the only redeeming quality of digital except a tad more portability.

Shoot a sky scraper with aluminum cladding with a wide angle with your center filter on a sunny day and don’t be surprised if you don’t get a magenta shift towards the top of the building. The Rodenstock center filters don’t do that.

[Drew Wiley]

I'm out shooting tall things quite a bit, Bob; but granite spires and redwood trees aren't made with aluminum yet. I have nothing against urban photography,
but don't gravitate toward getting my gear trampled or going nuts trying to find parking spaces. My occasional shots of downtown SF are usually done with
a very long telephoto from clear across the water. I just got back from the Oakland Airport, and while stuck in traffic up on the fwy interchange was trying
to spot exactly where the new foot trail on the Bay Bridge originates. It goes from the Eastshore State Park clear to Treasure Island, and opens up some very
interesting new opportunities to photograph both SF and the Port of Oakland. But I'll wait until late fall when the air is clear, and maybe try then.

[acapela]

Thanks to those who provided RELEVANT, USEFUL information in response to my query.

At this point, this thread appears to have been hijacked and has become yet another vacuous flame war (a tradition on the part of one particular poster to this thread that goes back 20+ years, to the Usenet era). I have unsubscribed to all my threads, and am leaving these forums, hopefully never to return. Blech.