In situation 2, just incident meter and use the exposure.
In situation 1, if you're into "expose for the shadows and develop for the highlights" you'd set exposure based on the incident reading taken while in the shadows of the scene. Some people would then read or estimate the sun brightness and make a note to develop accordingly. The other option is to use a compensating developer and tmax film and not worry about the highlights.
There have been mentions of placing the incident meter in shadow, then also in sunlight and figuring from there. No harm, but that's more of ratio metering; incident meters usually have a dome which is supposed to properly compensate for shadow and highlight when pointed at the camera from the subject. Some meters come with an optional flat translucent disk (or a dome which retracts) and is intended for measuring lighting ratios.
I had a situation only the other day where I was photographing a building, 3/4 of the building was in shade and the other 1/4 was in direct sunlight. I am guessing that in this situation, I should have put the dome of the light meter on the sunny side and maybe open up 2 stops ?Originally Posted by Jac@stafford.net
I don’t think incident meters are best suited to zone system methods. I use one quite often when out and about. It’s good for scenes where the overall lighting is quite even, and you want a quick reading. I read the instructions for one of the models I’ve owned, possibly Gossen? If I recall correctly, it suggested that, where the main subject was brighter than average, you open up one or two stops, and where darker, you close down one or two. I also use an incident flash meter in studio situations. There are more sophisticated methods of using them in this type of situations. I have some books that describe these methods;
The Photographers Studio Manual by Michael Freeman
Perfect Exposure from theory to practice by Roger Hicks and Frances Schultz
Learning to Light by R. Hicks and F. Schultz
These might be of some interest, especially for indoor work, although Perfect Exposure covers all situations.
Alex
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
Actually, you should have used a spot meter, then you would not be guessing as to what to put in what zone. The Zone dial pretty much tells you what is doable and what isn't. The film may not have enough latitude for the scene and you may need to expand or contract the tonal range. But without a spot meter you’re guessing in the dark or asking a bunch of “experts” who may or may not really know and could be making up scenarios in their heads. Some people like to make this way more difficult than it is! L
Last edited by Luis-F-S; 4-Jul-2018 at 15:36.
Good Morning Ian.
First, some thoughts for you. If you're shooting black and white negative the film has some tolerance of 'incorrect' exposure. In printing we can vary the paper grade, and use selective dodging and burning to recover highlights or relieve shadows. When I use 120 folders, or any of my manual 35mm cameras I don't carry a meter. I sunny 16 everything, and can't think when I last had an unprintable negative.
I don't do any colour now, but when I shot 5x4 Velvia (which is much less tolerant of exposure error) I used a Sekonic incident meter without problem. And, as stated, flash metering is incident, and nobody would suggest you can't take successful images by flash due to lack of spot metering. How others work may not be right for you, what matters is achieving a result which satisfies you.
To take your scenario 2. Just put the incident meter in front of main subject, dome towards camera, and go with the suggested reading. With North facing window you'll have low contrast lighting. The meter will do it's best to make sure any object within the scene which is 18% grey falls on ZV and the highlights and shadows will fall comfortably around it.
Scenario 1- Imagine taking two incident readings. One in the area of full sun, the other in open shade. They'll be different by about 2 stops, and both are correct. Each reading is doing the job of placing your 18% grey on ZV for that degree of illumination. You have to decide what you want from that image. If the main interest is the shaded area, go with that. The highlights just might overexpose, but the latitude of film will probably save you. If the highlight area is more important go with that and accept lower shadow values. Or, split the difference; for years the majority of photographs were taken on cameras using reflective metering which averaged the scene.
Here you'll find plenty of advocates for spot-metering, but that really comes into its own when you have complete control of your process. Well used, a spot meter will give you the brightness range of the scene. If you've previously calculated developing times for Normal, High and Low contrast scenes you can then use film speed, exposure, and development time to make a negative that reflects what you want the scene to look like.
However, you also need to really grasp what the spot meter does; the meter 'thinks' whatever you point it at is ZV. Back to scenario 1- even metering within just the shaded area of your scene could produce a range of exposure readings depending on the tone of the area you point the meter at. Same within the bright area.
You could think of your incident meter as giving you the equivalent of pointing your spot meter at an area of ZV in each area of that scene. In fact, if your usual method was to try and find a ZV tone to meter from, the incident meter will be just as effective. Perhaps even more reliable, if you have difficulty deciding which area to meter from to find ZV.
Good luck.
Morning Colin.
Thanks for the detailed explanation, much appreciated.
If the important information of the scene is illuminated by the bright sun, would you meter in the sun and then possibly open up 2 stops to move that away from zoneV or just go with the reading
This may vary, but normally we have more than 2 stops, 3 is common and sometimes we have 4.
The Sunny 16 rule recipe says 4 stops: f/16, ISO 100, 1/100s for sunlit area, but f/4 for open shade https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sunny_16_rule
The two scenarios are quite different. The street scene is relatively high contrast. The still life with north window light is relatively low contrast.
No matter the contrast, the film capability and scene lighting need to be understood, primarily through experience (accumulated trial and error).
I use the Zone System as a very loose idea. I recommend avoiding an overly rigid adherence to it. Read the websites of Sekonic, Profoto and PocketWizard. AdoramaTV has some good videos on lighting and metering.
I would meter the scenes in these ways:
Street: from the camera position: spot meter the shadows, spot meter the highlights, choose the exposure based on experience and desired aesthetic.
Still life: from the subject position: incident meter with dome facing the north window on the highlight side of the subject, incident meter with dome facing away from window on the shadow side of the subject, incident meter with the dome facing the camera, directly between the camera and subject. Choose the exposure based on experience and desired aesthetic.
In both cases, it's common to have chosen the aperture, independent of lighting, based on desired depth of field, lens choice and subject to camera distance. This leaves only shutter speed to select, based on the metering measurements, experience and desired aesthetic. Film development and subsequent positive image manipulation are the remaining controls to produce the desired aesthetic. Get out there and shoot!
This addresses the points well, in my view:
https://www.sekonic.com/united-state...rmat-film.aspx
The article addresses examples of metering higher contrast and lower contrast scenes, with 4x5 film.
Posting Permissions
Reply With Quote
Bookmarks